[keep the starlight]

Well, that I didn't and don't fully understand, even now. I was just pointing out that I don't feel she should've or needed to apologize to Casey.

I just feel like while the writers have taken the time to allow the Casey character to grow a substantial amount, they haven't really given or allowed the same thing to happen with other female characters, especially Rebecca and Ashleigh, IMO. Ashleigh isn't made to be "bad" or mean but she also isn't much more than Casey's BFF and Calvin's friend at this point in time.

[jules166]

But with Ashleigh, she's a sweet girl. She has her little flaws, but I don't see her as needing to improve her character.

They did try to make Rebecca more likable by pairing her up with Cappie. But it didn't work for me.

I see a ton of improvement in Frannie though. I really like her since episode 15, the flashback episode.

I also see more improvement in Evan too.

[keep the starlight]

Yes, Ash is a sweet girl, but she hasn't been given material that allows her growth. It's not so much improvement. Give her material that doesn't make her look shallow or pretty dumb, IMO.

They, on the other hand, have given Rebecca mostly snarky material and shown her as a "troublemaker" in the ZBZ house. Simply pairing her up with Cappie or reminding us that her dad is scum isn't going to work wonders for everyone because they haven't given her nearly enough vulnerable/likeable moments, IMO. Though, I personally found myself feeling quite sympathetic toward the character in the finale.

[***BLONDIE***]

Well IMHO, Rebecca has been given more to work with then poor Ashleigh, infact, sometime's I forget about poor Ashleigh.

I think character developement is good and while I don't want to see Rebecca turn nice all of a sudden, like Brooke and Summer did, I don't want to continue to see her with Cappie either. Not because it's Cappie and I want him with Casey, but it's because they have managed to turn Rebecca into a Casey "wannabe" by having her sleep with not one, but both of Casey's ex's and that's kinda twisted and not in a good way. They need to allow her to have her own relationship, that isn't tied to Casey and right now, both of her hook-up's are Casey's seconds and I feel that her character could be given her own identity, cause all I see is someone who seems to want, someone else's life. I love a good bitch, so maybe they'll end up letting Rebecca meet someone, that Casey hasn't slept with first.

Ashleigh too, she needs a good guy.

[MethodicWays]

I think that's why I like Rebecca and everyone else in the square/pentagon/trapezoid. I'm actually rooting for ALL of them. Rebecca, in that group of people, is the youngest and has far more growing to do. She reacts and acts irresponsibly and for someone who has never had to take responsibility for herself, she's not going to change overnight. Frannie was kicked out of ZBZ and forced to confront her actions, Casey was put in the leadership role and had Evan dump her, so ostensibly she was also forced to examine herself. Rebecca hasn't had that moment yet because her actions largely stem from her relationship with her father. That's not an excuse though. Eventually she has to realize that trying to get back at her father is not a get-out-of-jail-free card. As an adult she has to own up to the things she's done but she hasn't been placed in the position to do so yet. I'm still advocating for her not to become a ZBZ sister.

And I truly disagree with whoever said Rusty owns up to his mistakes. IMO, sometimes Rusty can be the hardest person for me to watch. Especially when it comes to Evan/Calvin. He really can't stand Calvin being friends with Evan and even though Evan hurt Casey, Casey is not the only victim in that relationship. Plus, Evan is Calvin's big brother and like he said, Evan has always treated him well. I just really can't stand how childish Rusty acts when it comes to that situation. I'd put Rebecca and Rusty on the same level of maturity which is why I liked the episode where he had to interact with her. I think it showed how similar they are emotionally.

I think the other thing someone said is that "if you're old enough to be in college, you're old enough to take responsibility for yourself" or something along those lines. Okay, I've been thru college and I've been out for a couple of years now. The truth is, when you're entering college, you're still effectively a high school student. It takes a while to grow out of that. I was lucky, I went to a boarding school, so leaving home, etc. wasn't a transition for me and I got into the swing of things very early and got to watch my peers struggle thru it. There were people who effectively acted like high school students thru their sophomore year. And after graduating and entering the workforce guess what I found out? Some people were still stuck in high school mode. Age has nothing to do with your level of maturity.

[~Brady~]

Originally Posted by tootyfnfrooty (View Post) HEATH i love calvin/heath calvin/micheal is a big for me

Same. But I do enjoy seeing Deputy Leo again. (VM anyone?)

[tootyfnfrooty]

Originally Posted by MethodicWays (View Post) I think that's why I like Rebecca and everyone else in the square/pentagon/trapezoid. I'm actually rooting for ALL of them. Rebecca, in that group of people, is the youngest and has far more growing to do. She reacts and acts irresponsibly and for someone who has never had to take responsibility for herself, she's not going to change overnight. Frannie was kicked out of ZBZ and forced to confront her actions, Casey was put in the leadership role and had Evan dump her, so ostensibly she was also forced to examine herself. Rebecca hasn't had that moment yet because her actions largely stem from her relationship with her father. That's not an excuse though. Eventually she has to realize that trying to get back at her father is not a get-out-of-jail-free card. As an adult she has to own up to the things she's done but she hasn't been placed in the position to do so yet. I'm still advocating for her not to become a ZBZ sister. And I truly disagree with whoever said Rusty owns up to his mistakes. IMO, sometimes Rusty can be the hardest person for me to watch. Especially when it comes to Evan/Calvin. He really can't stand Calvin being friends with Evan and even though Evan hurt Casey, Casey is not the only victim in that relationship. Plus, Evan is Calvin's big brother and like he said, Evan has always treated him well. I just really can't stand how childish Rusty acts when it comes to that situation. I'd put Rebecca and Rusty on the same level of maturity which is why I liked the episode where he had to interact with her. I think it showed how similar they are emotionally. I think the other thing someone said is that "if you're old enough to be in college, you're old enough to take responsibility for yourself" or something along those lines. Okay, I've been thru college and I've been out for a couple of years now. The truth is, when you're entering college, you're still effectively a high school student. It takes a while to grow out of that. I was lucky, I went to a boarding school, so leaving home, etc. wasn't a transition for me and I got into the swing of things very early and got to watch my peers struggle thru it. There were people who effectively acted like high school students thru their sophomore year. And after graduating and entering the workforce guess what I found out? Some people were still stuck in high school mode. Age has nothing to do with your level of maturity.

ITA well said imo rusty many time comes off as the most immature he was upset with calvin for the majority of the season because he didn't get his way...he was mad because calvin didn't say anything with the duck tape incident even though calvin did his best to try to talk rusty out of going in there with a speach even his own brothers would not have welcomed also he just expected calvin to hate evan because he did and because of his percieved victimization of casey by evan and i totally agree that casey was not the only victim in that scenario they both did terrible things casey even used cappie to get back at evan; she used a person that had actual feelings for her just to get back at him for sleeping with rebecca and unless i missed it, which is very possibls i don't remember her apologizing to cappie (sincerely or otherwise for her actions).
i hated the way rebecca treated cappie when her dad came he did not deserve that because he really wanted to meet her parents and make a good impression on them. But also imho she felt awful about what she had done to him and i think her apology was very sincere)

and linds you made an excellent point for the most part rebecca has only been given snarky stuff the only times she has ever shown vulnerabilty is with cappie and a couple times with ashleigh when no one else is around, next season i hope they have her just a tad nicer to others and have her grow up a little bit

[rachem_chul]

Originally Posted by faith grows old (View Post) I personally found Calvin/Heath much more interesting, and their chem. much more natural. I just don't believe this thing with the professor.

I totally agree! Cal/Prof seems very forced.

[keep the starlight]

^ Doesn't it, though? I respect the writers for exploring the storyline, but the chemistry just isn't there for me.

[***BLONDIE***]

Yeah, I am so not digging Calvin's storyline. He seriously needs to meet someone naturally without anyone hooking him up and it needs to be with someone that can connect with him. Although I love Heath, I didn't feel it with them either.

Maybe he'll meet someone new in season 2.

[MethodicWays]

I like Deputy Leo just not in this character. I think he's trying to push Calvin into being his version of what gay should be and although I do think there are parts of himself that he holds back from his frat brothers essentially Calvin is never going to be the stereotypical gay man.

[tootyfnfrooty]

Originally Posted by MethodicWays (View Post) I like Deputy Leo just not in this character. I think he's trying to push Calvin into being his version of what gay should be and although I do think there are parts of himself that he holds back from his frat brothers essentially Calvin is never going to be the stereotypical gay man.

i feel that way too.
calvin and heath niether one are stereotypical and i don't think either of them feel the need to be, that is one of the things i loved about them as a couple

[stella7gem]

I'd put Rebecca and Rusty on the same level of maturity which is why I liked the episode where he had to interact with her. I think it showed how similar they are emotionally.

This is why I think there is going to be a Rebecca/Rusty pairing in the future. There are so similar but so different. They are both very vunerable emotionally i think.

I think the theme of Rusty is how you mature when you are in college. So Rusty isn't mature yet, but he will become mature. you need to experience like bad stuff to become mature. Calvin who is Rusty's age, has gone through a lot more and is a lot more mature than Rusty.

[keep the starlight]

The idea of Rebecca/Rusty freaks me out. Now Rebecca/Beaver, I think I could get behind. Hee.

[MethodicWays]

I love the Beav. I'd even pair him with Ashleigh. Everyone could use some Beaver in their life. Me most of all