Forwood4Bamon

and this. all of it. I watch a show called degrassi: clare who is one of my absolute favorite characters is with eli. it's always about eli in that relationship and clare is always the villian. drew whos been there for her, and who stepped up with the baby that may not even be his, is the other guy, the guy she should be with. drew takes the blame for something he didn't do and then eli punches him in the face and says you knocked up my soulmate and ruined my life. how possessive, kind of like pacey. and also clare is starting to lie about drew to eli. he does a gesture and she keeps taking him back. drew even said you're hotheaded boyfriend and if you're soooo unhappy, leave him.

do we want to fix the op for the 60th? how is this?

Speedychatterbox

I don't watch that show and I don't get your comparison since Pacey wasn't anything like this Eli, guy you mention. He wasn't poessive of any of his girlfriends nor did he refer to them as his soulmates. For the most part, Pacey was a loving, loyal, faithful boyfriend who often was the one who got hurt. PJ wasn't my favorite couple but Pacey didn't treat her bad, he did a lot for her, he was very supportive, and let her go, more than once.

Forwood4Bamon

that's true, but those two couples are similar somewhat. maybe a bad comparison. I added that banner in the op. it's from sara. both of them are very one sided and I don't like how one of them treats the other. plus both fight constantly and it's vicious. the most vicious I've seen on a show. also both pacey and eli pressured the girls for sex and both are very jealous of another guy in the girls life. another thing is eli is always the angel and clare is the villian, like joey is always the angel while pacey is the villian. I think both clare and pacey deserve better, they always will at least imo.

Speedychatterbox

I disagree about Pacey, he doesn't pressure girls for sex they all wanted to sleep with him, and Joey had to convince Pacey she was ready. BTW Dawson was worse then Pacey in the jealous department. Pacey was understandably jealous of Dawson when he was with Joey because Joey gave him a reason to be jealous because she put Dawson needs ahead of him when she was dating him not Dawson. Pacey didn't punch out a guy for kissing his girlfriend, or nearly kill a guy in a boat race because his ex girlfriend friend liked the guy, that was Dawson, just saying. I like both Dawson and Pacey but Dawson was worse. Not to mention they horrible way Joey treated Jen when she dated Dawson. Jen went out of her way to be kind to her and Joey went out of her way to be mean to Jen. Pacey never went out of his way to be mean the guys who dated his exes or girls he liked the way Dawson and Joey did, just saying.

Forwood4Bamon

heres something from DNAboi who is a DJo fan but he is pointing out evidence about why pjo is the worst together: Here:
Coming Home – they fight about Joey’s feelings for Dawson
Failing Down – they fight about Pacey keeping his grades a secret
Two Gentlemen of Capeside – they fight about Pacey not thinking about Joey during the storm
Future Tense – they fight about Joey obsessing about college and Pacey not having a future
A Family Way – they fight about Joey stopping the makeout sessions because she feels pressured
Self Reliance – they fight about Joey seeing Dawson/Gretchen kissing and pushing Pacey away
Kiss Kiss Bang Bang – they fight about Pacey’s behavior at the college party
The Te of Pacey – they fight about Pacey’s birthday party
Hopeless – they fight about sex
A Winter's Tale - they really fight about sex
Four Stories – they fight about Joey being a bitch the morning after
Admissions – they fight about Dawson giving Joey tuition money; Pacey is happy Joey doesn’t get into her dream school
Late – Joey hides a pregnancy scare, Pacey hides the fact he got arrested
Promicide – they really, really fight and break up.

What an immature, truly toxic relationship. Why people were so insane about it I’ll never understand.

this is evidence of every fight PJo ever had. :high: and then here is something else:

joey and dawson fighting about different things and eachother.

joey and pacy fighting over dawson all the time because joey always put him first.

I am sorry, I will take joey and dawson fights over pacey and joey because I would not have to live with the stigma of my current lover never getting over their ex and using the term soul-mates to describe them. I will have been out the relationship in a flash. because saying that DJo was codependent and dysfunctional that applies more to PJo.

OutoftheWoods

This is why I can't ship Pjo, as much as I wish I could just because the majority of fans seem to ship them. I mean, how can I ship a couple when they can hardly get along most of the time? I admit Pjo had some good moments, some sweet moments. I think they had a good build up in Season 3 (although I did NOT appreciate how unappealing the writers tried to make Andie seem in that season just to make the idea of Pjo more appealing), but once they were together, the writers just couldn't make them happy together. It's like the fact that they were together was a big mistake, and it makes me wonder how on earth they're supposed to be endgame when their relationship was always making a wrong turn in every episode.

The whole thing just doesn't make sense to me.

Speedychatterbox

Ok I don't know why your quoting me trying to convince me, my post was in defense of Pacey character, who I love and is my favorite DC character, not PJ. PJ wasn't my favorite couple. Also I don't like DJ either, Joey should have ended with someone else or alone. Pacey and Joey had a nice friendship going and I enjoyed them as friends.

TL22

To me the biggest indication that Joey did not have her heart in her relationship with Pacey, was her reaction when she saw Dawson kissing Gretchen.

What could have been more interesting would have been Dawson kissing Andie.

Speedychatterbox

That would have been interesting, but for Pacey reaction, since it would be his former BFF kissing his ex girlfriend. Then Joey could have gotten mad over them fighting over Andie instead of her.

Forwood4Bamon

speedy, I wasn't quoting you. I was actually just writing what dnaboi said and yes co mod agreed completely. is that the reason you didn't like them together?

Speedychatterbox

You posted using one of my posts in a quote, so I thought you were trying to convince me the wrongness of PJ, which confused me. Sorry.

I was indifferent to them, for the most part. I liked them as friends and they did have cute moments and scenes during their buildup and while they were dating. I just perfered him with Andie. Also I found Joey annoying at times and felt she took Pacey for granted and was very selfish when she was dating him. She was a better friend, then girlfriend to him.

Forwood4Bamon

oh understandable me too. I meant co mod, is that why you didn't like them?

Speedychatterbox

Not exactly, I didn't mind them in the beginning they had some cute moments. I didn't like how Joey behaved after PJ slept together for the first time, She was annoying and then there was her lying. I also felt she ignore all signs Pacey was suffering quite often because she was more focus on herself. I will admit that scene at Prom where he breaks up with her surprised the hell out of me when it aired but now I see it was a long time coming, she needed to be told off and call out on her crap.

TL22

When Joey slept with Pacey I have always felt she felt like she was doing him a favour. There was never the joy Andie and Pacey had.

Xelphia Kenny

Not to mention the staggering differences between the two experiences as well.

When Pacey had sex with Andie, it felt right and natural for both of the characters. The mutually blissful expressions on their faces when Pacey took Andie home pretty much said everything that needed to be expressed. All they could manage to say to each other was the words "thank you" over and over again. That must of been some amazing sex if they can barely speak.

But when Pacey and Joey had sex, it felt very forced from the beginning, middle, and end. The fact that Pacey even had to ask Joey if she enjoyed herself pretty much speaks volumes that they must of had some very bad sex. If sex is enjoyable, you don't have to ask and speaking of which, the awkward morning after conversation is so bad, I have to pause it several times in order to avoid feeling massive second hand embarrassment.