[comic fan]

Interview with Angel:Barbary Coast writer David Tischman and preview pages.

Tischman Books Angel a Trip to "Barbary Coast" - Comic Book Resources

Tischman Books Angel a Trip to "Barbary Coast"

In "Barbary Coast," Angel visits 1906 San Francisco's seediest district in search of a cure for his troublesome soul. We spoke with David Tischman about filling in the gaps of Angel's undead life

by Shaun Manning, Staff Writer

Before he was the heroic but tormented vampire with a soul, and after his days as one of Europe's most ruthless bloodsuckers, Angel was simply a vamp with a curse who would do anything to shake it off. In "Angel: Barbary Coast," a three-issue miniseries debuting in April from IDW Publishing, Angel finds himself in turn-of-the-twentieth-century San Francisco in search of a man who might just hold the secret to curing the gypsy curse - and getting rid of that pesky soul once and for all. As with all things Angel, though, things are not quite so straightforward. CBR News spoke with writer David Tischman about the series, which features Franco Urru on art.

"'Barbary Coast' is set in 1906, so Angel's really only been in America a short time. And he's still dealing with this whole 'soul' thing. He's not happy about it, and he'd do anything to get rid of it," Tischman said of the series' set-up. "If there's one thing I know, it's guilt - not a pleasant thing. So this is not Angel the good guy, or even Angel the tortured vampire - this is a pissed-off Angel who's doing what he needs to do to get what he needs. That's what attracted me to this story, and he's been fun to write because of that."

As to why Angel makes the journey to the Bay Area, Tischman said, "There's always been a large Asian population in San Francisco, and Angel comes to town looking for a specific healer, a Chinese Medicine man named Xin. He's heard Xin can do amazing things with spells and potions and elixirs - and he's hoping Xin can do something to get rid of the Gypsy's curse."

The setting itself will play a significant role in "Angel: Barbary Coast," as the city of San Francisco finds itself in a crisis not entirely dissimilar to Angel's. "I've been wanting to do some kind of Barbary Coast story for a while. Basically, it was the 19th century red light district in San Francisco, and it was a hard and nasty place. Bars, gambling, whores - the really fun stuff," Tischman explained. "Herbert Asbury, who wrote 'Gangs of New York,' wrote a great history of the area. But by the turn of the century, the Gold Rush was over and San Francisco was tired of the vice. If the city was going to survive, something had to change. The Earthquake and the fires destroyed much of the city, and that was the death knell for the Barbary Coast.


"I mention that because the way the city's changing is really a metaphor for what's going on with Angel. Angelus would've loved the Barbary Coast. Angel, like the city, is having a hard time figuring out how to create a new future."

As to how Angel, his familiar cast, and his penchant for adventure may play into "Barbary Coast," Tischman said, "I'm really happy with this story. It's three issues, and each issues ramps up the action and the stakes (no pun intended), and we're able to use vampires in cool ways. I don't want to give too much away, but the fact that we're in San Francisco in 1906 is a good indication where this story is going - but I think the way we get there is unexpected and fun, and very much in keeping with who Angel is, and the kind of problems he gets into.

"There are demons in the story, but no familiar faces - not in the traditional sense. We do have a bartender named Lynch, who I named after Brian Lynch, who's a friend and who's done his share of cool-ass Angel stories. Enrico Caruso, the great opera singer, he has a cameo, too. And everyone knows Franco Urru, our artist. These pages are unbelievable. Franco worked really hard and gives us amazing period detail on every page. It's really great work. I will say this: If you look really close, you'll see a thread of a major player in the Angel universe, but I'm not telling."

Tischman has worked on a solid mix of creator-owned projects, most recently "Red Herring" at Wildstorm, and established or licensed properties, such as the current "Luke McBain" minseries published by 12 Gauge, which was developed with country musician Trace Adkins. "I don't like to be tied down; I like to jump around," the writer said of his eclectic workload. "I like different genres. Each book is different, and that's the way I like it. A lot of guys get pinned down. 'Oh, he only does superheroes.' Or, 'he only does crime.' I have a lot of different interests and I'm fortunate ,because comics lets me play in a bunch of different sand boxes. I tend to work from themes, what interests me and how does that play out in comics. Or, I get a chance to work on a great character - whether that's Angel or Captain Kirk - and I get turned on by real-world problems or issues that could affect them."


Angel visits San Francisco's "Barbary Coast"


EXCLUSIVE: A soulful Angel haunts Barbary Coast in 1906

[comic fan]

Reviews of Buffy Season 8 issue 33.

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Buffy the Vampire Slayer Season 8 #33 Review

Twilight finally reveals himself to Buffy.

by Tim Lenaghan

March 3, 2010 - Editor's Note: We wanted to review this book without disclosing the identity of Twilight, but we realized that just isn't possible. So a spoiler warning - we reveal the identity of Twilight in this review. You have been warned... as if you didn't already see the news online...

Last chance to turn away. The reveal is literally in the next paragraph…

Seriously.

In a move that's sure to set the small corner of its fan base that hasn't already heard ablaze, this month's installment of Buffy the Vampire Slayer reveals the identity of Twilight, the big bad of Season Eight, to be none other than Angel. That's right, the longtime paramour of the perennial Slayer, and although he seems to still be the vampire with a soul, it appears that he's no longer in the business of helping the helpless.

However, the reveal of the villain only represents half the story, and the true success of this issue rests on the execution of the unmasking. While much of what transpires is thoroughly enjoyable, there's a certain amount of awkwardness inherent to the reveal that mars its overall impact. Although some of these problems are due to Meltzer's script, many of them are symptomatic of the way in which Twilight has been handled throughout the series.

Even though it can certainly be argued that readers haven't seen enough of Twilight for him to establish his character fully, by unmasking him as Angel the creators beg the question as to whether or not his actions accurately reflect his established character. Unfortunately it doesn't appear as though they have, and because of this Meltzer has a difficult time handling Angel throughout the script. While it's unclear whether or not readers are supposed to take any stock in his "explanations" here, they come across as mostly ham-fisted. Again, this doesn't seem to be a fault of Meltzer's script but of the way the character has been handled throughout the series. Buffy herself even mocks his exposition heavy banter as wildly uncharacteristic.

This is particularly unfortunate because everything else that Meltzer does here really sings. He has a clear handle on the characters, with a particular flair for Xander and Andrew. The opening exchange between Buffy and Xander shows that he's just as capable at handling heartfelt exchanges as he is at navigating the comedy that pervaded the majority of last month's issue. However, the moment in which Andrew attempts to save the day by literally pulling the means out of thin air, trumps the superhero homage of last issue. Thankfully his services aren't required as Buffy swoops in to save the day.

As the fight between Buffy and Twilight unfolds and the two twist and turn through the air with the greatest of ease, one can't help but be reminded of the final confrontation between Neo and Agent Smith in the final Matrix movie. Whereas the previous issue's numerous Superman references specifically referenced their own ridiculousness, the obvious parallels here go unacknowledged, and because of that they distract from what should be a moment where the script focuses on the metaphorical bombshell that's just dropped.

Georges Jeanty may be the individual who has been looking forward to Twilight's reveal more than anyone else. He seems to really revel in the unmasking, in both Buffy's reaction to it as well as Angel's malicious grin in response. Also, I'm not sure whether the string of variant covers that Jeanty has been producing have been getting enough attention, the recent homage to classic super hero covers have been truly chuckle inducing and this month's effort is no exception.

When it's all said and done I actually like the idea of Angel being the villain of Season Eight. I just wish the character had been portrayed differently throughout the series. Meltzer has done an admirable job of trying to salvage the reveal but as of this issue Angel's actions and dialogue simply aren't evocative of the character, but regardless Meltzer and Whedon have my attention for the remainder of the series.


7.4 OVERALL
(out of 10 / not an average)

Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Season Eight #33 Review - CraveOnline.com

Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Season Eight #33 Review



Brad Meltzer continues to take on Buffy!

by Iann Robinson
Mar 03, 2010

Writer Brad Meltzer did some of my favorite work with Justice League and a few other DC titles. He had a way of creating scripts that treated something supposedly childish with a mature and adult tone. He was among the few comic writers who could really do that placing him up amongst people like Frank Miller, Will Eisner, and Alan Moore. Meltzer has taken those gifts and injected them into the Dark Horse Buffy: Season Eight series, giving it more vitality and life than it’s had in a long time.

Buffy #33 opens at the end of a hellacious time for Buffy and her small army. Slayers are dying and their power is being absorbed into Buffy’s body leaving her feeling like more like a vampire than a slayer. Meanwhile the ever elusive and bizarre Twilight stands before Giles, Faith and Andrew attempting to figure out who will die first. Using her magic, Willow locates Twilight and the new superhuman Buffy (flying, super strength, etc) takes off after him. The final confrontation will leave buzzers sounding in the brains of Buffy fans everywhere.



With all of the fantasy and even melodramatic elements going on in Buffy #33, Meltzer still manages to make this read like a book for adults. Buffy’s new gift of absorbing powers and the feelings of that making her a vampire are handled with real grace, allowing the reader to see how this could emotionally wreck somebody like Buffy. The scenes between her and Xander are perfect, Meltzer nails the back and forth between the two that made the TV show such a hit. Even the big twist reveal comes across as bigger than itself. Once we see the reveal, Meltzer goes into the why and the tone and direction of the book takes a whole new twist. I know the word “gripping” seems silly but in Buffy #33 it really works.

The art in Buffy #33 is pretty standard for the series and while not a drawback to it; it’s not anything special. Artist Georges Jeanty does a nice job of not letting the art overpower the script and understanding the writing is really what’s key to issue #33. My only problem is that it seems to step too far back and almost becomes lazy. The kind of art where if the script wasn’t strong it wouldn’t be saved by the visuals. It’s hard to walk the line between laid back and overpowering and Jeanty puts in a solid effort it just falls a bit short. I guess I wanted to see more of the characters in the art, more details and emotion in the faces.

Buffy: Season Eight has been a great series so far and a welcome outlet to all of us bummed that the show was cancelled before its time. Brad Meltzer has stepped the greatness of the book up a notch with issue #33 and left an ending that drives you to read the next issue. This is a turning point in the series and what comes next is anybody’s guess. That kind of excitement and mystery is exactly what all comics should strive for.

Buffyfest: Buffy #33: Twilight Part Two Reviewed! (SPOILERS GALORE)

Wednesday, March 3, 2010

Buffy #33: Twilight Part Two Reviewed! (SPOILERS GALORE)

How does one review a comic that contains one of the biggest moments in not only Season Eight but in the whole of the series? Is there really a way to criticize this singular issue based on the merits of the issue alone without taking into account what came before and theorize what might come afterward? In a word: Nah. Well, maybe, but I don't think it makes sense to do so. In lieu of that, let's dive right in and discuss.

First of all, let's make it official: Angel is Twilight. There were folks thinking we might have been foiled but let me assure you that it's true and that it's one of the most compelling decisions in the comics so far. This is not the issue that answers the question "Can Angel be redeemed for what he's done as Twilight?" although I don't think Angel was capable of true redemption even before that. It's not the issue where we get the explanation for why Angel and Buffy are more super powered than usual. It's just the moment that we finally acknowledge how much everything has changed, and not just between Buffy and Angel. Buffy changed the world. That's what this whole season has been about: the consequences of changing things on a global scale and this is the issue where it starts coming to a head.

Let's make no mistake: you'll either love this issue or hate it. There isn't going to be a lot of in between feelings. On the surface it's about as straight up Bangel as you can get. Yes, there is talk about a shared destiny between them and, yeah, spoiler alert to the max, there is snogging. There's fighting too. There's raging against the dying of the light and there's fear and confusion mixed in as well. It's absolutely huge for anyone who want to see these two characters together and it's anathema for those who don't but the future is still wide open.

Angel asks Buffy this question: "Don't you want to be happy?" and what happens afterward might worry some that the writers are saying something as simple as "Angel is what makes Buffy happy" but it's much more complicated than that. We've known from the start that Twilight's agenda is to end all magic and, to me at least, that means Angel being human and Buffy not being the Chosen One anymore. That is what would make them both happy but that happiness seems as though it will come at a terrible price. That's what I took away from the interaction between Buffy and Angel. Despite the hugeness of the moment, the subtext is pretty subdued. This issue is just the first taste and it's just enough to get you hooked back on the comic if you fell out of love with it somewhere along the way.

There's great moments with other characters, too. In particular, Andrew fans will be pleased to see that he's ready and willing to fight the good fight even in the face of impossible odds. It's a simple moment but one that really reminds me how much Andrew has grown during Season Eight. There's some interaction between Willow and Amy, too, that I thought was amusing. Meltzer really has the voices of all the characters down at this point and the flow of the issue really felt cinematic.

Georges' art is top notch almost all the way through. The notable exception, unsurprisingly, is Angel himself. There are panels where he looks perfect but there are quite a few where he looks a little silly. I'm thinking especially of the second to last panel in the issue which I won't describe in full but, sufficed to say, faces don't move like that.

I can't judge the foreshadowing of the "true history of the universe" that Angel hints that Giles knows about. It's left very open here. There's a smell of potential retconning but I'd rather burn that bridge when we get to it.

All in all, Buffy #33 is one of the best issues of the season, period. It's epic and exciting and it's going to piss off damned near everyone. If you're shipping the Bangel, I'd enjoy this moment because this is the last happy one I bet you're going to get. If you're a Spuffy, a Bander, a Biley, or anything else... well? This might feel like a bit of a bummer, maybe even a punch to the face but I'd stick in there because there's a lot of story left to tell and some blond vampire guy with a soul whose appearance could still be right around the corner.

There's a lot more analysis that can be done but I'd rather hear from all of you. What did you think? What's your hypothesis on what's coming? Can you get me a soda? More questions to follow but, for now, courage...


Pick of the Week - 03.03.2010 - Buffy The Vampire Slayer #33

Buffy The Vampire Slayer #33

Writer: Brad Meltzer
Penciller: Georges Jeanty
Inker: Andy Owens
Colorist: Michelle Madsen
Cover Artist: Jo Chen

Publisher: DARK HORSE COMICS


My experience with Joss Whedon's Buffy The Vampire Slayer can be best described as a series of ups and downs; a veritable roller coaster. I first was turned on to it in its first movie version, mainly due to Luke Perry's casting. As you may remember, that movie didn't quite live up to the potential of Mr. Whedon's vision for his heroine. I tried really hard to get into the late 1990s television version of the show, giving it a go here and there over the years, but it never really grabbed me. When Dark Horse Comics announced that they would be continuing the story from the television show by creating comics for season 8, I thought that was awesome. I started reading the series, despite not having finished the full 7 seasons of the TV show, and the comics were so good that it got me watching the TV series again, slowly working my way through the DVDs. But then the roller coaster went back down as the comics of season 8 waned a bit, the story rambled and whatever that magic that was being captured was lost a little bit and I stopped watching the TV show again. But then here we are again, beginning with the last issue #32, the first of this new arc written by Brad Meltzer, the Buffy roller coaster has gone vertical again, pulling me back up the incline with it.

And so here we are at Buffy the Vampire Slayer #33. The much discussed, ballyhooed, and spoiled issue that revealed the identity of the villain, Twilight. Now obviously, I already knew the reveal. Back at the height of "Buffygate," you could hardly avoid the revelation that Twilight was Angel, but that didn't alter my enjoyment of this issue at all. I'm fascinated by the evolution of enjoyment of stories and how the age of surprise twists and reveals that we never saw coming (most notably Darth Vader as Luke's father in Empire Strikes Back) is long over. Now with the internet and advanced solicitations and the Yahoo! front page, anything that is shocking is newsworthy and more than likely will be spoiled before you get to experience the reveal. What I've discovered though is that it isn't so much what the reveal is, but how you get there. And it's the appreciation of that journey that's allowed me to enjoy the death of Captain America, the rise of Sinestro the White Lantern, and now the reveal of Angel as Twilight.

I'm not exactly sure what Brad Meltzer is bringing to the table to turn things around on Buffy the Vampire Slayer, but whatever it is, it's working. As we've discussed on the Pick of the Week Podcast over the past few months: Buffy had lost some of it's magic. I still struggle to pinpoint exactly where things have gone wrong, but the meandering storyline and the gradual push towards the current storyline was probably the main cause of the lack of satisfaction I found with the title. But something sparked in issue #32 and continued here in issue #33 to move Buffy the Vampire Slayer back to the top of my stack. I think the main thing is that Meltzer is having fun writing these characters and that's coming through. Previously the work of Meltzer's I've read has been over at DC Comics on things like Identity Crisis and Justice League of America, which were very heavy handed. But here in the pages of Buffy, the mood and tone is unlike any other Meltzer comics I've ever read. He has the voices of the characters, especially Buffy and Xander, down to the point of them feeling natural and within the realm of my expectations after watching seasons of the show. In addition to the light and playful tone, the story that's being told by Meltzer has a heavy feeling of impending...conclusion.

The reveal of Twilight as Angel was handled as I would expect it to be, with a very comic book reveal: A simultaneous unmasking while others put the pieces together, and I think that's where the charm of this story arc can be found. While previously the Buffy the Vampire Slayer comic has been Buffy stories told in a comic, this story arc is very much a comic book story that happens to be about Buffy the Vampire Slayer. The comic book influences are out in the open with references and jokes aplenty, (including an excellent homage in this issue with Andrew's attempt to attack Twilight) but on a more subtle layer, in the story structure and action base, Meltzer has converted this book into a true comic book. But right when I think I've got the book figured out, the conversation between Buffy and Angel leaves me guessing and wondering about Angel's true motives, asking "Is he REALLY a villain" and ultimately leading to the issue's end that had be giggling with excitement for these two characters I've watched and now read, and yearned for them to figure things out.

So much of the discussion about Buffy the Vampire Slayer has been focused on the story and the writers and it's so easy to just gloss over the work of Georges Jeanty, not because it isn't any good, quite the opposite. Jeanty's art has been the stabilizer throughout this entire run. His art within these pages is what I can depend on. No matter where or how the story is meandering, Jeanty is there with a consistent look to the characters and great story pacing and depiction of action. In this current time of many licensed comics out there and artists struggling on how to draw characters that have real world existence in the look of actors, Jeanty has defined the modern approach for this. His characters are recgonizable and unique in their own right, without it being a creepy rendering of real people. The grace of Jeanty's work is not only admirable, but it's damn fine and something that should be held up as what other artists doing other licensed comics should be compared against.

It could be just a matter of time before I'm back down that roller coaster ride of Buffy, but for right now, it's one of the best comic reads on the rack. We're in the middle of a vital storyline and I cannot wait to read the next issue to see where this story goes, because after Buffy the Vampire Slayer #33, I've been knocked back on my ass to the point where I have no idea what's coming next, much like a great roller coaster ride should be. Now if only Meltzer can commit to another story arc, or be the ongoing writer. Wouldn't that be something?

Ron Richards
A Rising Stars reference? Oh no he didn't!
ron@ifanboy.com

[comic fan]

BEHIND BUFFY SEASON 8: Meltzer Talks "Twilight" - Comic Book Resources

BEHIND BUFFY SEASON 8: Meltzer Talks "Twilight"


Brad Meltzer gives a behind the scenes look at how he built the various elements of "Buffy Season 8's" penultimate arc, from the real story behind Twilight to the hidden miseries awaiting Buffy and Giles.

SPOILER WARNING: This article contains major spoilers for "Buffy the Vampire Slayer Season 8" #33, in stores now.



As it nears its conclusion, Dark Horse's "Buffy The Vampire Slayer Season 8" has been gaining more and more buzz with readers, both for the controversial leak of the series main villain Twilight and for the arrival of all-star writer Brad Meltzer on the penultimate "Twilight" arc, which continued with this week's "Season 8" #33.

To help prepare fans for the hit series' impending finale, CBR is back with an all-new installment of "Behind Buffy Season 8" - a monthly column featuring interviews with the creators and staff behind the creation of Buffy's last two stories highlighting the questions being answered, the characters thrown into crisis, and the future of the entire Buffy franchise. This month, Meltzer himself stops by to address some of the nods and notes hidden in #32 that fans as well as how he and Joss Whedon teamed up to shape the final reveal of who Twilight is and more from this week's issue #33.

"I basically have a very plot-driven brain, and I just went and spent an obscenely long time putting together - and this sounds silly - my 'Jerry Maguire' mission statement where I saw plot stuff happening and what I saw in terms of the big picture of the mythology of this character. It was as close to fan fic as you could get without sex scenes," laughed Meltzer about his initial pitch to Whedon. "I sent it off and had no idea what was going to happen or if it was going to be a disaster. Then an e-mail popped up [from Joss], and it said, 'There are things I like and things I don't like, and you're going to write the penultimate arc when we get there.' It really was the big picture that I wanted to play with. Most people had ideas for arcs and characters and a few storylines, but I was the one who came back and actually had plot. So I always knew where we were going to wind up. It wasn't a thing where I had to go, 'Oh my God, what happened?' It was actually all in place before the first issue hit."



CBR News: Last week, we spoke with Scott Allie about a lot of the superhero fanboy humor in your debut issue, but it also contains some of the most gruesome stuff that we've seen in "Buffy" so far, with the deaths of so many Slayers. Did you deliberately try to balance the two?

Brad Melzter: People were so focused on the jokes in this issue that I'm surprised they didn't stop on this. As a writer in comics, I find there are moments that surprise me. There are moments that are one way in my head, and then you get to it and realize how graphic they are. In the script, we asked for all the gore to be kept off-panel in an old school, shadowy, EC way. And suddenly, this popped up in my inbox, and here was Jonestown with a bunch of innocent girls. And to me, the heartbreak of this is the line on the next page when she says, "Don't let Buffy know we let her down."



Although, one thing people have been able to pick up on since issue #33 came out is that the original explanation that we get for why Buffy is getting her powers - one that she takes very hard - might not exactly be on the nose. What does the fakeout contribute to the story?

No good deed goes unpunished. This was the emotional beam that the entire issue was built on - the idea that you're getting this from every slayer who dies. And I just kept coming back to that idea that, through seven years of Buffy adventures, Willow and Giles, probably more than anyone, always seem to have the answer that's needed. "Here's the weird Tiki idol" and Giles says, "It from the 1400s...It's the curse of Vespa" as he flips through a book. I just loved the idea that sometimes what they put out is wrong, and sometimes it misses the big picture. Willow here misses the big picture. Not that she's wrong, but she's missing the big picture. We get to see that in the next issue. There's a ladder that exists, and this is the first rung.

This synchs up with Buffy as a character, as well. Her defining quality seems to be that she takes everything on her own shoulders, whether that's fair or not.

The interesting part is that this problem doesn't work on another character. If you went to Superman and said, "You're getting more powers because people are dying," sure he'd feel bad because he's sad, but he doesn't carry that guilt the way Buffy carries it. He doesn't take everything on his shoulders the way she does. So this, to me, was a perfect "Buffy kryptonite" moment. It gets right to the heart of who she is as a character, which is why I think it's the emotional beam the issue goes with.

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They note this on panel, but you had Georges draw the big machine from the classic "Teen Titans/X-Men" crossover. I'm assuming that was your big "We must use this!" moment for the whole arc.

[Laughs] It was the thing where I waited 28 years for that moment. And the best part was how many people messaged me on Twitter and said, "I recognized it on sight!" I remember when I was playing with this, I thought "Where are they physically?" It was the headquarters, but I really didn't know what the headquarters was. I started thinking, "Okay, if Warren built this, he wouldn't have built this alone. He would have collaborated with Andrew." And even on the show they never had the budget to do the real geek stuff. I said for myself...I still want a Captain America shield. I still want a Justice League table with the logo on it and a mini Atom floating chair. I still want replica teleporters in the corner of my office. So I nerded out and said, "If I could go for anything, if I could go for the Mount Everest of nerd...where is it?" It's right here. It's the "Teen Titans/X-Men" crossover from 1982, where the two greatest teams came together with the greatest moments at their height from two different companies. That let me wet my pants when I was 12 years old.

Don't forget the introduction of the Source Wall.

Is that actually the first appearance of the Source Wall? Interesting. I love the idea that, of all the things you could conjure for Dark Phoenix to come out of the ether that would make complete sense. It was like, "Oh my God! These two universes are talking to each other!"

But all I did was build my own headquarters. I didn't built it for Andrew or Warren. I built mine. And then, of course, I threw some love to Georges by giving him some "Star Trek" reference to draw, because everyone knows he loves it. But that was certainly the most fun stuff for us to play with.



We end the issue with Giles, Faith, Andrew and Twilight with that "Who wants to hear a really cool master plan?" bit, and the feeling I got was that, just like your story had a lot of comic nods in the dialogue or the plot, you also got to play with the superhero cliffhanger in terms of the issue's construction.

Right down to the "Next issue" blurb. You hit the nail on the head that that's what we were going for. [Laughs] I mean, this whole issue we're obviously playing with every different type of trope that get to be played with in the genre, and this is certainly one of them. The interesting thing is that, in this issue, originally, the last page and the last panel was from the previous page where Buffy learned she was getting the power from the girls. That's how it was originally going to end. And as Joss and I talked about that and how it made sense because it hit us the hardest, I brought it back to Twilight, because I felt like 1) it was going to be more of a different answer next time and 2) considering who Twilight was, this was the vital character part. This was where we got to play that "Dun dun duuuuuuuuun" and play that comic book ending that, to me, brings the whole issue full circle.

We all know that the Twilight reveal leaked out in an unfortunate way, but as a writer who's done a lot of mysteries, were you drawn to that moment as the specific thing that you wanted to do with your plot-heavy arc of "Season 8"?

It's interesting. This was the one mystery that I didn't feel that the mystery was the most important thing. Sometimes you read a mystery, and the answer is the story. When you watch "The Crying Game," if you know that one part, it's over. It's still a nice character piece or study, but that's the big boom. For me, I actually never thought - even when it came out who Twilight was - and I felt bad for Joss and the reader who doesn't get to enjoy that moment of turning the page - that that was the crux of the story. Think about it. You didn't see people freaking out and obsessing over Twilight every month. For 31 issues before this, they were going after that answer. That was just one of the reveals that was going to be in there. Maybe this sounds odd, but to me the big, best part of the story wasn't just who was under that mask, but why they were under that mask and why this was happening.

I said it briefly on Twitter, but for three years now, Twilight has had powers. And now Buffy has powers. And nobody is stopping to ask why. That was always the best part of the story to me.



Scott pointed this out last week, too, but the idea of changing Angel's voice through magic is a clue that seemed to slip by a lot of readers.

We're sticklers. This is a cheat that only works in comics and novels and other places where there's no sound. In a movie...it didn't even work in "Batman" when he puts on his stupid gravely voice. We all roll our eyes. In comics and novels, it works great because you can't hear the voice. So the trick is, we just switch the font, and so for three years, nobody recognized the guy's voice, and this was our way to answer it. We can just say, "This was happening because there was a witch here who was changing it. That's why you don't know who I am." And again, is it necessary? No. But I think it's a real cheat if you don't explain those things, because you can't have everyone running around and not know.



Even when Xander's being serious and trying to reach out to his friends, he can't resists swiping a bit from "Superman 1."

Part of what "Buffy" is is that clever dialogue and those jokes. I actually don't think Buffy's humor is about the funny humor. It's about clever and smart humor. It's always at that moment where we're just about to give you that sweet stuff that turns to saccharin...that's where the best jokes come in "Buffy." That, to me, is exactly that moment where Xander is talking to Buffy. It gets just almost to the moment where he goes, "I love you, too," and instead goes to something far better. And I'm sorry, all of us in that same situation would, I hope, make that same joke. It's great stuff.



Twilight is holding something over Giles in terms of the connection between Twilight and Buffy. What's the nature of that hidden knowledge, and what does it mean that Giles is, even this late in the game, holding on to something so vital?

I talked to Joss about this long ago. In panel 1, this gives a real sense of history here in terms of what each Watcher wants. When I think of the mythology, the mythology isn't just, "Why does Buffy get to do these things?" It's the entire universe. This entire world of Watchers and why they exist - what are they really there for? Are they really just there to watch? It seems like a pretty boring job that they have. What are they watching for? Here, Giles has so much knowledge in his head that, to me, it's impossible that he's not always holding something back.

And I think it also gives some nice context to the stories in the series that were more one-offs. But I'm sorry, Giles just can't know all this stuff all the time and not be holding some stuff back. This is the moment in the series where we really finally see it. People are going to be interested in seeing how this goes.



You get to diffuse that reveal a few times, though, with things like the moment on page 10 with Andrew coming in.

It's not the bang that's scary, Hitchcock said. It's the anticipation of it.

It also let's you fuse the two threads of the Twilight mystery and the comic book in-joke...my favorite part of which is Batgirl's belt.

[Laughs] That "Clobberin Time" page was solely to pack in about as much geek fun as we could have. I think comedy is really hard for people. I'll always have people telling me, "I loved your thriller, but I'm surprised it made me laugh so much," because comedy is hard for people. Even in comics, it's especially hard. I think there are very, very few people who can pull it off. I don't say that because I think I'm the master of comedy. I don't try to pull it of that regularly, because it's really hard when you have something as unbelievable as men who where their underwear outside their pants to suddenly be cracking jokes in a real cutesy way. What I love about "Buffy" is that it earned that for seven seasons.

Up to this point, even though you're a huge nerd for this stuff, you've never done these fanboy Easter Eggs in other comics work.

It wasn't appropriate. And when we talked about it, Joss said, "Buffy is going to have superpowers. It's going to be right there when we open." I said to him, "I got this joke about her being faster than a speeding bullet and more powerful than a locomotive...we'll do all three." And when I sat down to do it, I couldn't stop writing the jokes. I physically couldn't stop writing them. I have so many that didn't make it in. I sent them all to my friend Noah and said, "What are the best ones?" My favorite one in the whole book is, "General, would you care to step outside." It's like Xander couldn't stop talking in my head. And it was one of those moments where I've never had the outlet to put it anywhere, and here was perfect spot. The perfect place to do superhero humor - which to me is the title of the worst play ever.

It worked for exactly what it is, but the beauty of what we got to set up was that every issue was like its own genre movie. The first one was comedy, and I think what you're seeing right now in the second issue is that it starts to seep from comedy into drama. And it goes from there to two more that I think are going to be really fun.



Right before we finally get to the actual unmasking of Twilight, you stretch the whole action sequence out across two pages with some action pacing we haven't often seen in this series. Where did that transition come from?

I actually do a lot of layouts in the script. In this one, I described a giant splash page with four horizontals, because I really wanted a widescreen moment. This is it. I think the set up of that horizontal panel slows time. We do nanoseconds...picoseconds of what you're seeing, just to slow it down as much as we can. To me, the most effective moment when you watch "Inglourious Basterds" - and this is something Tarantio's great at - is when he picks the moment right before the dynamite is about to explode, and that's the moment where he slows everything down completely.

There's a great story Gore Vidal tells where he says, "I want to do a scene in my novel where these characters talk about philosophy. For page after page, they're going to be talking about philosophy and philosophers. Do you think I can pull it off without the readers losing interest?" And Gore Vidal says, "You can absolutely do that, if both of those characters are on a train and the reader knows that there's a bomb under the train that's about to go off." That's something I always took to heart. I think Tarantino always does it. The moment where you get to the big bang - it's that old Hitchcock trick again - that's when you slow everything down completely. Originally, we had Twilight being revealed in the very early pages, but I felt like it didn't have the effect on the story we wanted. We didn't earn that moment.



At last: the Twilight/Angel reveal. it felt like even up to this dramatic swooshing off of the mask, you were toying with the expected tropes of genre storytelling and villain reveals because of who the character is.

This is the moment I was most terrified about writing in the entire arc because I actually knew the big picture and all that stuff, but people have waited for a decade for these two to get together. Joss has been thinking of this moment for years in his head, and he's written these characters for so many years. I was terrified of "What's that line going to be?" And the first line I wrote was not, "I missed you too." It was more of a joke, and Joss said, "I don't think the joke works here. Try something different." I came back with "I missed you too," and he said, "Now you've got it." I was terrified that that moment had to be something that just didn't speak of a joke in the moment or something that could be cute. It had to speak something true about both these characters, and when it finally came to me, I felt like, "I got it." This is exactly what he needs to be saying because you can read it with a cuteness and with a dead seriousness, and it works both ways. It says to me exactly what's gone on between these two.



One last bit of fun in the issue was the dueling images of Willow and Xander discussing Buffy and Angel as fighting and then...well, doing something else that starts with an "F."

This is obviously where we ask for repetition every time, and comedy comes in threes. So what this says is that we're going to have some real fun next issue.

Each issue cover has been a tease about what kind of issue we'll get, including the drama of this month's cover, despite using an old Toys R' Us ad to insert Joss' name.

I know, right? The Toys R' Us thing was just it to me. I thought that we couldn't peak in our nerdgasm any more than with the Teen Titans/X-Men machine, but man that Toys R' Us ad really separated the loser from the super losers, and I love being a super loser.

So, with the next cover being an homage to that old Carmine Infantino Superman cover, I'm assuming next up is our romance issue?

Of course. That's exactly what we're doing. I promise you that when you see all four issues, they will stand so separate from each other that the breadth of the emotional journeys these characters get to go on is spectacular. It's the best part of the whole thing. Again, I get to show you the payoff that Joss and company earned by setting all this up over seven seasons.

Check back with CBR next month for an in depth look at "Buffy The Vampire Slayer Season 8" #34!

[tootyfnfrooty]

If you're a Spuffy, a Bander, a Biley, or anything else... well?

i just love how cangel fans are ignored yet again. as if it isn't bad enough we get crapped on by joss, minear, allie and this meltser guy now reviewers are just toally ignoring our existance

[lunas_borednow]

... I'm so glad I gave up on reading the comics before I even started reading the Buffy ones...

I feel insulted again, and this is nothing to do with ships... but after all the people giving their lives to the mission believing in Angel, Doyle, Cordy, Fred, Wesley... the final stand in the alley the call to arms of each one of use to fight the Wolfram & Hart... this is how all that gets respected? By having Angel be the villain in the Buffy comic... I really feel spit on... again...

[Lemariz]

Originally Posted by lunas_borednow (View Post) ... I'm so glad I gave up on reading the comics before I even started reading the Buffy ones... I feel insulted again, and this is nothing to do with ships... but after all the people giving their lives to the mission believing in Angel, Doyle, Cordy, Fred, Wesley... the final stand in the alley the call to arms of each one of use to fight the Wolfram & Hart... this is how all that gets respected? By having Angel be the villain in the Buffy comic... I really feel spit on... again...

The worst thing is that, apparently, for the writers of the Buffy comics ATS never happened, you can pretty much forget those 5 seasons, that Angel had friends he really cared for and a son whom he loved more than anything. One of them even said that what matters most to the character of Angel is Buffy.
I feel really insulted as an Ats fan, because that's not what I saw on the show

[tootyfnfrooty]

you 2 are so right and i had not even thought about that until you bring it up, now i feel even more insulted than i already did on every level as an angel, cordy, doyle, wes, ats and cangel fan even his son does not mean anything

[lunas_borednow]

Originally Posted by Lemariz (View Post) The worst thing is that, apparently, for the writers of the Buffy comics ATS never happened, you can pretty much forget those 5 seasons, that Angel had friends he really cared for and a son whom he loved more than anything. One of them even said that what matters most to the character of Angel is Buffy. I feel really insulted as an Ats fan, because that's not what I saw on the show

... *sigh* You know if they want to say Buffy was the love of Angel's life or whatever I really don't care... I'm kinda annoyed by most Angel ships anyway, particularly cannon ones... but it is so disrespectful to AtS to make him willing to do anything for her or whatever... to ignore all he went through with his friends, all they did for him, his life, his son... The lives he saved... the lives he couldn't save. The choices he made all ignored so they can do another go at the season 2 final of Buffy? that

So glad anything not filmed left cannon for me because of how crappy they treated the fans in the After The Fall Comics...

[amy2345]

You're telling me I think the real thing in that comic that truly pisses me off is when Angel is telling Buffy he had something happen in LA and stuff and she of all people says I don't give a damn about LA. Excuse me BITCH you would if you knew there were so of the slayers you activcatived in LA that sorta helped your now crazy or whatever happen to Angel boyfriend in after the fall. That writing alone makes me what to

[comic fan]

The Full And Final Scott Allie Slayalive Q/A For Buffy Season 8 #33.This will be the last one of these Q/A's he does.

SlayAlive - SPOILERS: Scott Allie Q&A for #33 *Complete*

SPOILERS: Scott Allie Q&A for #33 *Complete*

Spoiler Notice

Twilight's identity has been revealed in this issue and will be openly discussed in the Q&A.



These Q&A's may contain spoilers for any recent Whedonverse works.

Dark Horse Editor, Scott Allie, and writer of Exurbia and Solomon Kane is back for another Q&A to celebrate the release of Buffy Season 8 #33 Twilight Part II written by Brad Meltzer and penciled by Georges Jeanty.

Please remember to submit one question per post and do not submit another question till the pending one has been answered.


If you want to participate, but you're not interested in registering at this time, you can e-mail your questions to emmie@slayalive.com and I'll submit them for you with credit. I will be accepting questions for the duration that this Q& is in progress. Again, we'd really love people to actively join in, but I'm hoping to encourage any fan out there with a great question to feel free to share it.


If this is your first time participating in the Q&A, please take a look at past Q&A's as your question might have already been answered.


Let's kick it off!

1. hitnrun017: Now that we know what Twilight wanted all this time, what about everything else we've learned about him this season? Banishing magic, the symbol, outfit/mask, etc... will these still play a part in the season or were they just red herrings? Fooling the bad guys to get what he ultimately wanted?

Scott Allie: The things you specifically mention are definitely still the point of what we're doing, or at least instruments to getting there. I think you have to wait till next issue to see what Twilight was really after though, this issue didn't really spell that out. In fact, it's not till #35, I think, that we really pull it together for you.

2. Charles: In prior Q/A's, you've said that Buffy's dreams mean something still. Regarding her very first one, she had romantic feelings towards that ended with his head being knocked off. Since then she confessed, got turned down and now we've got Angel telling her that they will never be happy with anyone else followed by a kiss. So is it safe to say Angel's words at least to how it relates to her Xander-shaped friend, are accurate and that Meltzer or Whedon will not be addressing them again in the future be it S8 or beyond?

Scott Allie: I don't think Angel's words mean that necessarily. But I've found the arc of her relationship with Xander really interesting so far.

3. bamph: After reading the issue and seeing your interview with Buffyfest, I am worried about something. There have been a lot of nice statements over the years and especially recently about Buffy and Angel's feelings for the other. You made some nice comments in that new interview. But after reading #33, how should B/A shippers take this issue? Worry that this is ultimately about subverting Buffy's and Angel's romantic relationship with each other and tearing it down or is that not even close to what is going on and not the right question and concern?

Scott Allie: I don't think that's accurate. The next issue will give you more on that topic. I'm not sure how to address how B/A shippers should take this issue, because we've just opened a can of worms—stick around to find out what comes out of it. I think by #35 those shippers will have more concrete stuff to talk about.

4. Hellbound Hyperion: Uh, okay, so I've got #33 in my hands. Angel's speech is bleeding Shanshu all over his fluffy Big Bad suit, and I'm deeply concerned that a similar "prophecy" might be in play for Buffy as well. So I gotta ask: can we consider the upcoming explanations an alteration or an expansion of the Slayer mythos?

Scott Allie: It strikes me as an expansion. It doesn't contradict anything that's already out there, except in that it's been hidden—and that concealment is addressed in the next issue too. We're learning something new about the histories.

5. Emmie: Would it be right to say Buffy isn't in her right mind at the end of this issue? Perhaps because of an unnatural glow?

Scott Allie: She's definitely affected by what's happening. That girl ain't never been right, but this Twilight business is certainly complex. More next issue.

6. cheryl: My question is concerning Buffy and Angel and what appears to be a moment of throwing caution to the wind and jumping head first into a physical relationship. Are we to assume that while Angel is powered up as shown, that his soul is anchored? Should we fear a return of Angelus?

Scott Allie: As he said to Faith—paraphrasing, don't have it handy—what makes you think invulnerable doesn't mean all over?

7. smashed: Is it safe to say that Angel as Twilight is definitely Angel? By that I mean not a clone, robot, or anything else? Like, this is the Angel that we saw in both of the TV shows?

Scott Allie: It is really him.

8. willow333: I have a question regarding Angel and him being Twilight. What about the war he started with Buffy's slayer army in Tibet and him asking Giles, Faith and Andrew who should die first. Are we suppose to assume this was him trying to keep the kill count down? It just seems a bit off to me.

Scott Allie: It does seem off, I know it's a lot to swallow. I hope you feel it all makes sense as they talk through some of it in the next two issues, #35 in particular.

9. maje77: Even with knowing the identity of Twilight, Angel’s reveal still packed a punch! The line in today’s issue where Angel says “this is history” but then later Angel says it isn’t just history it’s Buffy and Angel and their future; maybe I’m missing something, but history in what sense? Buffy and Angel’s connection and their past or is it something else. Must admit, I’m slightly concerned with how Buffy and Angel’s history will be treated in this, because Joss sure likes to bring on the pain.

Scott Allie: Those lines definitely read on many levels. They have their personal history; the history of all Slayers and vamps is to some degree wrapped up in the two of them; but it's really the future we're dealing with now. And there's more to it than that, but hopefully that'll do until next issue.

10. Charles: Renee as she lay dying mentioned she never got a chance to tell Xander something. Can you go on the record and say what it is?

Scott Allie: I cannot.

11. striped_lily: Will there be a Spike/Buffy cover in the future? Any details you can share about that?

Scott Allie: We haven't decided on the last few covers, but so far we don't exactly have a Spike/Buffy cover. I swear to the Powers that Be, that is not my fault—Joss is spec'ing all the covers for his arc.


12. bamph: I don't know if you can answer this. I don't even know if there is any link. In Angel:After The Fall, Angel and us learned that Angel will achieve the shanshu but end up on evil's side in the big apocalypse. Angel saw a vision of this future in vamp face surrounded by dead bodies that he killed.



Is there any connection between what was revealed about the shanshu for Angel in After The Fall and what's going on in season 8?

Scott Allie: I can't say at this time. I think this will be a good topic of discussion for you guys in the months to come.

13. moscowwatcher: In Dark Horse Dispatch sent to retailers immediately post-Twilightgate you wrote that "mature content" in issue #34 doesn't mean nudidy or blood - yet the issue is so intense that Meltzer asked you to put a mature-themes notice. One of your replies in current session implies that Buffy isn't acting on her free will - you say that she is "affected". So, the question: does the "mature content" imply mind-rape or physical rape?

Scott Allie: No spoilers. C'mon, you knew I was gonna cop out on that one, right? There'll be a lot of opportunity to get into this next month.

14. collex: Next Issue is called Them F@#%ing. Do we have to take this literally? Because there this curse and all that... And if yes, what do you have to say to those who think that kissing and doing the deed with Angel after all he has done is turning Buffy into an hideous and irredeemable monster that doesn't care for all those killed?

Scott Allie: Not answering the first question, but as for the second question, Buffy's attitude toward him after he reveals himself—Joss and Brad and I have spent a lot of time talking about this, trying to get this right. We know it's gonna raise questions. I think this arc more than any other would've benefited from being scheduled weekly like a TV show. Sorry, it's a cheap answer, but you gotta wait and see a bit here.


15. lmblack21: My question is about the reveal and the B/A impact - duh.

The whole thing could be read as fairly mocking (although I also see it as kind of sad in a poignantly true kind of way), I just can't quite decide if Joss is mocking B/A (which would be strange since that is his own creation) or mocking Twilight (the OTHER vampire story with Edward/Bella). I think both readings can be seen here because of Buffy's comment about how HER Twilight vampire was "way better". So can you tell us if we should be reading this as mocking B/A, mocking the Twilight series or a bit of both?

Scott Allie: Neither. Aside from a stray line of dialogue, Joss is not at all concerned with that other Twilight. Our book bearing the same title as those novels is an unfortunate coincidence. Very unfortunate. And as for mocking the couple he created—no. He's definitely not mocking that.


16. wenxina: As I understand it, "Twilight" is the climax of Season 8, which is pretty much defined as the point of the highest narrative/emotional tension. Brad Meltzer was recently quoted as saying that he had a "plot brain", whereas Joss' has a "character brain". How involved was Joss in this arc, making sure that the characters stayed true to form? Or was this a case where Brad just "got" it, and he doesn't give himself enough credit for his "character" lobe?

Scott Allie: Oh, Brad got the characters, all right. And he got the thematic point of Season 8, did more for that than any other writer. But Joss did come in on this one, about as much as the average arc. They plotted it together—there were major beats Joss handed Brad, and others that Brad suggested, that Joss adjusted, manipulated. The plotting was probably about 50/50, ultimately, but with the character stuff, Brad did a lot of that without any help or direction. He got it, he nailed the voices in my opinion. And he structured things to really make the most of the characters—although he's kept the focus on a few characters. The boys worked very well together, but it's Brad on the page. However, Brad's Twilight is the penultimate arc. Joss still has to do the climax.

17. maje77: I’ve always considered how Buffy and Angel can feel one another as an otherworldly special connection between them. It was good to see that reiterated again in this issue. And with Angel’s comments to Buffy that there’s a reason for their connection, how they feel about one another, not being able to be happy with others and this glowing thing between them; is that just romantic sentiments or is there more of a purpose to what he’s saying?

Scott Allie: There is a lot to what he's saying, yes. Not just sentiment. This is part of what Twilight is, part of what we spend the next two issues exploring.

18. a2zmom: It seems to me that if Angel had just told Buffy and the others to begin with what was happening; ie the consequences of the path they were on, a lot of deaths could have been avoided. Will this be addressed at some point?

Scott Allie: Yeah, it will be addressed. This, along with Buffy's reaction to his unmasking, is what we've spent the most time talking through, trying to make sure it works. It's a tough reveal, and it's also what we spend the next two issues connecting for you.

19. sosa lola:
Spoiler:
Judging by Jeanty's cover for #35 and the recent developments in #33, I'm guessing Buffy would somehow join Twilight. I'm most interested in Xander's reaction if Buffy really does join Angel's side. She's turned to him the most this season and they've had a special connection, so her suddenly turning on them would be more personal for him than anyone else in the gang at this point.

Scott Allie: Agreed.

20. vampmogs: You said a while back (and in this Q/A) that things will become more clear in the next two issues. Were you anticipating a backlash from the Buffy/Angel kissage? And if so, do you think the next two issues will change people’s opinion on this? Or at least put everything into more perspective?

Scott Allie: Yeah, definitely expecting a backlash for this. But I've given up predicting what people's reactions will be. I had no idea that some readers would think Joss was mocking the Buffy/Angel relationship. And I'm afraid that when an idea like that takes root among the fans, it's impossible to reverse. But yeah, what you get in #34 & #35 will at least put it into more perspective. We put a fair amount of work into that.

21. Kratos: Given that either Buffy is in control and decides to make out with a mass-murdering psychophath possibly followed by f"#&ing (although I do believe it can be "them fighting") him. Or the other option being that Buffy is under some sort of control. Neither outcome being any good, one has her on the same level of a genocidal maniac and the other has a female icon being raped. You have in the past given small pieces of hope for Angel fans(telling them to see it through). Is there any hope for Spike,Buffy,Spuffy fans at the end of the tunnel? Or should we just brace ourselves for a twisted bangel lovefest.

Scott Allie: I can't fully answer that without spoiling, but first I'd have to know what hope means to you. If your hope is that Joss comes out and says that Buffy and Spike are the key relationship, that Spike is more important to Buffy than Angel, then probably you'll be disappointed, because I don't think Joss writes in those terms. If on the other hand all you want is that the relationship between Buffy and Spike gets treated with respect, then yes, there is hope.

23. Dorotea: So, we just saw post-Amends and post-I Will Remember You Angel come forward glowing with 'unholy power' and claiming basically 'dog ate my homework' - er I did this all (arranged 206 murders) for you baby so that we can be together happy. And while most of the fandom gives Buffy some slack, many fans are gloating and insisting that Angel finally turned to the dark side for good - was irredeemable to begin with, not worthy of Buffy love and the 'destiny's bitch'. Not sure how to formulate the question - but is/was he? Irredeemably evil and corrupted by power? Was that the message his character was supposed to deliver--that since he is weak he will always be defined by moments of weakness, not by what he does afterwards?

Scott Allie: Wait, Dog Ate My Homework?!? What made you say that? But to sort of answer your question, the message Angel's character is supposed to deliver is not signed for yet; it has not been delivered. I swear I'm not saying this just to get you to buy two more comics, but this question isn't even entirely legit until what you've heard what he has to say, and seen what they do next. He will be defined and redefined over and over again, and weakness might be part of it.

24. iloveromy: Referencing Season 7, do you think Buffy is still cookie dough?

Scott Allie: She is. She's a lot closer to edible, though.

25. bamph: Have Buffy's and Angel's feelings for each other all been manipulation going back to the start of the show?That's the impression be given to some I've talked to after reading the issue. That this issue is hinting that the Buffy/Angel romance isn't really real and never has been. That they were manipulated into falling in love all those years ago by some unknown force when Angel first saw her in the Becoming flashback and when finally meeting in season 1 and what is happening now with this secret history between slayers and vampires and the unholy power the two have gotten is the end game to all this manipulation. Is that the view we're supposed to come away with after the new issue or is that the wrong thinking about the Buffy/Angel romance?

Scott Allie: I think this sort of thing is personal for the reader. What do you believe about love, about fate, about destiny? You will never get a scene where one of the characters says to the other, I guess we never really had feelings for each other, it was all just some unholy power. In my opinion, there can be fate, and you can be chosen, and still have to earn it. But ultimately my answer to your question is no, no one is telling you that. That is not the impression you're meant to walk away with.

26. maje77: How long has Angel and Giles known that Buffy would be the slayer to gain this special power? With Giles it seems like it's been from the beginning of season 8. Which makes me wonder why he never shared any of his thoughts with Buffy, allowing her to be blind to what was going to happen and putting her at a big disadvantage. And for Angel, I would assume it's been even longer because this Twilight persona had to have taken a lot of time to setup & to come to power.

Scott Allie: Giles, you'll find out in #34, Angel in #36. Their understanding of all this is central to the plot, for sure.


27. richie: Is there a meaning for Satsu being with Xander and Willow in the last panel instead of Dawn?

Scott Allie: Joss likes to cause his kids pain. Dawn might not like hearing what Willow says there, but Satsu's probably really pissed.


28. lmblack21: So a followup. Joss is not mocking B/A - so yay for that, it did seem rather strange to me to view it that way. A lot of people who are not into B/A are invested in the idea that Joss resurrected the comics to subvert the B/A relationship. What do you make of the idea that some people have that Joss would suddenly decide the entire point of the comics is about Buffy's romantic relationship with Angel and that the most important thing for him to do is trash and/or subvert that relationship and the whole long history of Buffy/Angel?

Scott Allie: It doesn't make sense to me—I don't get it. But it seems like there are some people who are into the B/A relationship, who are just as invested in—or at least they're espousing—the idea that Joss is mocking or subverting the relationship. I think because Joss doesn't specifically write these stories for the shippers, sometimes the shippers see him as specifically writing these stories to hurt the shippers. That is not the case. Neither of those things are on his to-do list. However, the Buffy/Angel relationship is going to be a bit different after all this.

29. Maggie: Thanks for your willingness to do this. It must be tiresome to have fans try to drag you into our various squabbles. But I guess I'll offer the counter question to the one you just got. Do you think it's Joss's intent that we look at Buffy and Angel caught up in that unholy glow as an affirmation of their epic romantic soul-mates forever affair? Are we supposed to be happy that they go for epic happiness when there is, to put it mildly, a bit of a cloud hanging over them, what with all the dead bodies that Twilight has seemed to have something to do with and the unholy glow and all. It had seemed rather dark to many of us, hence the thought that maybe part of the story is moving B/A away from a Twu Wuv 4eva sort of teenage romance to something a bit more complicated.

Scott Allie: Wow, Maggie, there are a couple really good thoughts in there. First, does the glow confirm the true-love-forever thing—it affects it. For some readers, like perhaps Bamph, above, the unholy glow might refute the idea that they ever were really in love. Or maybe it makes it more of a soul-deep connection than ever. I think when Season 8 is done, there will be plenty of room, still, for arguments about that to continue. However, a lot remains to be seen about their decisions, about what they go for. But it is definitely complicated.

30. neowhobaz: Is there time left in season 8 for "The Battle of Startbucks" mentioned in Fray?

Scott Allie: There is room.

31. Remmy: Scott, in a previous question you answered that nothing of what the two characters have done is meant as mockery. My question: how can it not be a mockery? Almost everything Angel spouts is false. Buffy and Angel had been fully capable of moving on over the last years. Angel had an immense deep bond with Cordelia, Buffy even this season admitted to having feelings for Xander. As for Angel's justification for doing what he did, it's not. He says it could have been much worse but that doesn't justify all the little girls that are dead now. Killing and torturing one person to save a hunderd does not make you a hero, the real hero is the one that save all 101 or fails trying.

Scott Allie: You don't like it, I take it? There's nothing mocking in it. No one intended mockery.

32. Sue: Have you and Meltzer watched all of AtS? Watched it all the way through? Will any of the character development for both Spike and Angel that went on in there be reflected in Season 8?

Scott Allie: I'm pretty sure Brad watched all of the Angel series, but I'm not positive. I know he and Joss talked through the story quite a bit, and that the main story beats in here comes from Joss. But I'm pretty sure readers will continue to debate whether or not Joss and his writers are doing right by these characters—which is to say that yes, I think we'll deal with the characters' development, but that readers won't all agree.

33. wenxina: How concrete is Joss arc looking right now? I guess the more specific question here is whether or not all the little cryptic messages (e.g. the Prince) will finally make sense? After years of stewing, it'd be a waste for it not to pay off in one way or another.

Scott Allie: Frankly, I'm a little concerned that some of the little bits like the Prince won't be spelled out, won't pay off, the way you and I would like them to. Some of those things, we know what they mean and what they are, but things are moving fast, and it still seems like we have a long way to go in seven issues. The only way to really spell out the prince and the queen stuff is by exposition, and there's not gonna be a lot of time for that, as the climax takes over.

34. tigerfan: In the homage cover of #35 Dawn seems to be curiously missing. Is there a signficant reason for her to be missing?

Scott Allie: Nope, she just didn't get on there. I think Georges picked the characters that he felt made the best stand-ins for the X Men characters. With this, and some of the other homage covers, there was not a ton of discussion about that kind of detail. He did his thing.

35. sla: In 'The Master Plan', Amy says that she come up with a spell to hide Twilight's H.Q., but, what she meant with "3 seconds in the future,"? I didn't get it, can you explain it, please?

Scott Allie: Yeah, that was supposed to sound really smart, but missed for some readers. If I try to think it through, like ANY time travel, it breaks down. But instead of hiding something in Africa, or behind a mountain, or under a glistening mist, don't hide it in a place, hide it in a time—just a few seconds in the future. It's not a major plot point, it's just a high concept thing that either sounds cool or confusing. You and me—confused.

36. otakumike: Angel says he "didn't kill anyone". But it's a bit naive, no? After all, there is at least 1 guy who died after he issued a direct order to kill him (remember that computer guy that failed to locate the gang in the mountains?).
Does Angel really believe what he's saying? Or is he glossing over some "details" to better charm Buffy?

Scott Allie: I don't want to get into motive, because we'll hit that in upcoming issues, but you're on the right track. Angel is a bit of a moral relativist. He believes in sacrifices for the greater good. But he does believe what he's saying. And he did not kill those 206 Slayers, for example.

37. zamolxis: So, all this time Angel was pushing Buffy to become something she couldn't fight! And he's doing the final push right after he finds out from Giles that Buffy knows nothing about! My question is, according to your knowledge, would Angel still played the sentimental card if Buffy knew what's happening?

Scott Allie: Had Buffy known what was happening much earlier, it would not have worked. But if, after Giles had been running around looking for this particular thing he needed, Buffy had learned what it all was, yes, Angel would have played the sentimental card to seal the deal. The sentiment is what it's all about, in the end.

38. Prophecygirrl: It has to be a bit frustrating, or at least intimidating, as an author to navigate all the romantic ships out there whilst trying to tell a story. In fact, I'm starting think that the appearance of any of Buffy's love interests will ultimately end with the realization that they are all beside the point. That we as readers should be open to new things, like Satsu's realization that cinnamon is not the only flavor of lip gloss. Comment?

Scott Allie: It ain't easy. But it's more an issue when doing interviews and going on message boards. You don't really think about that aspect of it when you're working on the material. Doing so would kill the story.

39. Emmie: First, apologies for the essay-length of my question. In this issue, Angel excuses his actions by saying, "I didn't kill anyone. This was happening. You really don't know how much worse it could've been? Powerful people -- *governments* -- lining up to wipe out the "terrorists" you created. Demons weren't thrilled either. I put on a mask, talk about "master plans"... distract them. Keep the body count as low as I can while I push."

He says he was trying to "keep the body count low" but in Retreat V he stood idly by and watched soldiers die, stating, "I'd like to watch this." His general later counters, "But we're letting our men die!" Angel-as-Twilight answers, "They're mortal. They have to die sometime."

Angel says his goal is for Buffy to realize "the manifest truth", yet he wears a mask and manipulates everyone around him. He says he's lowering the body count, then cavalierly shrugging off his soldiers' deaths when he has the powers of Superman and could finish the battle in one fell swoop. He could stop the Goddesses just as Buffy later does. Why doesn't he? Because he's pushing Buffy into becoming what he is, right? It's all starting to read more like Angel has gone mad with god-like powers--he's become Frankenstein and his one true aim is to acquire his "unholy" bride, Buffy.

Would you comment on these glaring contradictions in what Angel is saying versus what he's actually doing? Angel has been imbued with powers akin Superman, yet we do not see him using these powers to actually save lives, nor does he lift a finger to "keep the body count low"--instead he manipulates the situation to control who dies and when. At this point, the only justification I can find for forgiving Angel for those he's hurt (and slain) is if he's gone mad with his powers. I used to think that he was doing evil for the greater good ('kill a thousand to save a million' big picture mentality), but this issue shows the priority was "pushing" Buffy all along in her transformation, a transformation that's beginning to appear frighteningly ominous.

Edmund Burke said: "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." But in a world of superheroes flying the skies with immense strength and invulnerability, what does it mean when a 'good' man stands idly by and does nothing? What does it mean when that 'good' man encourages and directs evil?

Scott Allie: Oy. How the &$%# do I answer this, Em!?? I think you have to wait and ask me again after #35. I see this question echoed, rephrased, reflected in many of the following questions, certainly some of the preceding questions. "What are we supposed to conclude from this thing that you've only started to reveal to us?" Some specifics, though: He did watch soldiers die. He didn't kill them. Mortals do die. This was happening. He was trying to keep the body count low, not stop the deaths. Not by standing in the way of bullets. But by wearing a mask. And manipulating people. I accept that all this is a lot to swallow, and that it's hard to view it as heroic—I am not saying you should. But I'm saying that in my opinion, there are not glaring contradictions between what he's saying and doing. There are conflicts, there are things to disagree with. But his powers could not have prevented what's happening, that which was gonna lead to Slayer deaths. Angel did not, in the words of E. Burke, "Do nothing." For more, you gotta wait.



40. sosa lola: When Xander, Satsu, and Willow were guessing what Buffy and Angel were doing, do they know that Twilight is Angel? I mean, it's hard to see from that far. Also, would we get to see their reactions to the revelation in the next issue?

Scott Allie: They don't know that here, but you will see it next issue.

41. Vergil: Hey Scott, how are we supposed to view the Angel character? I mean it seems like whatever this guy does, he always manages to come out of it with a halo on the top of his head. Firmly believed to be a champion, hero regardless of all the suffering, death, pain he has caused other people. I used to believe that Joss structured his work in such a way that different interpretations were possible. That went out the window with Joss's After the fall were Angel is again herald as a hero even though he did willingly start an apocalypse, in the end everyone was rooting for him. Is this the same sort of story we can expect from season8, Angel walking away with no consequences or retribution?

Scott Allie: I think the current reaction proves that Joss structures his work to allow for different interpretations. To judge Angel's role here, you need to know more about it.


42. bamph: To give sort of a general sum up,what would you say to concerned Buffy/Angel shippers as we move forward into the rest of season 8 and beyond about there ship and it's future?What would you say to fandom in general going forward into the rest of the season and beyond?

Scott Allie: I don't know how to answer either part of this except to say to read the book. Maybe some of my answers to the questions below will help?

43. Nixennacht: You said, you didn't quite understand where the idea that this new magically assisted form of B/A is subversive comes from. More than one thing in that scene points at Twilight (the vampire soap), the star crossed 'destined connection' for one thing and also the dominating patronizing lover, who explains the world to his girl, admittedly manipulated her into this position and, if his previous lines and the cover of the collected vollume are anything to go by, wants to drive her into suicide. And also like in Twilight, the heroine takes this and falls into her lovers arms.

Now it's no secret that Twilight is a romance that is seen as a sad regression into long overcome genderstereotypes by many. Practically the Anti-Buffy in terms of feminsm. So it would seem weird to many that Joss would suddenly put his heroine in such a subdued position without something up his sleeve.

So my question would be, is this zombiefyed state Buffy seems to be in really to be seen as something positive, or rather as something extremely dangerous that she'll have to overcome to prevail?

Scott Allie: I totally see how this is subversive, I just disagreed with the idea of "mocking," I think. There's nothing mocking in the way Joss is portraying this. But subversive, sure. We're subverting certain accepted truths, and we're changing certain things about their relationship. And I don't think Buffy has become Bella. Again, let's see where it goes in a couple issue. Next issue is not gonna please you, though, Nixennacht.


44. wenxina: Thanks for being frank regarding my question about the Prince. As a follow-up question, because you said that it won't be spelled out explicitly, will we at least be able to draw some logical conclusions as to who was meant, from the rest of the story being told? Because I don't necessarily need/want one of the characters to be like "Hey, remember that Prince... that's him!". Or hey, there's always another MDHP short to give a condensed version of the exposition you speak off... or a one-shot...

Scott Allie: What I meant to say is that some parts of it might not be spelled out, because we might not have room. The last few scripts aren't written yet, so exact details remain to be seen, about what exactly gets onto the page. But yeah, I think by the end it will be easy enough for people to go back and interpret all that stuff, although as in everything else, there'll be room for debate.

45. Kratos: Following up on my previous question and your answer, I agree, I also don't believe that Joss writes in those terms. And I also see treating the spuffy relationship with respect as hope. I guess my question is, can we expect the opposite? That we'll have it spelled out that Bangel >>>>>>> Spuffy, Bander,etc. The end result being that Bangel is seen as the key relationship and that Angel is more important to Buffy then Spike or Xander. If that is the endgame then yeah I can live without the comics, to me the outcome is just as important as the journey.

PS:Like Maggie said, we really do appreciate you doing these Q&A's.
Thanks.

Scott Allie: Thanks for asking it like that, that hadn't occurred to me—No, I don't think you'll see either relationship spelled out as the one. To the B/S fans out there, who might be feeling invalidated by what's going on between Buffy and Angel right now, note that the B/A fans feel like they're being mocked. So while the B/S fans aren't getting to see B/S talking about destiny and all that, it ain't all roses or the B/A fans. And while I'm at it, because I think Kratos is the guy I pissed off last time—I'm sorry that I don't fully understand certain parts of fandom, and least of all the shippers and all that. Last month I think I equated shipping and fanfic. I wasn't trying to make fun—my only exposure to shippers is on message boards, I don't know that much about what this is. So when you said that you "shipped" Spike Fray, yeah, my Spray comment was flip, but I assumed that if you "ship" a relationship that doesn't actually exist in the canonical stories, then the only thing you could do was write fanfic about it. I get now that I was wrong about that—but I'm an outsider. I don't know shipping, or fanfic, or any of it, aside from what I'm exposed to on these Q&As. So I apologize.


46. henzinnit: With Angel returning in a huge and different role, any thoughts as to where Connor fits into Season 8? I don't expect an appearance, just wondering what he'd be up to now his dad is a big, war-mongering schemer.

Scott Allie: I try to steer clear of this subject, but that gets into IDW territory. Angel was created on the Buffy show; Spike was created on the Buffy show. Not to say that they're separate characters, and don't read too much into this, but we're not gonna go into areas of their story that aren't necessary to telling our story. Does that make sense? Wesley, for instance, was created on the Buffy show, but he's not necessary to telling our story. (He's alive in the IDW books, right?)

47. AndrewCrossett: Looking at current events and the possible directions things can go from here, one really sad thing seems clear: the "Scooby gang"... that wonderful friendship dynamic that's been in place since "Welcome to the Hellmouth", and which has survived all attempts to destroy it in the past... is something we're going to have to say goodbye to. There are lines being crossed now that can never be un-crossed. Is that a fair assessment?

Scott Allie: I don't think so. Things change. But the core is always the core.


48. cheryl: Will Angel be in season 9 of Buffy? Or is that too spoilery?

Scott Allie: Too spoilery.


49. angeliclestat: As an "Angel"(as in AtS) fan first and foremost, I am reading the current arc with great interest and a lot of trepidation. I have decided to go the route of not judging or flipping out (too much!) before the end of the arc and the full story has been told. However can you reveal if there will be any flashbacks between the end of 'After the Fall' to the point where Angel decided to become Twilight - which seems like a story that needs to be told. Or perhaps would Dark Horse consider joining forces with IDW and jointly tell that story? Has Joss any intention of telling that story? Thanks.

Scott Allie: We will be telling that story, yeah. There will be flashback material.

49. trunktheslayer: Was the "Hiding your base three seconds in the future" line a Sonic the Hedgehog (archie comics) reference? I mean, I know that's a long shot but after rereading it I thought..."wait, didn't that happen in there at one point?" so I figured I'd ask.

Scott Allie: Oh, I don't know, I gotta ask my kid! I don't know Sonic, and no one mentioned that.

50. Da Letter Jay: This question may seem kind of morbid. Recently, I lost someone very close to me. This made think about the people in my life and what they mean to me.
Eventually, way, WAY farther down the road, I thought about Buffy. In my eyes, the only way for this incarnation of Buffy to truly die would be if something happened to Joss (or if Joss called it quits). What I would like to know is if Joss has a plan to keep Buffy's story going if something were to happen to him. Does Joss share his ideas with certain people that would most likely take over the series in such an event? Or is it basically a “no Joss, no Buffy” kind of deal?

Scott Allie: Yeah, too morbid. I'm sorry for your loss, Jay. I do ponder this sort of thing in relation to some of my projects, but with this one I sort of think we'd close up shop without him.


51. vampmaster: Faith was meant to be "the" traditional slayer of this generation as the line passed on to her through Kendra who was activated after Buffy's death in Prophecy Girl. Am I correct in assuming Buffy was made the slayer of this generation again by the resurrection spell in "Bargaining" which specially states "Here lies the warrior of the people" implying they are rising the slayer and not just Buffy. Or is Faith still the technical slayer ignoring the chosen spell and Buffy was chosen to have all the new nifty powers for a different reason?

Basically what I am asking: Was Buffy chosen to be the one to receive the new nifty powers due to her current position in the Slayer line, or due to one of her own personal actions?

Scott Allie: Lot of stuff in there—but you know by now, I think, that Joss doesn't approach this in quite these terms, right? Who is "technically" the Slayer? Things have gone a little weird in Buffy's time, compared to all previous Slayers. The ways in which things have evolved has made Buffy unique. What she's done, what's been done to her, who she is—all of these things make her a unique Slayer, uniquely significant.

52. collex: Scott, you are a writer and an editor. Wouldn't you like to write an issue of Buffy? A DHP maybe,a one-shot or an issue of Season 9? Did you ever tak about that with Joss? You've been by Joss sides since Fray, he surely wouldn't refuse. So, do you think it's feasible?

Scott Allie: I'm a writer and an editor, but I'm an editor on this book. I wrote a couple Slayer prose pieces for Pocket, I wrote an Angel strip once upon a time, but the Buffy characters are not my sweet spot. I don't have the voice for them, though I think I have the character chops. Anyway, no, not something high on my list.

53. maje77: I just read Brad Meltzer's Commentary; BEHIND BUFFY SEASON 8: Meltzer Talks "Twilight" - Comic Book Resources for issue 33 and noticed he stated that it was terrifying to him to get Angel’s opening line of the reveal right, because fans have waited a decade for Buffy and Angel to get together and that Joss has been thinking about this for years. Also in the commentary it mentions that the next cover will be an homage to the old Carmine Infantino Superman cover and that the next issue plays up romance. Obviously you can’t say what will happen between Buffy and Angel, but is the romance factor of Buffy and Angel an important aspect of their relationship that Joss wants to highlight in this arc?

Scott Allie: Yes.

54. lostsoul: Some fans around the internet are thinking that Buffy may get pregnant. Can you please put my worries to rest that she will not?

Scott Allie: What, you mean ever?

55. Charles: What happened to Twilight's mark on Riley or is that a spoiler?

Scott Allie: Well, fans wrote in to comment on a panel where it was missing, but we looked at the panel, and I think from that angle it wouldn't show up in the drawing. Tell me where you're talking about, though. If it's missing, it's an error. But if it's where I'm thinking, it wouldn't really show up.

56. King:
Quote:
"No. Don't reckon there's many you killed. No. Just put 'em in a position to die easy."



This is a quote from the "Firefly" episode "Trash", Mal says it in answer to Yo-Saf-Bridge's claim she didn't kill someone. Above, you reinforce Angel's claim that he "didn't kill" 206 Slayers. Well, he sure put them in a position to die easy. He says he "stopped the worst of it", but that also means that, by definition, he chose not to stop some things. My question is... is this explanation really Season 8's last word on Angel's moral culpability in the deaths of the those Slayers, of Ethan, of Genevieve and the Slayers she "practiced on" at Roden's (meaning Angel's) insistence? Or of people who died because Angel didn't stop what he easily could of with his powers, like Toru's gang (and therefore Renee)?

To be clear, I understand from your other answers that we're going to get some more context for his decisions, etc, but as far as his actions and his choices and how he thinks they put him in the moral clear, is the 8.33 explanation really all we're getting?

Scott Allie: We revealed Angel twelve pages ago. You haven't heard the last word on it yet.

57. Remmy: Is there a date we can look forward to when new covers will be shown or are they perhaps too spoilerish to show just yet?

Scott Allie: Our PR department is handling the release of upcoming covers. I'm not sure the exact dates. We've got the covers done through #36 right now.

58. AndrewCrossett: Angel tells Buffy that the balance of power wouldn't allow the Slayer army to exist without dire consequences "on this plane." (I guess in computer terms, you'd say Buffy was trying to run 6 gigabytes of RAM in a world with a 32-bit operating system.)

Anyway, should we keep our eye on that "not on this plane" qualifier as something possibly significant, or was it just a throwaway?

Scott Allie: There will be some shenanigans on other planes, yes.

59. deadfrog: Seems there is a lot of prophecy from a few early Issues that's coming to pass. For example, issue 2 - the dream of kissing Xander (having feelings for him), then on the next page:
Panel 1 - wishing not to fall (discovery that Buffy could fly)
Panel 2 - Buffy wanting a "New Wish" (finding out the disturbing source of the powers was the dead slayers)
Panel 3- "I know you" to the Dragon (the recognition of Angel as Twilight).

So would you say that we're about to hit Panel 4 on that page real soon (the Dragon burning Buffy)?

Also, the "Betrayal" mentioned in #10. That's still coming, right? Or has it already happened, technically?

Scott Allie: This is a really interesting and legit reading of all that. Betrayal is a theme the story will continue to explore.

60. bamph: Is there any info you can give on the next Buffy One-Shot in July?

Scott Allie: It will focus on Riley Finn. And sadly, due to scheduling, it will be in August. There'll be no Whedonverse comic in July from Dark Horse.

61. maje77: I’m a little confused with some of your answers to a few questions regarding Joss subverting Buffy and Angel’s relationship. In the beginning of the Q&A you stated it’s not the intention of the story to mock and subvert the Buffy/Angel relationship, yet in your response to Nixennacht, you state there is an intention to be subversive. So the Buffy and Angel relationship, aspects of their shared story, is intended to be undermined?

Scott Allie: The relationship is evolving, as relationships tend to. Mock is certainly not an accurate description of what's going on. Subvert isn't exactly right either, but it didn't seem as wrong as mock. But you're right, subversion is not really what I see Joss doing to the relationship. Evolve. I think I can stick by that. But we're carrying on a discussion of the comic so far beyond the book itself, analyzing words used in a message-board Q&A, that I think it stands to ruin the story. The book should tell you everything you need to know about the characters and their relationships. I've really enjoyed doing the Q&A's, but based on how many times I've been asked the same question this time, about the Buffy/Angel relationship, or what it says about the Spike/Buffy relationship—and knowing what happens in the forthcoming issues—I'd like to end the Q&A's now. I want to thank you guys for your passion for this material, your commitment to the characters, and your insight. Thanks to Emmie for running the Q&A's, and giving me the chance to address you all directly. I hope you like what happens over the next seven issues. Please keep writing in to the lettercol, and anything we can't run before #40 will hopefully find its way into Season 9. I realize we're wayyyyy behind on the letters now, and we're talking about how to accelerate it without denying people a chance to have their say. But ultimately the message boards is the place for you to have your say, and it's a kind of an invasion for someone like me to linger here. Thanks again, and enjoy the big climax.

~Finis~

Thanks to everyone for participating in these Q&A's and thanks to Scott for running with us for a year and a half now! Our final session had it's largest turnout, so we definitely went out with a bang. Good night and good luck.

[lunas_borednow]

henzinnit: With Angel returning in a huge and different role, any thoughts as to where Connor fits into Season 8? I don't expect an appearance, just wondering what he'd be up to now his dad is a big, war-mongering schemer. Scott Allie: I try to steer clear of this subject, but that gets into IDW territory. Angel was created on the Buffy show; Spike was created on the Buffy show. Not to say that they're separate characters, and don't read too much into this, but we're not gonna go into areas of their story that aren't necessary to telling our story. Does that make sense? Wesley, for instance, was created on the Buffy show, but he's not necessary to telling our story. (He's alive in the IDW books, right?)

Okay it's official the people writing Buffy comics probably haven't even seen Angel... *sigh*

[tootyfnfrooty]

he doesn't know that wes is dead you got to be kidding me? they just continue to insult ATS fans don't they

[lunas_borednow]

Oh yeah... Someone basically made a few of our arguments and asked how is this not insulting? and the guy said: "Cause it's not."

Angel killing people and being described as a moral relativist... while saying pretty much that they don't deal with what happened in Angel's show/comic... yeah good too know.

You know I jumped ship on these comics so long ago and I'm still pissed... it's like a pain in my brain... Neither comic has any respect for the fans of AtS...

I don't know which is worse... teasing the Illyria/Fred thing only to smack us Illyria fans and Fred fans in the face with a dead fish(Illyria wants to be Fred so much that she turns into her so she can get her ass handed to her by every monster that comes a long but no Fred's gone, haha fooled you! ), the magical flipping do over back to the alley, and actual angels showing up in Angel or this....

[~♥~My Lonely Angel~♥~]

Ugh... So frustrating. The Angel comics in my opinion aren't canon by a long shot, they don't seem to be a part of the show that it once was. I'll eventually read all of the comics, but at the moment I'm not interested in trying to read them again.

[lunas_borednow]

... I don't think comics are Joss' medium...