[Lauren Helen Graham]

I don't really know... I really don't know what to think about it. I somehow think Tom really started to care for Lizzie and I don't see why he would lie about it towards her. Why start the father topic right there? Or maybe it was to stay alive. Who knows.

ETA - Here I am again after re-watching some of the Luther Braxton epsiodes... And you know what? I think Red doesn't want to have the Fulcrum at all. He didn't come into her life now to get the Fulcrum but simply to protect her because he knows that she's the only way anybody could find it. He even went into the Factory on purpose to stop Luther from getting the information there. He didn't go there to get them for himself. I'm convinced of that now. The information that Luther would have gotten there is that he needed Lizzie to find it and Red already knew that so why go there besides of protecting her. I think he isn't really concerned about his life but about hers.
And like I said before, he never said that he didn't have it...

[One Thing Remains]

that's a good point Kris. There was no point in going to the Factory because he already knew that Braxton would only be led to Liz and not to the fulcrum.

[L i N d $ @ y]

I'm the opposite Kris. I think Red knows how to open/access that fulcrum so he can use it against the Alliance/The Director and to take them down once and for all.

[Ceta_Cea]

I'm a lot more busy at the moment, that's why I don't write here very often right now. But I keep thinking about all the open questions.

If Red knows how to access the fulcrum why did he wait so long? Why going underground and acting as a criminal for about 25 years? I do hope they have a good explanations for that, if it really turns out that he knew all this time but had no copy of it.

Since Red has always been a step or two ahead of Liz (and us), it makes more sense for him to also have a copy. Though if that is really the case the writer do have to explain why he never tried to finish off the Alliance.

[Lauren Helen Graham]

But why would he want to take them down once and for all? I think he wants to find answers, for example what happened to his family and he might only be able to do that with the help of the FBI (I don't know why yet)... I think that US intelligences were somehow involved in what happened to Red and his family and how else get the information than getting them to work with you, to trust you somehow. And at the same time he can make sure, that nothing happens to Lizzie.

I'm wondering if Braxton could have figured out that it was Lizzie who was the key if he hadn't had Red there. Maybe he wouldn't but he might have handed the information over to the Alliance and they would maybe have been able to figure it out if they somehow had been involved in the fire that night.

Mona, no worries Whenever you have time to post, come along. We'll be here.

Maybe he really doesn't want the Fulcrum, maybe it's just his life insurance So that could be a reason for him not doing anything about it or trying to access the information for the past 25 years Makes no sense, right?

[One Thing Remains]

I think it's mostly his life insurance to make sure that he stays alive and out of jail.

[Lauren Helen Graham]

Yeah, I think so, too tbh But he doesn't need it therefore because they already believe he has it...

And look at this:

CLONE OF ARAMS_NOTES_023.TXT 02/12/15 Dear Future Aram, You'd be surprised at the level of digital recording technology available in the mid-1980s. Or at least, I've been surprised, looking into it. Denon was making a digital recorder in 1972, using pulse-code modulation. And early DAT systems were being worked up in the mid-'80s, capable of incredibly high quality reproduction. But what's even more interesting is this guy named Kane Kramer. In 1979, he invented, and went on to patent, the first digital audio player. It could only hold about four minutes of music, because it had an 8 MB capacity, which came from solid-state bubble memory, because semiconductor chips weren't even around yet. And yeah, the instinct is to be like, "oh, 8 MB, how quaint." But when I was a kid, I had a copy of Where in the World Is Carmen Sandiego?, which was completely awesome, and that whole thing fit on one 5-1/4" floppy at a grand total of 1.2 MB. And that game - come on, it was really great! It was funny and clever and taught kids geography, and there was a song about it. So 8 MB of solid state is really nothing to sneeze at. Anyway, this guy Kramer came up with the first iPod really, just off the top of his head. He got Paul McCartney to invest in it. (Great choice, by the way - in four minutes you can fit "Yesterday," "Wild Honey Pie," *and* "Her Majesty.") It's pretty incredible if you ask me, that a 23-year-old could just dream it up in his basement. The real hero, though, is his friend James Campbell, who built four working prototypes of the device by hand. Incredibly ahead of its time. I truly admire people like that. Men and women who are visionary. Who come up with simple, brilliant ideas that push the human race forward. It makes me happy to be breathing the same air as them. Makes you wonder what other stuff was worked up, but only in secret. Hey, you ever keep a secret? And it's the kind of secret that's probably nothing, except the people you're keeping it from are dangerous and smart and like, spies, and so anything that needs to be kept secret from them is, actually come to think of it, probably not so much "nothing" as it is most definitely "something," by which I guess I mean "something worth killing people for" or even, say, "something worth killing Aram for," but you keep that secret anyway because your friend is counting on you and she says she trusts you, which you're glad she does of course, and you trust her, too, totally, except to say, you're maybe not so glad to be quite so trusted if it means your technical skills are occasionally something of a liability to your continued, you know, existence, and so you lay awake at night thinking "I can't ever un-see what I saw" and what that means and who'll care about it or want to come after you if they ever find out what you know? Yeah, that's never happened to me either. Your Friend, Past Aram

Source

And now speculate ahead

[Miranda]

It does makes sense Kris. Like Amy said I really do think that the Fulcrum is his life insurance.

I don't think Braxton would have found out that Liz is the key to everything if she and Red wouldn't have been in the Factory. Braxton saw the look on Red's face when he started talking about the fire, about the girl and he just put 2 and 2 together.

[One Thing Remains]

thanks for posting the Aram notes Kris

Aram is so funny


I just hope we find out what's on the fulcrum this season and we don't have to keep waiting

[L i N d $ @ y]

Haha, thanks for bringing that Aram note over.

Originally Posted by Ceta_Cea (View Post) If Red knows how to access the fulcrum why did he wait so long? Why going underground and acting as a criminal for about 25 years? I do hope they have a good explanations for that, if it really turns out that he knew all this time but had no copy of it.

Because Red doesn't know where the fulcrum is?

Originally Posted by Lauren Helen Graham (View Post) But why would he want to take them down once and for all? I think he wants to find answers, for example what happened to his family and he might only be able to do that with the help of the FBI (I don't know why yet)... I think that US intelligences were somehow involved in what happened to Red and his family and how else get the information than getting them to work with you, to trust you somehow. And at the same time he can make sure, that nothing happens to Lizzie.

It could be something the Alliance did to Liz' family (my spec) or because he doesn't remember much, the fulcrum might be his answer to remember what happened that day. I'm not sure if Red does know what is inside the fulcrum or maybe it's an entirely different thing (and the writers are pulling a good one on us again).

Maybe he really doesn't want the Fulcrum, maybe it's just his life insurance So that could be a reason for him not doing anything about it or trying to access the information for the past 25 years Makes no sense, right?

This could be another good theory. It can be his insurance but knowing Red it has to benefit him somehow or it benefits Liz.

[Ceta_Cea]

Originally Posted by L i N d $ @ y (View Post) Because Red doesn't know where the fulcrum is?

But he did know that Luther needs Liz to get it. That's what I mean. If Liz was right with her accusations he wouldn't need to befriend Liz and work with the FBI. He just could have kidnap Liz and get the Memory. Red wasn't surprised about the way Luther attempted to get the information out of Liz. He could have done just the same. He knew where she lived, most likely he knew exactly where she had been for the last 25 years.

[Miranda]

Thanks for Aram's notes Kris. I didn't see it last night. Aram is funny, I always love reading his notes.

[L i N d $ @ y]

Originally Posted by Ceta_Cea (View Post) But he did know that Luther needs Liz to get it. That's what I mean. If Liz was right with her accusations he wouldn't need to befriend Liz and work with the FBI. He just could have kidnap Liz and get the Memory. Red wasn't surprised about the way Luther attempted to get the information out of Liz. He could have done just the same. He knew where she lived, most likely he knew exactly where she had been for the last 25 years.

Red doesn't remember much about that night too and while Red did help the FBI to take down the Blacklisters, it's mostly because of Liz and we still don't know why he is so protective of her. Red knew Braxton works for The Director so I guess he figured out why Braxton wants the fulcrum.

[Lauren Helen Graham]

Originally Posted by Ceta_Cea (View Post) But he did know that Luther needs Liz to get it. That's what I mean. If Liz was right with her accusations he wouldn't need to befriend Liz and work with the FBI. He just could have kidnap Liz and get the Memory. Red wasn't surprised about the way Luther attempted to get the information out of Liz. He could have done just the same. He knew where she lived, most likely he knew exactly where she had been for the last 25 years.

EXACTLY MY POINT! He knew that whoever wants to get the Fulcrum can only get it through Lizzie... How would he know that? She was four years old and she didn't remember, Red knew that. And why not get the information the same way Braxton has tried to access it if he didn't care about her? See, that's why I think Lizzie's behavior that stupid.

Aram's notes are so funny indeed. I loved it when I saw it the other night.

[Miranda]

I hope that she will see soon enough that Red really cares about her and not just about the Fulcrum. If the Fulcrum was really all he wanted then he would have never surrendered to the FBI and get into Liz's life like that. Like Mona said he could have easily kidnapped her and done way worse things to her than lie.