Everwood - Everwood Fans who are Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie Fans of Dawson's Creek #30: Because Dawson's Creek couldn't hold a candle to Everwood! - Page 11

COOLCAT200 · 04-14-2021, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)

^ Agreed.

We never saw PJ established. You just felt like they would continue to fight and Joey would never stop talking to Dawson. The formula is really predictable.

Joey in 501 talking on Dawson’s voice mail “I know a part of me will be in love with you for the rest of my life”

TL22 · 04-15-2021, 05:06 AM

Random thoughts from 2011 on the Dawson Creek forum: Pacey UNappreciation: We're not attending his pity party, thread.

Quote:

From Wingster

any reasons or examples?

For me (one of): Anti-Prom..taking Andie to the dance and ignoring her most of the time while he he just creepily stared at Joey

I liked the creepily stared at Joey.

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Originally Posted by Ms X (View Post)
I understand he had insecurities and frustrations but every episode, it seemed to always be about whether Pacey was good enough for Joey, good enough for college or it was the Dawson issue. Where was the fun, sweet guy of previous seasons? I certainly didn't see it.

Chels-China reply
THIS right here is where I see that Andie was a better fit for him. He didn't have any of these issues with her. So why write the PJ S4 love story worse than PA S2?

I agree.

Quote:

Posted by Cris

I have to say this title summarizes perfectly my feelings regarding Pacey.

Don't get me wrong, because I loved his character in S1 and mostly S2, because his relationship with Andie made him strong and confident.

After that, eh... his constantly whining and pity parties really bothered me.
I won't blame him for breaking up with Andie (ignoring the bad bad writing in that one), but I will blame him for being hypocritical giving the fact he once cheated too.

The fact that blamed Dawson for every single problem in his relationship with Joey also got on my nerves.

This group of posters from ten years ago sound just like us now.

Quote:

posted by Chels-China

I'm still puzzled why they made him more weak and insecure with Joey when she was the love of his life.

Because nothing could out shine the IT girl

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posted by angleface211.

^I know what you mean. Pacey has always had issues with self esteem but they come out so strongly and quickly in season 4 that he seems like a completely different person. I hated him during that season mostly which sucks because I loved him in season 2 with Andie Joey definitely brought out the worst in him, not that it was her fault. I blame it all on Pacey and Pacey blames it all on Dawson

I like the post, but I also put blame on Joey.

Quote:

posted by Pure.Magic

How was I not aware of the existence of this thread?

I adored Pacey till S2, but the whole PJo arc and the whining and the ~charity project~ behaviour got on my nerves. But the biggest reason I guess was his break up with Andie (even though it was sort of justified), I always remained bitter about that.

I bet this poster did not watch past season four if he/she got that far.

Quote:

Posted by angleface211

I agree that Dawson should have kicked his ass. Pacey was so messed up in that situation. He should have come straight to Dawson about his feelings for Joey and explained things before he ever started something with Joey. I'm not saying that Dawson would have gave him permission or accepted it but it was still the right thing to do. He lied to Dawson for months and snuck around his back and then had the nerve to blame his entire failure in his relationship with Joey on Dawson. It had nothing to do with Dawson and everything to do with his own damn insecurities that he would never be better than Dawson.

Oh I definitely agree that even though she choose Pacey again that he would have screwed it up, again, it was only a matter of time.

I like this post she nailed it.

Quote:

Posted by Angelface211

Ya he did throw it at Dawson's face, I can't remember the episode but I remember him basically blaming Dawson for everything because of it. That is so stupid, Dawson was trying to do what was best for him at the time seperating himself from Joey. He needed to move on and stop pining after her but that didn't mean he stopped caring and he wanted to know that she would be okay so he turned to his best friend for help thinking he could trust him with the most important thing in his life and it turned out he couldn't.

I just hated how insecure Pacey felt when it came to Dawson even though he really had no reason to, it made him a horrible character. I hated hearing him pity himself all the time blaming everyone and everything for his life being messed up except for himself. Yes he had a crappy life and a family that didn't give a crap but if that was me that would just make me want to do better and prove everyone wrong but Pacey gave in to that and just thought he was a failure until he became one.

Seems like only Andie brings out the best in Pacey. What I don't understand is how KW could write Pacey and Andie; then watching season four come up with Pacey and Joey were endgame. Even though KW states he watched past episodes. I doubt he watched season four in fact I doubt he watched any past episodes or just quickly scanned through them, or just watched what Stupin recommended.

That's it, I'll do more someday in the future.

**jediwands** · 04-15-2021, 02:39 PM

^ Excellent thoughts.

**jediwands** · 04-15-2021, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COOLCAT200 (View Post)

Joey in 501 talking on Dawson’s voice mail “I know a part of me will be in love with you for the rest of my life”

She meant it too.

Andie told Pacey in Season 3 that Joey would NEVER love him like she loves Dawson. That was 100% truth.

COOLCAT200 · 04-15-2021, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)

She meant it too.

Andie told Pacey in Season 3 that Joey would NEVER love him like she loves Dawson. That was 100% truth.

Joey in Promicide tells him “ I don’t think I’ll ever love anyone the way that I loved you”

***Jerry D*** · 04-16-2021, 05:50 AM

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Originally Posted by COOLCAT200 (View Post)

Joey in Promicide tells him “ I don’t think I’ll ever love anyone the way that I loved you”

So that's why the show ending with Pacey and Joey really made no sense.

I honestly think that Kevin Williamson being brought back to write the Series Finale was just a publicity stunt and he simply caved in to Paul Stupin's suggestion to "surprise the audience" and have the show end with Pacey and Joey, but in doing so, he destroyed the entire premise of the show that he created, and instead of surprising the audience he insulted and disrespected the audience.

**jediwands** · 04-16-2021, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COOLCAT200 (View Post)

Joey in Promicide tells him “ I don’t think I’ll ever love anyone the way that I loved you”

Exactly.

How can anyone ship or even feel hopeful about PJ knowing it was always written DJ?

**jediwands** · 04-16-2021, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post)

So that's why the show ending with Pacey and Joey really made no sense.

I honestly think that Kevin Williamson being brought back to write the Series Finale was just a publicity stunt and he simply caved in to Paul Stupin's suggestion to "surprise the audience" and have the show end with Pacey and Joey, but in doing so, he destroyed the entire premise of the show that he created, and instead of surprising the audience he insulted and disrespected the audience.

Even the series finale, up until the last moment, was DJ dialogue.

I think you’re right on about Kevin Williamson.

***Jerry D*** · 04-16-2021, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)

Even the series finale, up until the last moment, was DJ dialogue.

Yes, it was so obvious that the lines she said to Pacey were meant fro Dawson, because she never ran away from Pacey and Dawson was the only one she ran away from. It was such a crock.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auror (View Post)

I think you’re right on about Kevin Williamson.

You can see how his inability to finish what he started has caught up with him, because he's pretty much a has-been now.

**jediwands** · 04-16-2021, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post)

Yes, it was so obvious that the lines she said to Pacey were meant fro Dawson, because she never ran away from Pacey and Dawson was the only one she ran away from. It was such a crock.

I remember an honest PJ fan on the WB forum said right after the finale, the next day, that it didn’t make any sense, those were more like DJ lines. She admitted how messed up it was. She was not satisfied with the ending because she wasn’t convinced of anything that happened.

All they did was give PJ the DJ lines.

Infuriating. Insulting. Talk about disrespecting your audience.

Quote:

You can see how his inability to finish what he started has caught up with him, because he's pretty much a has-been now.

100%.

He’s a great writer but has zero patience to complete “the novel” which makes him a terrible, flighty, showrunner.

COOLCAT200 · 04-16-2021, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post)

Yes, it was so obvious that the lines she said to Pacey were meant fro Dawson, because she never ran away from Pacey and Dawson was the only one she ran away from. It was such a crock.

You can see how his inability to finish what he started has caught up with him, because he's pretty much a has-been now.

Watch the deleted montage from the extended cut at 4:55 in and tell me who she was “running” from, it was clearly Dawson https://youtu.be/ue5tNvfVqdM

***Jerry D*** · 04-16-2021, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COOLCAT200 (View Post)

Watch the deleted montage from the extended cut at 4:55 in and tell me who she was “running” from, it was clearly Dawson https://youtu.be/ue5tNvfVqdM

It absolutely was Dawson.

COOLCAT200 · 04-16-2021, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post)

It absolutely was Dawson.

They might’ve deleted it because it shows it was Dawson.

***Jerry D*** · 04-16-2021, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COOLCAT200 (View Post)

They might’ve deleted it because it shows it was Dawson.

Right, exactly. Just like they deleted the Pacey and Andie scene.

**jediwands** · 04-16-2021, 02:15 PM

Wow. I had never seen that before.

Sickening. I think you’re right, and that’s absolutely why they deleted it.

How can Williamson and Stupin be fine with the ending? They insulted their own art. Not saying it was six years of quality. It wasn’t a great show after a couple of seasons. But still, if they would have gone with the premise and foundation, the ending would have at least made some sense and the show wouldn’t have been a complete joke. It’s like they made a mockery of the series.

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Fan Forum > TV Shows - Past > Everwood > Everwood Fans who are Dawson/Joey & Pacey/Andie Fans of Dawson's Creek #30: Because Dawson's Creek couldn't hold a candle to Everwood!