indigo sunrise

Yes that was my first thought too! But then again that wouldn't have been in his best interest, either.

I knew they were returning, but, I thought there were going to be like maybe 5 of them! so that was definitely a shock when the camera then panned out to reveal them all.

Mrs.Almeida

Seriously. I knew about Timothy Dalton playing a Timelord but ... all those others? There must have been hundreds of them. I wonder where they hid. I mean, the Doctor said he would sense a Timelord so clearly they must have done something so he wouldn't.
And all the time he thought he was the last one

scififan2009

Wonder if John Simm really wore a dress for one of those scenes?

Probably not. But still.

Wholigan

OMG to the TENTH Power!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So I'm gonna throw out a crazy nutter sort of theory here - bear with me now, as I will be proven wrong in just one long heck of a week:
What if
WHAT IF
bringing Gallifrey back
was the way in which the Master's plans backfired, eh?
The Gate somehow brought them all back, and they were not hiding from anyone at all?!!
This is just TOO Weird! as Donna would say - but I'm willing to bear it out until next week.
NOT THAT I HAVE ANY CHOICE!

rsaint333

OMG I thought my laptop would melt from how amazing this episode was! I knew the timelords were coming back, I knew it when the Ood said "They are returning" as I'm sure everyone else did. Two questions:

1) Does anyone else think these are not "real" timelords but rather a crazy break-off schism similar in nature to the religious Daleks Rose disintegrated with the time vortex? Since they seem kind of crazy and hellbent on destroying time. 0_0 Especially after this <<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Z-vxXvTipc>> *beginning of the 2nd part so spoiler!!!!*

2)Any speculation on how they survived? It would seem from the part 2 trailer it has something to do with the Master directly, since they brought him back from the dead for the time war, maybe they locked their salvation inside him somehow? My theory is since it only shows them and their faces with no real relation to the earth or a spaceship, maybe they're inside the master's head or something, about to change his new race of uniform masters on Earth into differentiated timelords. Maybe that's what Dalton is talking about? <And maybe the noise the master hears is all of their hearts beating, echoing through time to the beginning of his life?>

Mrs.Almeida

In the Confidential Russell said something about how he always thought the Timelords were evil - what with all the power they had. So I think they are the Timelords.

scififan2009

Evil? Really?

Because the way he has the Doctor continually going on about them and mouring them, you would think they were the guardian angels of time.

Hmmm, Angels of Time. That'd be a nice title for a fic.

Mrs.Almeida

I think that is normal, isn't it? I mean, in the classic show the Doctor always ran away from them (that is what Rusty said) and they were corrupt with power. But then they were gone ... he thought he was the last one - of course he doesn't go about complaining about them.
And if you think about it he never actually talked about the timelords, he talked about Gallifrey, didn't he?

And I think that it does not exclude him talking about them guiding time (like in "Waters of Mars"). They might still guard time but their motives might be different and not true to purpose.

I do wonder though, if they know about him and what happened in "Waters of Mars"

Wholigan

My thoughts here are
A. Maybe they only appear to be sinister -OR-
B. They always had their own agenda in the classic series - supposidly only watched the turn of events, but were kind of hypocritical in that they tossed their own rules aside to serve their own purposes at times (ex. sending the Doctor to destroy the Daleks before they properly existed and so forth)
C. I, too, wonder if they know the Doctor broke the laws of time and space, and what they intend to do about it, as he's been disciplined for that type of behavior before...

Any one else worried about Donna?

Mrs.Almeida

I would not be surprised if Russell would take the whole classic series and change it without so much as a twitch. You know, just so it fits with his storyline.

Donna! Yeah! She started to remember I really hope the Doctor will be able to save her

stoptheqtip

I think I'm going to save my commentary on the episode until I see Part 2. I really liked it but the ending was... cracky and kind of let it down for me. BUT I'm going wait to see the second part before I pass judgement.

But I needed to say this: the café scene: beautifully acted, beautifully written and had me in tears. Bernard Cribbins and David Tennant were freaking amazing.

indigo sunrise

oh me neither, that would be so like him.

Very. But I don't think she's going to die... Maybe that's just wishful thinking, though

fozzy81

Loved the Cafe scene between Wif and The Doctor it made me tear up, God help me on Friday

Mrs.Almeida

Moved your post here because it fits the topic

I agree about Wilf's pistol I wonder what will happen there.

Princess Pinky

*raises hand*

I heard that (I think) RTD said he didn't want to mind wipe her again, which seems to be what has to happen unless she dies or The Doctor finds a way to fix her. And I think the latter will happen. The Immortality Gate apparently has multiple purposes: 1. it can heal wounds/old scars (as was talked about early on in the episode), 2. it can revive whole planets, 3. it can spread/project genetic material as seen with The Master.

So, since Donna became The DoctorDonna by some kind of genetic transfer in "Journey's End" which created "mental scars" that The Doctor basically put a bandaid on by mind wiping her, then it seems that the Immortality Gate could heal her both in the sense of the genetic Time Lord transfer and the mental wounds. (Does that make sense? It's been a while since I've seen "Journey's End," and not all of the sci-fi "science speak" is clear to me, so I may have some of the terms wrong.)

Of course there is the problem of, if she is fixed, then she'd want to travel with The Doctor again, "Forever." And obviously that's not going to happen. But, I think that's why they wrote in Sean Temple: to give Donna a reason - her fiance - to stay on Earth instead of wanting to return to her travels with The Doctor.

And that's my theory and I'm sticking to it. lol

The thing that makes me sad if I'm on the right track is that I always believed that the show would bring back Lee McAvoy (from "Forest of the Dead," I think - I'm relatively new to Doctor Who so I'm not privvy to all the episode titles and whatnot yet) for Donna. The way they were literally torn apart broke my heart and then she told The Doctor how she'd found herself the perfect man...it just kills me that they didn't end up together. I like the sound of Donna Noble-McAvoy better than Donna Temple-Noble. I guess all I can hope for is that if - and when - they bring Donna back for another guest appearance, they bring Lee back and, well, I honestly don't care what happens to Sean. I just want Donna/Lee. And the real Ella and Joshua.