kerbear28

NotDoneAbusingYou

Thanks Keri.

Scottish_Queen

I thought this was a strong all around episode. I cried with the first Catherine scene.



I'll post more once it airs. I'm excited to watch it again.

drunkalice

Nice episode.

wickedrum

De Medici Queen

Oh I usually like to wait to write without spoilers tags but

drunkalice

kerbear28

So I finally got to watch the episode live! It was really good!

France
- Catcisse is back baby!!! They are PURE GOLD. It was so wonderful to see them working together against the "Spanish aggression." Narcisse did NOT like it when the Cardinal had his hands on Catherine's womb.
- Grandma Catherine reunited with Jon! So sweet. And it was so lovely to hear Francis mentioned again. It was sad that Narcisse refused to be a part of the boy's life because he reminds him too much of Lola.
- Catherine scolding her lady for not stirring the poison. And then Leeza making her poor servant drink Catherine's perfume because she thinks it's poison.
- Saint Claude the miracle worker. That was classic. Seriously, though... I find it really sweet that Claude has found comfort in religion following Leith's death. I almost understand Leeza attacking Catherine (all of her children think she's a "bad mother") but why go after Claude?
- Oh, Charles, what is wrong with you??? I can't believe he probably killed that poor girl. Catherine seems so worried.

Scotland
- Ugh, am I really supposed to buy Mary and Gideon as some "great love." I feel NOTHING. Gideon is a great guy, and I truely believe he wanted to save Mary's life (and secure peace), but... When Mary told James to let Darnley leave Scotland, I literally screamed, "Noooooo!!! You stupid girl!" And then Lady Lennox's revelations just confirmed it.
- Lord Blackburn, Mary did not simply "adore" Francis. He was the love of her life, and he understood that she would always be a QUEEN who would NEVER abandon her people. If you don't know that, you don't know Mary.
- I can't believe Mary even considered abdicating, but thank GOD she came to her senses at the end. I loved this exchange:
Gideon: I fear I'm looking at a dead woman.
Mary: We all die, Gideon. What matters is what we stand for while we live.

- Loved the James/Greer interactions in this episode. I still ship them, but I'm intrigued by James and Lady Knox, too. Something about the bad boy and the innocent little lamb... it's exciting.
- Lady Lennox trying to be the poor man's Catherine. She does make me feel sympathy for Darnley and Keira, though.

England
- Very little Elizabeth this episode, but what we saw was pretty profound. She is very fearful. I actually believe that the fortifications on the estate she offered to Mary were intended for Mary's own protection, though. But she was right...only one queen can survive.

NotDoneAbusingYou

Keri you practically reiterated my thoughts nearly to the word.

drunkalice

That was kind of silly to me, to be honest, because weren't most castle fortresses? They certainly were until the 15th century. They could have picked a deal breaker that made a little more sense.
Anyway it's fitting for Elizabeth's character to be fearful/borderline paranoid. She was her father's daughter (and grandfather's granddaughter) after all.

Scottish_Queen

I really loved the entire episode.

French Court

We've all said it but it was so awesome to see Narcisse back conspiring with Catherine to take Leeza down. Catherine and John were precious, and I really felt for Narcisse. I hope he softens and can find a way to be there for John again. They've all lost so much and are fighting like mad to keep France together.

Catherine as always was hilarious- her poisoning gone wrong, her magical womb, St. Claude So really is the glue that keeps France of crashing down. It irks that all of her ungrateful kids hate her so much. I was missing Francis a lot, he was her golden child and even through their disagreements he knew that she was just trying to do the best she could for her family.

Charles is scary, if I didn't know better I'd think he was some sort of psycho vampire.

Scotland

Mary's whole abdication story I actually liked. I thought it really underlined the differences between her and Elizabeth. Mary leads with her heart. She wants to trust in people, she wants to do what's best for her people, and she wants to be loved.

She actually thought Elizabeth was going to stand by her word and as nice of an idea that is, it's impossible in the world they live in and it was a sad moment when that reality finally hit Mary.

I didn't expect to enjoy her and Gideon but I did. It was sweet and he really just wanted to save her life. I'm glad it's over though and we can move on to the Darnley chapter ...as insane as that's probably going to be.

It's going to be war now.

This was a great scene. Mary's not afraid of death, she knows her time is most likely limited and she's going to make it count.

-I liked Lady Lennox more probably because she actually opened Mary's eyes to the reality of this doomed plan.
-Greer/James - I want to ship this but it seems like they are going to keep the Castleroy family intact which is fine (hope we get to meet Baby Rose soon!)
-Mrs. Knox...I don't know. She's too nice. She's probably a demon lady pretending to be this sweet little woman.


England
Agree, there wasn't a ton of scenes but what we did get was so intense. I don't believe that she was going to protect Mary. Gideon's plan was her perfect opportunity to finally imprision Mary for good and remove her as a threat for forever.

That's the horrible thing about these too, they really both can't survive because as long as Mary lives she'll be a Catholic target and a huge threat to Elizabeth's rule. At heart Elizabeth doesn't want to kill her, that I believe. But she knows better than Mary that she'll have to kill her in the end.

Such a compelling story, I'm so happy with how they are portraying Elizabeth this season.

drunkalice

That would be interesting.

kerbear28

Good point. Just because a castle is fortified at this time doesn't mean it's intended to be used as a prison. But the way they are portraying Elizabeth as fearful and paranoid is appropriate.

Lindsay, we are pretty much in complete agreement.

I really felt for him, too. He's still grieving. After some time, I hope he will be able to be in Jon's life.

I always miss Francis, but especially now. I just want Catherine's kids to work WITH her and not against her. At least she has Narcisse back to help her hold France (and the Valois line) together.

Well said. Mary's heart and trusting nature is part of why I love her, and it was heartbreaking when the reality set in.

It's not that I didn't enjoy them together or that it wasn't sweet. He's just... not Francis. Like you said, I'm just glad that it's over and we can finally move on to the next chapter.



True. She's is a schemer, but at least she opened Mary's eyes to the truth.

Well, if they want to keep the Castleroy family together, they need to bring Castleroy and Rose back in the picture!

It would be interesting if there really was a dark side to Lady Knox... we'll have to wait and see. She seems so sincere right now, but it could all be an act.

Maybe you're right... Maybe Elizabeth never intended to keep her word and protect Mary. I guess I wanted to believe it as badly as Mary did. I really do think she has a fondness for her cousin and wants her to be safe. However, she knows Mary will always be a threat and she will have to eliminate her in order to survive.

Scottish_Queen

I think at heart Elizabeth would have loved to make this plan a success. She wants to protect her rule without harming Mary. But she's older and has been on the throne longer and knows this is impossible.

She's illegitimate in the eyes of most everyone while Mary is a blue blood undisputed royal. So as long as Mary is alive in the world, even if she abdicates or does everything possible to defer to Elizabeth it will never matter. All those outside forces would conspire to put Mary on the throne no matter Mary's personal feelings.

The only way to secure Elizabeth's rule is for Mary to be dead. Gideon's plan gave her an easy way to imprison Mary and eventually get rid of her.

The struggle is sad but fascinating. I'm really curious to see Reign's spin on the end of Mary's life. I like that she's facing the idea of death without fear.

I understand, it's really hard when you love a couple and one leaves or dies and the other is trying to go on. At least with Darnley....that will most likely be the opposite of an epic love story lol. More like an epic disaster

drunkalice

I don't think Elizabeth was trying to trick Mary and keep her imprisoned, I believe her heart meant well but her head was going to stay weary just in case. The one sure thing about wars for a throne is as long as a contender is alive they can gather an army.

What I don't particularly like about all this is how innocent and shiny Mary is coming across as. I wish the show could just be honest and tell us that she was entitled enough go after her cousin's throne. If she married Darnley and not some ambassador it wasn't because Elizabeth supposedly tried to lock her somewhere, it's because she actively saught for the guy. We shouldn't be afraid to show some greyness.