Eva Diva

If I see any Dolly J fanart using those scenes from Love Lockdown, I will say it's the most ugliest piece of crap ever. Icons, gifs, banners being used in a positive and beautiful way of these scenes (ie. Their love will never die, Chemistry is still there) gets a thumbs down from me. I have my flame-resistant gear ready

shance

Thought I'd let you guys know I was watching the first episode of S4, with Paige's trial. Dean's lawyer was asking questions which strongly resemble the arguments made by those who claim Declan never raped Holly J. The great thing is that Paige argues that whether she found him attractive at first, whether she (supposedly) could have easily escaped, whether he was violent or used a weapon, whether she enjoyed it at first, whether she wanted it at first...it's all irrelevant. All that matters is she said "no" and he did it anyway, which means it is RAPE.

It also shows that, at some point, the writers were aware of rape culture and misconceptions about rape. Oh, Degrassi... how you've changed.

By the way, I used to love Dolly J,but "abandoned ship" so to speak after getting a bad taste in my mouth from Love Lockdown.

mellifluouscloud

You know what... you just gave me a really good idea for a vid. I would love to see clips of Dean's lawyer juxtaposed with clips from Love Lockdown to illustrate your point. Does anyone want to take on this project? Otherwise I'll add it to my to-do list.

Degrassi seems to be condoning a lot of illegal acts lately. Teacher-student relationships, paying for organs, rape... So much for being "educational."

shance

Degrassi's writing was so much better back then that even in the episode when it happened (Shout pt. 1 from S2), viewers knew that what Dean did was horrible. Even though Paige did find him attractive, did (if I remember correctly) consume alcohol, did lead him upstairs, did enjoy it at first (by her own admission in the trial), and lied to Spinner to pretty much go hook up with Dean (a guy she barely knew); everyone still knew it was rape and that Dean was very wrong to do what he did.

Nekoshoujo

So I was writing something about Love Lockdown recently and I think it's the first time I've even come out and said how I really feel about that episode and it made me realize that I had pretty much erased the entire senerio from my mind. Like I've rewatched the episode 500 times and I think I've only rewatched the A-plot in it's entiredy twice. Like that episode was about Eclare. I only vaguely remember Declan being in it. And when I thought out that I think it finally hit me how much this plot bothered me. Like I really hurts seeing how this episode was scene as romantic and a beautiful symbol of Declan and HJ's undying love. I don't think I've ever fully thought about the gravity of that.

I was thinking about how I've been disappointed in HJ's storyline this season. And I keep saying it's because she's lost her spirit. That the fire inside is gone in a way. During this whole Dawn situation I kept waiting for her start fighting harder. To get her spark back. And then it made me wonder if this is really a sign of HJ dealing with the aftermath of the rape. Maybe Holly J really has lost her spark. Maybe the emotional toll of forcing herself to believe everything was fine killed the fire inside her. I don't think the writers will ever address this, but after thinking about this, I can't rewatch her season 11 scenes the same way anymore.


yup. It's sad. Maybe this is really just a reflection of how much worse Rape Culture has become. I was talking about this with someone resently and we got on the topic of the word **** and its use in society today. It's interesting because now it's not uncommon for high school girls to aspire to be ****s. I'm not even kidding or saying this in a judging way. I've actually met young girls who want to be seen this way because that's what boys want. Boys use the word and then hook up with the girls they call ****s. So it's not shocking that girls see this persona as something that will help them get a guy. What is shocking is that today, in the year 2011 girls still see getting a guy as their life aspiration. I will never forget this moment I shared with my cousin once. She standing there with no college education, with no job, raising two kids before she's twenty three and she says "At least I have a man." I wanted to be mad at her but honestly all I felt was pity. And so it doesn't surprise me when teen girls watch Love Lockdown and call it romantic. Holly J got to have sex with a handsome, rich, charismatic guy who's in love with her. What has she got to complain about right?


I would really love to see a comparison vid of Dean's lawyer and Declan! That would be perfect.


edit: I noticed I'm not on the list may I be added pretty please?

JustMe2000

I added you to the list.

Oh Matt, we know you wrote Love Lockdown just like you wrote this episode. Roses and a pretty little card isn't going to make us forget what happened.

Mayberry

Send him back the dead roses and an educational pamphlet to go with it. :/

Nekoshoujo

Whatever! The card was facing away from HJ. She probably didn't want to look at it.

Oh-Canada

Ugh..

I have many things to say, but it is 5:30 in the morning.

Ultimately, I hate how they want us to believe that HJ is going off to Yale to be reunited with Declan. Especially with that "see you in the fall" tweet last night. Although I find it amusing that they are kind of hinting that HJ and Declan will get back together, but not outright saying it because they know we would be upset.

Nekoshoujo

yeah, I was thinking that.

Well I hope after all she's been through, she gets to Yale realizes the truth of the situation, and makes it clear they will never be together again. Yale's a big school it won't be hard to avoid each other.

shance

So they want us to believe that Holly J, a character we know to be amazingly strong and admirable, is going to run off into the sunset with her rapist?

JustMe2000

Did anyone read this new interview with Charlotte? I really do hope TPTB are feeding her the stuff that she says about Declan and Holly J. Then again, now that I think about it, I don't know if I want them to be doing any feeding to anybody. Ugh. What a mess.

Oh-Canada

IDK the thing is that they definitely didn't go into LL thinking "in this episode Declan is going to rape Holly J." I don't think that was what they intended. But unfortunately that was how it came across. They didn't take it seriously enough.

I just wish they would say something in response to the criticism or at least acknowledge how we feel about it.

MD9999

I just don't like how underhanded the card is. Like TPTB just slip it in to please the fans without regard to the implications. If they want, they should at least make the get together official so that it is easier to criticize than this sort of hinting.

@nekoshoujo (about your recent long post)

Your theory about HJ losing her spark because she's coping makes so much sense. It makes me kind of sick. I've been annoyed at her for a while-maybe it started before LL (IDK) but it has definitely been strongest in late season ten and season 11. I have just been wondering what happened to, as you put it, the spark. HJ was always sort of fresh and witty, with her little barbed comments and generally being awesome. That has been lacking recently, and it makes sense that her trauma would cause that. It just really bothers me because it's like Declan snuffed out the Holly J. I loved and I don't know if she'll ever heal (and we certainly won't see it onscreen)

Just a thought--maybe her illness was partially brought on by the trauma as well? I've heard that emotional turmoil can make you much more vulnerable to illness...IDK

kaleidocat

I had a feeling we'd get some mention of Declan. On one level I can appreciate that the writers tried to give closure to all the seniors and reflect on the relationships they've been in throughout high school. But on the other hand it feels like we've gone unheard with our concerns about Love Lockdown. It would just be nice to be acknowledged. We're not some angry fan girl mob that is upset about who is endgame and who is not.

Once again I hope this is the last we hear from Declan.