Tennessee Whiskey

I like how Mary use to be, I wish she'd come off as awesome the few times we saw her as she was before she died...did that make sense?

faith_in_Faith

kind of... But I've liked her everytime we've seem her. Sure, she made an insanly stupid deal, but as I said before, it seems to run in the family....

Captain Oatsocute

And the most important thing is all her mistakes were made out of love. She was not to know how things would turn out.

Tennessee Whiskey

She was broken when she found out the boys were hunters.

Captain Oatsocute

I know! I do love how Dean quickly tried to soften the blow by saying it wasn't her who brought them up as hunters, it was John. Although I'm sure that hurt even more to hear, because what she loved about John so much was that he was everything a hunter wasn't.

Tennessee Whiskey

Yup it was probably twisting the knife a little bit. I do find it interesting though that Dean would be more protective of Mary instead of John, like you mentioned in the Dean/John thread. Dean's feelings about John have changed over time, There would have been a time where he would have said it was john but and then defended him but this was more, it was Johns fault.

faith_in_Faith

I think you're right when you say Dean's feeling for john has changed but I actually think he would have said waht he said to Mary even in the beginning because his mother is very pressious to him and he wanted her to be happy and safe more than anything.

Captain Oatsocute

Dean's always held a perfect image of his mother in his head and that image will never change, because he has no other memories to ruin that. He'd do everything to protect that memory of her!

Tennessee Whiskey

I agree, because if they were going to shift you would think finding out that she was the reason everything is now happening...would be the reason.

faith_in_Faith

But it didn't seem to chage the way he feel about her, it was like John became the bad guy here... Maybe because Dean now knows how much his mother did NOT want this for them.

Tennessee Whiskey

That probably has a lot to do with it. and John should have known better because I'm guessing Mary never told him about being a hunter but he must have found out...so when he did find out and realized she hid it from him for a reason, to have a normal life, he should have tried to give the boys that.

faith_in_Faith

Exactly my thougts! With two boy to care for he should have thought about it twice!

Tennessee Whiskey

He really should have. I know he was trying to protect them but a second thought here and there wouldn't have hurt.

Captain Oatsocute

I actually don't think John found out about Mary being a hunter until much further down the line, when the damage had already been done and the boys were already knee deep into the life, if he even knew at all. Is there any evidence that he knew? I can imagine YED maybe mentioning it to him after making that deal with him, but that would have been long after he could have done anything about it.

It's still no excuse though. Surely, even if Mary had never been an ex hunter, he must have known she wouldn't want to see her sons brought up that way. What mother would?

Tennessee Whiskey

I can't really blame John for what he did, yet he still could have raised the boys better. Like you need revenge then fine but there was other ways to handle the boys, especially Dean.