ds44

No she didn't. She left to marry another man and Catherine didnt like her cause she got caught with her son in a boat house or wherever. I don't see how she thought Olivia was a threat. Lets just agree to disagree

Leelala

Ahhh yes she did! You must have missed the episode where they revealed that Catherine was the one to 'set her up' with another man to get her away from Francis after she caught them in the act... Sounds like she got rid of the threat to Francis' arranged marriage...
Then once Catherine found out about the prophecy she ruined Olivia and brought her back as her puppet to manipulate the FM situation...

ds44

Still disagree. Is it a requirement to agree with you? Can we just move on. No one is going to convince the other.
Point of fact, I just rewatched it the other day and I didn't interpret that fact in that way. I just don't see Olivia as a huge deal. At the point in time Francis was resisting the alliance but fm both came to realize that they could have love and the alliance. Their love will be tested and time will tell what happens next but neither side can force the other to agree. Blanket statements of fact based on something that isn't canon yet is just spec not fact.

Leelala

lol of coarse you can disagree with clear facts that had open clear dialogue if you like
Its fine, we dont have to agree!
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Anyway, I noticed in the new spoiler pics, Bash is actually more dressed up than usual and matching Mary no less lol

ds44

Please read my edited post and no need to for the rude tone. I don't see the point of trying to force your pov on others. It's Your interpretation.

Leelala

I had edited my post too.. But you jumped down my throat b/c I made a comment about Olivia... How can you tell someones tone in writing??

I think this is silly, just like you guys want to have your pov heard we just do the same... Lets drop it shall we..?

I really love your icon btw..

ds44

I jumped down your throat because you straight up wee condencending by saying I was ignoring facts. Anyways lets drop this. Language indicates tone. Words indicate as much if not more than the sound of a persons voice.

Mayberry

And how could you know that Olivia was that important before Mary arrived? Sure, he was broken-hearted, but he might've been sleeping with mistresses at the same time. We know he gave up mistresses AND Olivia for Mary. What did he give up for Olivia? Puppy love is temporary and that's way closer to Francis/Olivia since he picked Mary over Olivia. At least my point has evidence behind it.

Same with you wanting sacrifices for Mash. There's no evidence of that yet. You're just hoping but Frary has been shown to make sacrifices for each other. Just because you want things doesn't make them true. I mean, I encourage wanting something but it's not canon yet.

We know for a fact Mary gave up the relationship with Francis because she was afraid he'd die. That's not a puppy dog love decision. And it's definitely not something born of duty. If it was about duty, she'd STILL be doing it because she wouldn't care what happens to him since it would protect Scotland.

It seems to me that duty is the quick go-to for the argument that Frary CAN'T be in love because it's arranged. That's simply not true. The real King Henry said he saw something in Frary when they were children, and pushed for the marriage. (Same thing as what some of you are saying, that Diane saw a thirst between Mash). It never changed and that's why Mary was so destroyed by Francis' death in real life.

Mary marrying Tomas was born out of duty. Francis let Olivia stay because of duty. Frary is very different. He was willing to let Mary marry Tomas if it protected HER country. That meant losing Scotland to Tomas' country. If it was duty, he never would've agreed to let her go.
There is SO much evidence that it isn't about duty but I just gave you two big examples.

Stay to the Lights

Frary has never been just about duty. Its true love. Plain and simple.

Forwood4Bamon

Mayberry

Fine, if only because we're about a week away from the next ep.

Aylo

I just read a back a few pages and saw the DC discussion. As iconic as that DC triangle was, it was soooo not well written. It was actually pretty terrible. I still have such intense feelings of hatred over that whole thing


That's interesting, I hadn't really thought of that reasoning for adding a third party to an already established couple. I like it. Although, I'm also concerned that writers nowadays are just incapable of writing good love stories that are only between two people, no third parties involved (at least not major ones). I think they just don't find it dramatic enough, which is extremely sad. I keep thinking that if Romeo & Juliet, perhaps the most well-known love story of all time, was turned into a CW show Paris would be a main character and Juliet would be torn between him and Romeo. Because the whole "our families hate each other and would never let us be together and in our attempt to be together we end up inadvertently setting into motion actions that lead to our suicides" just isn't dramatic enough.

Mayberry

I think if it's iconic, it is well-written. Do I think it's the best triangle ever? No, but it was very good. And I'm saying this as a bitter Dawson/Joey fan. I think you could see that Joey clearly cared about the two guys, and it forever hurt the Dawson/Pacey friendship. There was so much at stake. And I've seen a lot of critics point to it as an example of a good triangle. I just wanted to say that because I'd much rather be talking about Reign.

Aylo

I don't know, for me iconic doesn't necessarily mean well-written. Although, comparatively speaking, it was better than a lot of triangles that have popped up since. I just really hate love triangles, especially if they are between siblings or bffs. Also, I'm a bitter Pacey/Andie fan tbh. I am, all these years later, still completely devastated that the writers were so gung-ho about doing that triangle that they just completely crushed PAndie in the most OOC way possible.

But to it's credit, as much as I thought that triangle was somewhat unfair to Dawson as a character and at times a bit convoluted, I did appreciate that they took the care to build up PJo instead of just throwing them all smack dab in the middle of a triangle (I just wish they had taken the same care with ending PA that was true to them and respectful of the touching relationship they had). Also, as much as I hated the triangle for, like you said, forever hurting the D/P friendship, it is also for that very same reason that I think it was more realistic than a lot of what we see now. And I'll forever give them credit for that.

And to tie it back into this show, it's why I'm nervous about an actual attempt at a triangle on this show. I'm not sure they've built up Francis and Bash as brothers well enough for me to invest in the destruction that it will cause their relationship. Although, I think a lot of my feelings on that are going to depend heavily on what Bash does/feels in regards to the prophecy and what sort of interaction the brothers will have when Catherine exposes Bash's past and Bash tries to save himself by exposing something of Catherine's.

ds44

I am curious about who Henry think Catherine slept with.