Reign - ♔King & Queen♕ {F♥M} #327: "I knew...Ever since I caught your eye, watching me dance at your sister's wedding. Feathers falling from nowhere." - Page 4

De Medici Queen · 02-22-2016, 01:48 PM

@The Affleck's fan your english is great! I know what you mean, I really do. Sometimes I think I'm just too angry at Mary and that I was actually Team Frary beacuse of Francis mostly, like Megan said in her SDCC Interview "I'm Team Frary you know, but only because I'm team Francis"

they were beautiful though in S1 and S3 was sweet too but I couldn't forget S2 completely, as much as I tried it wasn't the same with Mary

Monde never seemed like the love she had with Francis imo, but it felt like the beginning of something more than just lust, because seriously.. she could have had lust with her husband too if that's what she needed but for me it felt like more and made me so angry and sad

I didn't felt that way with Mash in S1 that's why I keep saying S1 Frary is real

DarkElfLass · 02-22-2016, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Affleck's fan (View Post)

Hi everyone! its my first coment here.

First of all sorry for my bad english. I hope you may understand what i write.

Hi Affleck's fan. Welcome to Fraryland. As you can see, I'm a new member to the forum as well. Thanks for posting even if you had to vent.

This is a safe place for all points of view as long as opinions are respectful and Frary loving. (This is the quality I love most about this forum; everyone is so nice about opposing POVs even though they've heard them a thousand times before. We newbies keep digging up the past.)

That said, your comments about a redemption arc for Mary were on point and just what I've wanted to say. I wish they hadn't ended S2 with Francis facing his death. That could have taken place toward the end of S3 after Frary was on a strong foundation following the events of S2. But it is what it is at this point, and we each have to process our grief, frustration, etc. in our own individual ways. Some fans can ignore it; some fans wouldn't watch S2 again unless you threatened them with bodily harm. But I'm one of those fans who revisits the whole story again and again, not just parts of it; therefore, I cannot ignore S2. Needless to say that little anal trait makes it impossible to forget how pissed off I was at Mary for being so mean and cruel and selfish. There, I've said it. Please don't judge me.

Even so, I STILL love Frary. They are one of my favorite ships. And I will continue to watch the series (at least the remainder of S3) mainly out of curiosity to see where the #reignwriters take Mary. I honestly don't think they can do much more damage to her after the S2 fiasco. So things have to look up, eh? Also her S3 antics with Catherine have been pure gold.

ETA:

Quote:

Originally Posted by De Medici Queen (View Post)

Sometimes I think I'm just too angry at Mary and that I was actually Team Frary beacuse of Francis mostly, like Megan said in her SDCC Interview "I'm Team Frary you know, but only because I'm team Francis"

they were beautiful though in S1 and S3 was sweet too but I couldn't forget S2 completely, as much as I tried it wasn't the same with Mary

Monde never seemed like the love she had with Francis imo, but it felt like the beginning of something more than just lust, because seriously.. she could have had lust with her husband too if that's what she needed but for me it felt like more and made me so angry and sad

I didn't felt that way with Mash in S1 that's why I keep saying S1 Frary is real

This in bold. That is exactly why I'm Team Frary because I am Team Francis first, last and always.

Emory

ParkDundee · 02-22-2016, 02:31 PM

Glad you joined and shared your thoughts about S2.

I seem to be posting most of the comments in defense of Mary, so I'll try to at least explain myself. I can't defend some of the choices the writer's made, which I am still not happy with. Yes, they sacrificed Frary for a season to make the show more ... entertaining, poignant? Really?

I think that Mary suffered through S2, and I have sympathy for her because she didn't know how to control what was happening. She didn't ask to live without a family, to become Queen when she was an infant or to marry the Dauphin of France. Accepting what the writer's say, she didn't really understand herself until the end of S2. And then, miraculously, it all came to her, practically overnight. Of course, it felt false and contrived.

At the end of S2, she said she would wait years for Francis to forgive her. And then in S3 she offered to sacrifice her life for his. Both out of her love for him.

I don't see our Mary in S1 being able to make either of those choices.

All is not well for me, however. Some of S2 is amazing, and exciting. But we lost an entire season of Frary, imo. And I can't stand Prince Conde. Our Prince, who seems to exclusively enjoys liaison's with married women. Oh, he knew that he was taking advantage of Mary's suffering.

The Affleck's fan · 02-22-2016, 07:08 PM

I was so used to read it when i was log out that when i log in i couldn´t see my messages and replies. I was thinking i was blocked LOL. A long time i haven´t posting in this forum. When you are log in the recent messages appear in the first page, right? i was seeing just the last page, how it appear when you are log out. lol

Thanks for the welcomes and understanding, De Medici Queen, DarkElfLass, Crumps5, ParkDundee and everyone!

Here are the images i posted in my first coment about Mary sentences in S.3:

Retroactively honest Francis - ...it is not so dreadful here

Retroactively Honest Mary Disclaimer: I sobbed my... - ...it is not so dreadful here

I understand all of you who still has sympathy towards Mary. And I´m glad for you. I wish i could still like her and be comprehensive about her acts like all you and Francis haha...
I wish i could see she show more acts of regret and love for Francis than a few words. For her betrayls i saw words and acts. Even when she stabbed Conde i feel like it was an act of convenience, to save herself and because Conde was not useful for her anymore too. Maybe icould convince myself of her love for Francis again if their whole reconciliation wasn´t so rushed.
For most episodes of S.2 She didn´t looked like she still loved him, and had some unfortunate phrases she told even in the last episodes, something like "Francis, we are like prisoners, so eh... we must forgive each other, there is no other way", etc.
the writers should spend a whole new Season or at least some episodes to rebuilding Mary´s character and Frary relatioship like they did building the whole affair situation to repair the damage they cause to.

So for me the *better option is try to block the whole season 2 after 2x05 of my mind.

DarkElfLass · 02-22-2016, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Affleck's fan (View Post)

Here are the images i posted in my first coment about Mary sentences in S.3:

Retroactively honest Francis - ...it is not so dreadful here

Retroactively Honest Mary Disclaimer: I sobbed my... - ...it is not so dreadful here

Thanks for the links.

The Affleck's fan · 02-22-2016, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crumps5 (View Post)

Welcome

I understood your English just fine

Unfortunately I cant see the images, hopefully they will appear later!

Thank you for sharing your thoughts! Although I do have to say, I never really believed Mary was truly in love with Conde, I think she was just confusing her gratitude for romantic feelings. He helped her when she needed it, but he took advantage of her situation. Perhaps at a push there was lust between them, but for me it never seemed like love.

Thanks too

I don´t think she loved Conde neither, or Bash or Francis (saying about this last one it sadly). These were words from Laurie e Adelaide.

Adelaide (via just jared jr): "...And I think the relationship with Conde was initially about healing and then became about love later down the line. I also believe there are different kinds of love and you love each partner you have differently".

Laurie talk about "The men Mary loves" ( mention to Francis and Conde) in a magazine, i don´t remember wich, before the Francis collapse ep. in S.2.

and talking about interviews, i think quite interesting what Adelaide said in this one, "Talk Nerdy With Us":

[TNWU] Throughout the show we see Mary go back and forth between her head and her heart, but what are your hopes for Mary this season as her leadership is going to be challenged by Elizabeth and dealing with all that?

[AK] I’d like to see her step up to the plate and make strong decisions, be a little less selfish, be a little bit more calculated. I think that she’s been a little bit back and forth the last couple of seasons and I am hoping she’ll mature more and be a little bit more consistent in the decisions she makes and look at [consequences] – because she ends up hurting people, and she doesn’t think things through. Being so inconsistent is very difficult to play. [laughs] It’s harder to like my character when she changes her mind on a dime. I love her, but I do get frustrated with her when she makes one decision one episode and completely changes her mind the next. We don’t get our episodes in advance so I can’t even stand up and be like “Oh God, how do I justify this choice?” I know it’s more dramatic that way, but I’m hoping for a little bit more consistency. I’m hoping that she’s grown up a little and has settled into a steadier more flexible managing style.

i totally agree. I think thats one of the reasons some like me find difficult empathize with Mary.

DarkElfLass · 02-22-2016, 07:35 PM

So, what I'm getting from Laurie's and Adelaide's remarks simply justifies my reaction to Mary in S2. Way to go, ladies. Keep making your heroine even less appealing to the audience than she is now.

Emory

The Affleck's fan · 02-22-2016, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by De Medici Queen (View Post)

@The Affleck's fan your english is great! I know what you mean, I really do. Sometimes I think I'm just too angry at Mary and that I was actually Team Frary beacuse of Francis mostly, like Megan said in her SDCC Interview "I'm Team Frary you know, but only because I'm team Francis"

they were beautiful though in S1 and S3 was sweet too but I couldn't forget S2 completely, as much as I tried it wasn't the same with Mary

Monde never seemed like the love she had with Francis imo, but it felt like the beginning of something more than just lust, because seriously.. she could have had lust with her husband too if that's what she needed but for me it felt like more and made me so angry and sad

I didn't felt that way with Mash in S1 that's why I keep saying S1 Frary is real

yeah, thats it! I´m still team Frary because I´m team Francis after the S.2 desaster lol

Also Adelaide and Toby have a amazing and rare chemistry. I wish they work together playing a couple again

**kerbear28** · 02-22-2016, 08:43 PM

Welcome to Fraryland, The Affleck's fan!

My name is Keri. I think your English is very good.

Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts. I dare say that many fans would agree with you. We all deserved better writing in Season 2 and a better, longer redemption arc for Mary.

I have read the interviews from Laurie and Adelaide that you quoted. It's frustrating, and it just highlights why some fans have found it so difficult to relate to and empathize with Mary.

I have always felt bad for Ade... It must have been difficult to perform when she couldn't fully understand the motivations of her character.

Even she was frustrated with Mary.

Thanks for sharing those images, too. I've seen them before, and I found them to be amusing and sadly accurate.

As for Conde, I don't believe she loved him (or Bash) - at least not in same way that she loves Francis. ("I will never love anyone the way I love you.) I've always felt her feelings for them were merely gratitude, loyalty, and maybe lust.

I am one of those fans who cannot simply ignore Season 2. Besides, the season brought us a few beautiful, poignant scenes that I wouldn't want to ignore even if I could. (Like Francis bringing Mary "fireflies" to comfort her after her miscarriage). So, my only option was to find a way to forgive Mary and sympathize with her. Even if her redemption arc in regards to Francis was too rushed, it was enough to renew my faith in her love for him. She was willing to sacrifice her life for his. Like Stephen (ParkDundee) said, she has grown a lot since Season 1. Regardless, I will always love Frary, because I will always love Francis.

I suppose I'm Team Frary because I'm Team Francis.

OH...I agree with you about Toby and Ade's chemistry. It's special and rare and magical.

I would give anything to see them onscreen together again.

The Affleck's fan · 02-22-2016, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkElfLass (View Post)

Thanks for the links.

you are welcome

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkElfLass (View Post)

So, what I'm getting from Laurie's and Adelaide's remarks simply justifies my reaction to Mary in S2. Way to go, ladies. Keep making your heroine even less appealing to the audience than she is now.

Emory

ParkDundee · 02-22-2016, 08:59 PM

I agree with you, Keri.

I suppose I'm biased. I've fallen under Mary's spell.

enchantedstarlight · 02-22-2016, 09:03 PM

Welcome, The Affleck's fan.

I really can't comment much because I haven't watched all of season 2. Luckily, I'm left with only positive memories from the early episodes (the Coronation and fireflies scene) because I gave up pretty early on.

And yes, Toby & Ade have wonderful chemistry.

So amazing and rare, like you said - I'd love to see them onscreen together again

Speaking of Toby & Ade, I miss the days when the Tobelaide thread on here was thriving and active.

The Affleck's fan · 02-22-2016, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerbear28 (View Post)

Welcome to Fraryland, The Affleck's fan!

My name is Keri. I think your English is very good.

Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts. I dare say that many fans would agree with you. We all deserved better writing in Season 2 and a better, longer redemption arc for Mary.

I've have read the interviews from Laurie and Adelaide that you quoted. It's frustrating, and it just highlights why some fans have found it so difficult to relate to and empathize with Mary.

I have always felt bad for Ade... It must have been difficult to perform when she couldn't fully understand the motivations of her character.

Even she was frustrated with Mary.

Thanks for sharing those images, too. I've seen them before, and I found them to be amusing and sadly accurate.

As for Conde, I don't believe she loved him (or Bash) - at least not in same way that she loves Francis. ("I will never love anyone the way I love you.) I've always felt her feelings for them were merely gratitude, loyalty, and maybe lust.

I am one of those fans who cannot simply ignore Season 2. Besides, the season brought us a few beautiful, poignant scenes that I wouldn't want to ignore even if I could. (Like Francis bringing Mary "fireflies" to comfort her after her miscarriage). So, my only option was to find a way to forgive Mary and sympathize with her. Even if her redemption arc in regards to Francis was too rushed, it was enough to renew my faith in her love for him. She was willing to sacrifice her life for his. Like Stephen (ParkDundee) said, she has grown a lot since Season 1. Regardless, I will always love Frary, because I will always love Francis.

I suppose I'm Team Frary because I'm Team Francis.

OH...I agree with you about Toby and Ade's chemistry. It's special and rare and magical.

I would give anything to see them onscreen together again.

Thank you! Nice to meet you. Its great "talk" to all of you

Ignore the PM i sent to you. Like you see, i can see the messages now lol

"As for Conde, I don't believe she loved him (or Bash) - at least not in same way that she loves Francis. ("I will never love anyone the way I love you.) I've always felt her feelings for them were merely gratitude, loyalty, and maybe lust. "

yeah, i think we are supossed to see it this way, like she loves Francis more. But after the S.2 and it bad writing, i just can´t, as a point of view of this situation. I think Mary doesn´t know what truly love someone really is. Glad for any of you who can see that way though...

yeah, i love Francis bringing Mary "fireflies" scene too! it was sad but so beautiful, one of the best of them

And its the perfect end of S.2 for me.
I remember how sad i was , and emotinal and shipping Frary because of this beautiful scene and others from that ep. And also pissed at the writers because Mary´s pregnancy and miscarriage in one episode. But oh these were happy times, we didn´t know how worse things would turn lol

Quote:

Originally Posted by enchantedstarlight (View Post)

Welcome, The Affleck's fan.

I really can't comment much because I haven't watched all of season 2. Luckily, I'm left with only positive memories from the early episodes (the Coronation and fireflies scene) because I gave up pretty early on.

And yes, Toby & Ade have wonderful chemistry.

So amazing and rare, like you said - I'd love to see them onscreen together again

Speaking of Toby & Ade, I miss the days when the Tobelaide thread on here was thriving and active.

Yes, luckily. I regretted having watched most episodes of S.2

I´m missing tabelaide pictures too. There is not so many pictures of them together, and I heard they didnt get along so much (i don´t know if its true. but sometimes Adelaide looked annoyed at Toby in interviews or maybe she just looked annoyed because Tobelaide, frary shippers. what matters she *used to be such a frary shipper lol) ... and, maybe this tension between them was the secret of their amazing chemistry or whatever but i just know they should repeat it

work together once again, please! lol

I heard Toby has a new project and he is in Toronto again.
i wish he could visit the cast and someone post pictures of them

Ps: sorry for these double posts. I don´t know how post more than one quote in one post :/

**kerbear28** · 02-22-2016, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ParkDundee (View Post)

I agree with you, Keri.

I suppose I'm biased. I've fallen under Mary's spell.

Me too. I just love her and want her to be happy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by enchantedstarlight (View Post)

Speaking of Toby & Ade, I miss the days when the Tobelaide thread on here was thriving and active.

Me too.

Ugh, my poor Tobelaide heart.

Why can't those two just interact? WHY?! Right now I'm just PRAYING that they both attend Torrance and Alyssa's wedding. Just one picture PLEASE God.

The Affleck's fan, I merged your double posts.

Do your best to avoid that from now on. Here's how I usually post two or more quotes in one post:

Click "Reply with Quote" on the first post that you want to quote. COPY everything in the reply field, including the quote tags.

Hit the back arrow once. Click "Reply with Quote" on the second post you want to quote. PASTE the first quote into the reply field before or after the second quote. Repeat until you have as many quotes as you want in the reply field.

There may be an easier way, but that usually works for me.

enchantedstarlight · 02-22-2016, 10:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kerbear28 (View Post)

Me too.

Ugh, my poor Tobelaide heart.

Why can't those two just interact? WHY?! Right now I'm just PRAYING that they both attend Torrance and Alyssa's wedding. Just one picture PLEASE God.

I know.

Me too. I just want something, anything from these two.

If only Toby wasn't allergic to social media...

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Fan Forum > TV Shows - Past > Reign > ♔King & Queen♕ {F♥M} #327: "I knew...Ever since I caught your eye, watching me dance at your sister's wedding. Feathers falling from nowhere."