Tomorrow's skies

What is meant by 'subtext'? Because I really disagree with the Lord of the Rings mention.

TheAngel

Subtext really indicates underlying sexuality that isn't explicitly depicted by the author, and perhaps isn't even intended by the author. For example, in The Lord of the Rings, the intimate nature of the relationship between Frodo and Sam could be considered a gay relationship. While there isn't anything explicit between the two of them, not sexual contact, nothing physical or nothing outright said, the nature of their relationship, their closeness, their love for each other, has often been interpreted as a gay relationship.

Samwise Gamgee

TheAngel... such a perfect explanation!

TheAngel

That's what I get for taking literary theory in college. Of course, we talked a lot about subtext

fetch

Good list I'll try to think of some more. LGBT, right? So any books discussing or featuring homosexuality, bisexuality or transexuality?

TheAngel

Basically, any books that have GLBT characters or potentially any themes. Like above, how The Lord of the Rings doesn't have explicit gay content but a gay relationship is implied. That works too

fetch

Here's the summary for First Person Plural, which is already on the list.


In this stunning novel, Andrew W.M. Beierle brings to life characters at once unthinkably foreign and utterly real. Frank and fearless, sexy and witty, First Person Plural is a masterfully rendered, powerfully imaginative work, as complex and as extraordinary as the bonds of love.

Owen and Porter Jamison are conjoined twins inhabiting one body with two heads, one torso, and two very different hearts. As children, they're seen as a single entity--Owenandporter, or more often, Porterandowen. As they grow to adulthood, their differences become more pronounced: Porter is outgoing and charismatic while Owen is cerebral and artistic. When Porter becomes a high school jock hero, complete with cheerleader girlfriend, a greater distinction emerges, as Owen gradually comes to realize that he's gay.

Owen, a reluctant romantic, is content at first to settle for unrequited crushes. Porter's unease with his brother's sexuality leaves Owen feeling increasingly alienated from his twin, especially when Porter falls in love with Faith, and Owen becomes the unwilling third side of a complicated love triangle. When Owen finally begins to explore his own desires, the rift grows deeper.

As Porter and Owen's carefully balanced arrangement of give-and-take, sacrifice and selfishness, is irrevocably shattered, each twin is left fighting for his relationship--and his future--in a battle of wills where winning seems impossible, and losing unthinkable...

There's Invisible Monsters by Chuck Palahniuk

She's a fashion model who has everything: a boyfriend, a career, a loyal best friend. But when a sudden freeway "accident" leaves her disfigured and incapable of speech, she goes from being the beautiful center of attention to being an invisible monster, so hideous that no one will acknowledge she exists. Enter Brandy Alexander, Queen Supreme, one operation away from becoming a real woman, who will teach her that reinventing yourself means erasing your past and making up something better And that salvation hides in the last places you'll ever want to look.

Samwise Gamgee

Really?
Sounds great!
If I ever get to go to college again, I'd probably apply for Literature or History!

Samwise Gamgee

Did you read it?? Is it good?
Sounds... weird!

That's interesting!
I'll try to find it here in Brazil, though I know it's almost impossible.

TheAngel

Yeah, I did English, but focused on literature (at my university you could focus on grammar, theory, literature or creative writing) and loved it. I took so many really interesting courses. English theory was probably my most difficult, but I really loved it because it was challenging and really informative.

Tomorrow's skies

I really don't want to get into a debate, but I do not think it appropriate to just say that its implied. It's more of a personal preference or vicarious happenstance. And really I think it would cheapen their relationship to say "oh, they're just gay for each other" that completely degrades the depth of the relationship. And that's not anti-gay, many could say the same thing about hetero-couples in movies or books where some didn't think a love interest was beneficial.

I guess I'm just against any groups of people just taking claim to regular things, especially classic things that can't properly defend themselves from such claims. You think there's subtext or whatever? Fine, I just don't think it should be presented and assumed as factual.

TheAngel

But that's what literary theory is all about. For most books, theorists look at things that the author didn't explicitly state. Feminist theory, queer theory, realism, modernism, all are branches of literary theory that analyze texts. Queer theory looks at homosexual subtext, or might look at the character of Gollum as a castrated male or a gender neutral character in order to explain some of his behaviors. It doesn't mean it's true, but it's interesting.

Samwise Gamgee

That's what subtext is: may be or may be not something between the lines.
I really don't think Sam and Frodo are gay. I just "ship" them in that way. I think they have such a beautiful love for each other that could have made its way as something more... But I also don't want to think and say that two men can't be close like that as friends. It really makes it cheap. I understand your point. If they were a couple... it probably wouldn't have that magic between them. But as I said before... you can easily think about "something" more by reading the books or watching the movies... And what leads you to think about that it's the subtext.

vicious_boy

You should totally list Changing Jamie in the OP.

TheAngel

What is it about?