Mei Zhuo

true, its sad that Sam missed out on knowing how Mary and John were back then. All Sam had evern known about Mary was what little stories that he was told and pictures, and as for John, well all he has ever known was hunter John, and that's so sad. But I understand also that this was Dean's journey to take.

Tennessee Whiskey

List Added. Finally!

Folie

For the list!!!!

Thanks Bee!

Wynter

I guess that's true, and it fits in with what Castiel told Dean about him needing to see the past, because otherwise he wouldn't have believed it himself, but still. His own brother told him, I still would've expected Sam to be a bit more like "you're freakin' kidding me, no way!" I don't know why it bugs me so much, but it does! I just feel like he was too calm.

I know what you mean, but to be fair, I think Sam really was shocked. His expression was one of disbelief and the way he sort of whispered "what?" when Dean told him what Castiel had said genuinely gave me the impression that he was taken-aback, and didn't expect Dean to say anything like that at all. I think it was made more shocking by the fact that God apparently had an interest in Sam using his powers, especially since Sam himself is the one who's always had faith, so for him to hear that, after the whole time he's been using his powers for "good", was a huge blow, and I think you could tell it affected him. Jared played that well.

Folie

Well to be fair we only caught the end of that conversation so I don't think we can really say what his initial reaction was...



I agree! I might have some issues with Dean's wording, but I think that Sam's reaction was dead on!


The main issue I have with Sam using his powers, even for "good" is that basically it went totally against what Dean asked of him in NRFTW...
To "remember what John tought him. What Dean taught him," and I really thought it was something Sam would have stuck by. That is my biggest disappointement in the situation.

SPF40

^Folie, that is also my biggest problem with Sam using his powers this season!

Thanks for the list, Bee!

Wynter

Ah, that's a good point! Hadn't thought of that, but it makes sense. It's still a bit of a disappointment though, that we didn't get to see the whole of that conversation. It would've been kinda intense, I think.

That's so true, using his powers was basically an insult to the memories of John and Dean, so it sucks hard that he went against their wishes and didn't think about what they told him.

hiddleskittlesღ

i loved that jensen was the only one billed... call me selfish, but i loved that it was "his" episode

Folie

I was reading some reports over at Lj and some avid Sam girls were really pissed of that it was a "Dean show" episode.
Personally I think that an exageration and that is not the Dean girl inme talking.
I'm sure we'll eventually get a full Sam episode too to even things out, as it usually happens on the show!

Tennessee Whiskey

^ agreed, and we have had Sam episodes before, take AHBL for example, it's not Dean's fault that the episode centered around him was more interesting.

That is also the main issue I have with it. How could he just blow off everything he has ever known and just go down that path, and then to lie about it, straight to Dean's face after Dean asked him point blank! I admit I set high expectations for Sam, but I think these things were not asking for much. I'm very disappointed in him.

Folie

And it's not like I don't completely understnad his devestation, because I do! I mean look at Dean and John and Mary! They made deals!!! I get it. I just thought that if there was a line not to be crossed, it would be that, and I was expecting more from Sam....

SPF40

Well, as a fan who loves both Sam and Dean equally and couldn't classify herself an *insert singled-out, preferred Winchester here*-girl if she tried, therefore is not at all biased - I also agree that calling it "The Dean Show" is a bit of a ridiculous exaggeration. Personally, as much as I would have loved for Sammy to discover the family's past too and as much as I would have loved more Jared-time for the episode, I'm also content with his absence. I think it would have made such an epic-sode even busier than it was, and would have pushed it to the point of being too intricate to follow. If Sam was there, another point of view would have been tossed into the mix and that would have been too much to cover. Sam's presence would have thrown off the powerful vibe and atmosphere that the sheer focus on Dean's experience brought the episode. Besides, the storyline was solely of Dean's chance to discover his history, for the sake of saving Sam from his dark path. Had Sam been there, we would have had a totally different episode, and a totally different string of episodes to follow. I think the episode was perfect as it is, Sam or no Sam, so why complain?

Folie

^ Exactly! It would have been too crowded, and it wouldn't hav really managed to get the point it wanted to across!


Going back to the family talk, I was watching ITB again and I realised, no scenes between John and Samuel, as Samuel.... Sad
It would have been nice to see Papa Campbell playing disapproving father trying to keep himself civil and in check.

Wynter

You worded that so brilliantly And I'm so glad there's someone who can take the neutral route and be fair about the fact it was Dean's episode and not his fault Sam was absent. To be honest, I love Sam to pieces, but the fact he wasn't there didn't bother me because the content of the episode was so amazing and enthralling as it was, that I didn't even think about what was missing. And if Sam had been there, it would've made the whole thing too complicated and too much to take in, and then the episode could've just gone badly. It was perfect the way it was!

Captain Oatsocute

Well said Nella. I just can't imagine Sam being involved heavily in this episode. It just wouldn't have worked. And I'm not just saying that cause I'm a Dean girl.

Oh and Folie, it would have been great to see Samuel and John together. I would have loved to of seen Samuel mocking John's naivety as a normal "civilian" especially knowing that the John we know would kick Samuel's ass on a hunting gig.