[scionfairy]

Originally posted by Wildfire Girl scionfairy at your Hurly/Claire implications.

What?? Big guys need loving too!

I've been shipping them since the first eppy... and hey, who did Claire wake up by during the piggies on parade march through camp that one night?

[BehrItAll]

I don't see why the groups have to split like its the be all end all. I think that the groups should alternate every day as to who stays in the cave and who stays on the beach. And if help comes someone goes to fetch the group in the cave. Although I think they are doomed and will never be rescued. I think its like a Bermuda triangle type place where they can never be found. But anyway...

I said in the 1st episdoe that Sun and Jin could be part of the Koren Mafia and this episode confirmed it for me. It was so sad how Jin was so nice in the begining and then he became such an ass. Poor Sun should have went to the car. Although the moment when he gave her the flower was very sweet.

When they were running from the bees and Kate found the corpses I jumped and screamed It scared the $#!* out of me

I was sad not to see Claire, Boone and Shannon.

[Teriberri21]

Okay I"ve been trying to figure out this since the episode ended...and maybe I'm overlooking something really stupidly..but uhm I'm confused. Why were the Korean couple in Australia? I thought they were in Korea the whole time...then suddenly they're in line at an australian airport...


I am a Kate Jack shipper so I was so loving this episode ...Hurley is great too I love his comic relief! especially that "short walk" comment OI I can totally relate, I'm not exactly a physically fit person (understatment of the year) so I figured...walking a mile and three quarters wouldn't be too bad... we got to walk at our own pace etc....I kinda forgot to figure in that we were walking at about 6,000ft up in elevation and along the hike went up another 1,000ft. all in all...it wasn't a "short walk"

I think the shore people and cave people need to have a symbiotic relationship, it'd work better if both could work out a deal like have some people maybe rotate if they want or some one from shore and someone from the caves could help bring the water out....in return, cave people get the shore people to watch out for recues...

hm I hope it's charlie's story next week...I'm really interested in what happened to the band after Locke's comment...

all in all great episode

[tangled STARR]

Originally posted by coolove This is something that's been going on in the Emilie related threads... Anyone worried here that Em's name wasn't listed in the credits tonight?

She was added as a series regular after the pilot was shot (in September I believe?). This episode was probably filmed sometime before then which may explain why she's not in the opening credits.

Originally posted by scionfairy I'm thinking she must have went with Jack's crew.. you know, stay with the doctor.. (and *cough* *cough* Hurley)

No way, it's Charlie and Claire, 4 Eva!!

Wildfire Girl, if there's one thing that I know that I've already made up my mind about not liking is how every single episode opens with the close up shot of the respective character's eye opening. (Except for the the second half of the pilot - and only 'cause it was the second half of the pilot.) I don't think I can last another fourteen/fifteen episodes or so with that shot. While it does lend to continuity to the show and to the characters, at the same time, in some episodes it does not particularly feel warranted to me.

In Fair Verona, I could not agree more. The whole Jin/Sun relationship is completely heartbreaking. We know that he loves her except he didn't seem to know how to go about it other than the proper Asian way. I also have to admit that it was interesting to see that Jin was rebellious (of sorts, anyway) more than just in the pilot, but back to even when she and Jin were dating.

And Asian leads totally rule. Heh.

Also, on that note, is anyone else bugged that Hurley keeps calling them "Chinese" - or is that just me 'cause I'm Asian as well?

BehrItAll, I was thinking the same thing. I honestly do not see why they could not rotate shifts; however, as someone mentioned earlier about Kate and her fear of settling down, I'm sure it's a character trait that we have yet to discover about the remaining people. I think with Sayid, both his comment about not giving up and the picture that Claire found give us excellent clues as to why he believes staying on the beach is much better than going into the caves - he may believe going into the caves is just sentencing one to death.

Teriberri21, I thought they were in Korea, too - even though their houses and surroundings actually looked more Chinese than Korean. My guess is that perhaps their families immigrated there. Parts of Australia, the east coast I believe?, are more populated with Asian population than others, and this may be where they were living at the time.

[Dommie]

that they lived in Australia but like here there are areas that are more populated by thier nationalities...like Little Italy, Chinatown. Jin must have been an enforcer for Sun's father. Maybe thats why she hated that he was going to go work for him, and her rebelling when she was younger; and later when she thought she might leave him. I the flower part too. It seems that her friend must be thinking that she did get away...and that Jin died on the place crash.

When i started to watch this episode the first thing that popped into my head is that the plane had to have those black boxes so well known. I don't know if the boxes have some sort of GSP thing going as well..but i would now assume if the folks on the island's have the latest cell phones...that they would every once in awhile turn them on as well.

I picked up the TV Guide that has Jack, Charley and Kate on the cover. Has some small spoilage and some tidbits of the actors. Like Matthew Fox has something in common with the original winner of Survivor reality show. He likes to walk around naked. I didn't know that the actor who plays Charlie was in the movies Lord of the Rings...HellO..now of course i can see it.

At the end when Kate states to Jack's parting remark of she knows where is he if he needs her. I am assuming she was stating that it goes both ways. Because she wants him to need her...just as much as she likes talking to him.

AND ITA about the shifts!!! why aren't they thinking that way.

[SydneySummers]

~*Well I was sad to see Kate not go with Jack. I think that Jack's idea of moving into the caves was the best idea. I don't see why they could not have a few people at the beach. Trade off and on keeping the fire going.
I loved Charlie and Lock in this ep. Loved the Kate and Jack banter. Charlie's comments about Kate and Jack kept me laughing the whole time! I love,love,love Hurley! I think Claire must be with the group at the caves and we just didn't see her!

[Darbi]

Each week that I continue to watch this show I'm more and more impressed with how freakin' brilliant it is.

Loved the back story on Sun/Jin. I had a feeling she knew how to speak English all along...but their story just broke my heart. Jin was loving and kind until he started working for her father. What must have happened for her to want to risk perceived death to get away from her them? Wow. Oh, the beautiful flower at the airport...about made me cry.

Too funny when Michael gave Jin back that watch wielding that ax in his hand. Genius!

Not a lot of Sawyer tonight...but those dimples were present...(swoon) I see a love triangle a brewing between K/J/S. Can't wait!

Locke, Locke, Locke...once again...he's disturbingly delightful. The way he handled Charlie was brilliant. What the heck did he see in that jungle? I love this show!

Only thing I didn't like in this show...Sayid. He's seriously starting to get on my nerves.

[Dommie]

my work system crashed this morning so i have lots of time to goof of and find new things...i think some of these we have explored..and then i found # 4 interesting.

http://www.eonline.com/Features/Feat....html?fixfeat1

It May Be TV's Hottest Show, but Really, What's the Deal with That Island?
by Leslie Gornstein | Oct. 26, 2004

One big, invisible, creature that may or may not be a dinosaur.

One polar bear.

One ghost in a suit. One ex-Hobbit.


Instead of looking for drinkable water, the castaways contemplate their tabula rasa.



And 48--well, now, make that 47, oops, 46--mostly sexy castaways with more issues than a magazine rack.

It's the new formula for success at ABC, and the reason why the creepiness-under-the-palms drama Lost has skyrocketed to the top of its ratings slot. Now, all that's left for fans to do is guess what in the high hell is happening on this haunted fantasy island.

Like, what is that monster in the trees? And why do ghosts and arctic mammals keep popping up? Oh, and how did we all get here, anyway?

The Internet has seen a tropical storm of theories in recent weeks--aliens, Bermuda Triangles, old exploits of Cap'n Kirk, French zoologists. (That last one might not stand up to the test of time, but the show comes from J.J. Abrams, the man behind pretzel-plotted spy hit Alias, so you never know.)

Characters have dropped a slew of hints, but beyond that, fans are on their own. Here are our five favorite theories for just what's what.

Scenario #1: It's All in Their Heads
Or more accurately, the island--and everything on it--is a product of the castaways' potent gray matter. Some physical force is tapping their brains to make "real" their fears and wishes, an old-hat trick in sci-fi.

Exhibit A: In the classic Star Trek episode "Shore Leave," a vacationing Enterprise crew discovers a planet that morphs depending on the thoughts of any visitors. (Also note Sphere and Solaris, both of which offer alien technology that makes your thoughts come true.)


Kirk sees Finnegan, a Starfleet Academy buddy. No, wait, that's Jack's dead father.



Meanwhile, in Lost, we see young boy Walt reading a comic book with a polar bear on the cover. Moments later, a real polar bear--not a common sight within a thousand miles of Fiji--nearly mows down a klatch of castaways. Then shortly after Jack starts whining about his fraternal "issues," his dead daddy starts popping up in the underbrush.

Why It Works: Ready for this? Maybe they all wanted that plane to crash. Federal prisoner Kate, tortured doctor turned leader Jack Shepherd and harried cubicle worker John Locke all had pretty strong reasons for not craving their final destination in L.A. Could one of their minds--or their collective thoughts--have brought down the plane, created the island, summoned whatever's in the jungle or some combination thereof? Spock certainly wouldn't argue.

Why It's Weak: Everybody starts missing toilet paper eventually. And hopped-up bass player junkie Charlie (played by Lord of the Rings Hobbit Dominic Monaghan) certainly wouldn't want to put so many miles between himself and his pusher. Still, it's the strongest theory yet.

Odds: 5 to 3



Scenario #2: They've Found the Undiscovered Country
As in the Bermuda Triangle. As in Atlantis. Or perhaps even an Arctic island. Scientists recently discovered that about 55 million years ago, temperatures in the Arctic Sea resembled
He may have a old philosopher's name, but Locke still doesn't know what's going on.



those of New York Harbor in mid August. Has the Lost crew been blown way, way back in time? Could that big, invisible monster be a dinosaur? Hey, why not?

As for the Bermuda Triangle, even an embryo knows the triangle of airspace between San Juan, Miami and Bermuda sucks pilots down into watery graves.

Why It Works: Before crash-landing on the island, the Lost pilot endured shenanigans with his equipment and later discovered the vessel had been blown a full 1,000 miles off course. As for the possibility of chronological dabbling: Lost cocreator Damon Lindelof has messed around with time travel before, namely in a comedy play called Ollie Klublershturf vs. the Nazis.

Why It's Weak: Way too easy. Plus, Lindelof has already said the giant invisible beast is not a dinosaur.

Odds: 10 to 3

Scenario #3: Everybody's Dead
And welcome to purgatory, where God makes all the rules and can produce as many polar bears and well-dressed dead men as He wants. All to help His visitors, like, move along.


Okay, you're all dead and have to figure a way into heaven or hell. Ready? Go!



"The idea of purgatory is that to get to heaven, we have to be fixed," Paul Thigpen, religious expert and author of The Rapture Trap, tells E! Online.

Why It Works: People rarely walk away from plane crashes. And now we get 48 "survivors"? Come on. Also, the Lost characters clearly have some soul searching to do--a key factor for the Catholic Church's theory of purgatory.

"Whatever suffering they go through would have to be redemptive, with the goal of each of them being perfected," Thigpen says. Hence, struggling with drug addiction (while trying to get laid by any chick under 30 left on the island). Or trying to sew yourself up at an uncomfortable angle. As long as the trials lead to a purer soul, experts say, anything that happens in purgatory is A-okay with God.

Why It's Weak: Apparently, God tells dead people pretty early on that they're in purgatory, so they can waste no time in cleaning their souls. So far, the Lost castaways remain clueless.

Odds: 2 to 1




Scenario 4: Jack's the New Adam, Kate's the New Eve
Just hear us out, here. For those of you who slept through philosophy class, Lost's bald, knife-toting frustrated office-drone Locke clearly refers to the great Enlightenment thinker John Locke. His writings on man's moral development shaped generations of
This sweet and lovable Labrador, see, is actually the new serpent.



artists and pundits, not to mention Thomas Jefferson. His basic tenet: Nothing is predestined. People are instead "empty cabinets" who can choose which experiences will shape their souls and characters.

"This show sounds like it was written by graduate students of philosophy who never got a job," posits Boston University philosophy expert Aaron Garrett.

Obviously! So, follow these clues, and perhaps the castaways have been literally reborn--into a Garden of Eden-style situation--and given a new start.

Why It Works: A few episodes back, Jack mused that he and the others had been spawned anew. He didn't mean it literally--or did he? And Locke, in a creepy explanation of backgammon, explained that you can choose to be "light" or "dark." (Stroke your chin to that.) Beyond that, the island is lousy with second chances. Kate is no longer handcuffed. Jack is no longer yoked by the expectations of his perfectionist parents. And the once wheelchair-bound Locke, well, geez, he can walk now.

Why It's Weak: Since when do TV writers foist deep graduate-school theories on prime-time viewers? Americans can barely keep up with 24.

Odds: 10 to 4

Scenario 5: Okay, Wait! They're Someplace! With Some Stuff!
So, like, a French zoologist got stranded on this island, like, 16 years ago, see, after her plane crashed on her way back to France with a polar bear from the Arctic, right? And the polar bear went crazy, man! And it ate everybody! And then the zoologist, she sent out a distress call, but it was too late, dude, just too late.


What if, like, the Korean couple had a polar bear in their luggage, and it got loose...



Or how about: Some aliens have brought down the plane as a way to study humans in isolation, right? And they brought a big, invisible, hungry pet that lives in the trees.

Or how about: Dr. Moreau is at it again!

Why It Works: Show creators Abrams and Lindelof have both achieved rock-star status in Hollywood. Power often leads producers down really out there (read: stupid) avenues. Why? Just because they can.

Why It's Weak: Once viewers discover the secret is as narrow as a bunch of aliens, why tune in anymore? (See: The X-Files, Twin Peaks.) We have faith that Abrams & Co. know the island's secret has to be broader, more mysterious. Otherwise, after one season, they're cooked. And nobody wants off this island that quickly.

Odds: 10 to 1

[Wildfire Girl]

nbsarah, he he he, this eppy had me starting to really like Charlie too.

CinCin, yeah, I thought it was heartbreaking that Sun had almost escaped in two ways.

scionfairy, yeah, your shipper-ness is a tad obvious.

BehrItAll, the mummified body didn't freak me out too much, but hubby made a hilarious statement when it broke to commercial. He'd thought Kate and Jack were going to "go at it" because that would have been the way a typical show would have taken the scene.

Teriberri21, I honestly don't know the Korea/Australia part either.

tangled STARR, I just think that Hurley's comments on Chinese is typical stereotyping. It's supposed to be funny/annoying all the same, I think, because so many non-cultural americans get Asians confused all the time.

at Dommie's statement on Matthew Fox!

SydneySummers, ah yes, I was definetly saddened by the split. But I think it testifies to the differences in the mentallity on the island of those yearning for rescue vs those intent on survival.

Darbi yeah, I too loved how Michael ended up handling the Jin incident.

[Wildfire Girl]

Ooooo Dommie, I just finished reading over the scenarios and they are awesome. Hmmmm food for thought. Do we have a theory speculation thread for that discussion to go to?

[scionfairy]

Originally posted by Wildfire Girl scionfairy, yeah, your shipper-ness is a tad obvious.

I think it's cute Lalalalala la la la

Soceity always wants the pretty people together.. I say the funny people need love!

I am very aware I'm going agaist the grain.

[scionfairy]

Oh yeah.... I forgot, offf the whole Clair and Hurley thing now..

I don't know why, but I thought, from the first eppy that the sky marshal was connected to Kate somehow. Like perhaps it had been her husband, and she did something then fled. You know? It was just odd that someone would go all the way from the USA to Austrailia. Also, they seemed kind of intimate.. like he knew her all too well. Too well for being someone who just wanted to bring her into custody. Also, you could see caring in her face for him in a way. When the plane was going down, she put the oxygen mask up to his face as well. I think there are a bunch of clues that leads us to believe that she knew him on a personal basis as well.

[IceKat055]

So, what are everyone's thoughts on the pouch that Jack pulled out of Adam (or Eve's) pocket?

A black stone, and a white stone.

Locke, explaining the game of backgammon to Walt: Two sides. Two players. One is light, one is dark.

If, as Abrams has hinted, every prop is deliberate - - then what's the significance?

[**Carrie**]

Originally posted by IceKat055 So, what are everyone's thoughts on the pouch that Jack pulled out of Adam (or Eve's) pocket? A black stone, and a white stone. Locke, explaining the game of backgammon to Walt: Two sides. Two players. One is light, one is dark. If, as Abrams has hinted, every prop is deliberate - - then what's the significance?

oh yeah, good question. i wanna hear everyone's thoughts too, since i don't have a single idea myself, i literally said outloud, "so what, is this about backgammon again??"

[DreamOn777]

Ok..I have to say I did like this episode...

Charlie/Locke - Locke went from being freaky guy to cool supportive guy.The bee scene made me laugh.It was good that Charlie handed over the drugs,but withdrawl is going to be really hard for him.The guitar scene was awesome! I loved Charlie's reaction when he say that guitar! I wanted to hug him! Dom playing a guitar? Hottest thing ever! I love musicians...most of my ex-boyfriends were musicians.

Jake/Kate - I think they're ok...I mean I'm more of a Hooligan,but they're cute.But I feel like Kate is more into Jack than he shows her he is with her.When he changed the subject from her in that one scene,the look on her face was one of dispointment.I loved the first scene where Charlie was like,"Aww...you guys have an inside joke.I hate inside jokes."

Sun - Ok...I officially love her! I liked her before,but this episode though it was about her and Jin was really about her.I felt so bad for her.She was(and probably still is) so in love with Jin,but he changed into this other person and it was all about the life they could make together.The last scene where she was about to leave him was heartbreaking.

Sun/Michael - I like them...I know JJ is looking towards them because they've had alot of interaction.I think Michael would be better than Jin for her.

Other Things: No Emilie? Very little Sawyer,but the one Hooligan scene was too good! Hurley cracks me up when he keeps on referring to Jin and Sun as 'the Chinese people'....they're Korean