[secretk]

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post) You're welcome! Everything evolved over the years. Originally the Moderator Managers would temporarily moderate boards but it got to be too difficult to do that because there were only four Moderator Managers at the time, so one of them came up with the suggestion for a Moderator Support Team where existing moderators could join the team and help temporarily moderate boards, which freed up the Moderator Managers to perform their other responsibilities here like selecting new moderators, writing up evaluations for people that apply to moderate boards here and stepping in to help when posters cause trouble. They also ban spammers (people who join just to post spam) when one of the moderators reports them on the Ban and Warning thread on the Moderators board. They also check the activity of all the moderators here periodically to make sure that they're active on the boards that they moderate. It's become increasingly difficult to find and keep moderators here, so the job of the Moderator Managers and the Moderator Support Team is very important and very valued.

I think that it makes perfect sense. There are a lot of boards here and we need a lot of moderators. The moderators you have, the more you need organization for managing them.

I think that it's highly unrealistic to expect big group of people to be self organized or managed. So the more moderators you have, the more managers you need and sadly the more levels in organization you need. It's proven that groups should be no more than 6-7 people. Every person should report to not more than 4-5 people. Ideally even less. The same is valid for work.

We are currently trying to do the same in my team. The team is 24 people and one manager can simply not have the visibility to organize all of those people. It's just not possible.

Wow, I didn't know that. I always thought that Islam largely converted by the sword, but the Ottoman Turks enslaving the people they conquered was just so savage and cruel. So much savagery has been perpetrated on mankind in the name of religion. Christianity was just as bad as Islam, as was seen in the Spanish Inquisition, and the English Reformation, where so many innocent people died horrible deaths at the hands of misguided religious zealots.

Oh I agree with you. They are definitely not the only ones and this had happened in the past in a lot of places.

I completely understand that emotions can still run high as the Ottoman Empire only broke up after World War 1, which was only 100 years ago.

I think that this is the point. It had happened for sure in a lot of places for sure but it's recent enough for us because we got freed in 1878 which is actually not that long ago. People still remember it and is still important for our history. We were part of the Ottoman empire from 1394 to 1878. That's a lot of time - almost 500 years. A lot of cultural development was actually not done here. It had to happen quite fast in the last 120 years and this is something that has impact on the society as a whole. People still feel sort of consequences from this enslavement.

Like I said it's a subject studied quite extensively in school here. It has impact on our history, cultural development, literature. Most of the poets of this time have whole books and poems written about this time, about the wish for getting free, different organizations and initiatives to get free. We used to study this extensively in literature classes. It's really difficult to get into that mindset to understand what they meant. At least for me it was as it's far from the rather peaceful environment that we are currently living in.

[Jerry D]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Yes, honestly, the differences between film Hermione (fake) and book Hermione (real) is by far the most annoying, disappointing part for so many diehard Harry Potter Traditionalists. It is just vastly different. Hermione is adored in the book series. Why she had to go all "Hollywood" in the films is quite disappointing. As for Krum... yes, he liked Hermione some but they ended up just being friends. I do think the main reason why is because she didn't care that he was a famous professional Quidditch player and she was nice and intelligent, the real Hermione! Nothing ever developed romantically between them. Ron is a number one reason... Hermione had romantic feelings for Ron strongly at that point but Krum never pushed it either. They were friends. Notice the quote I included on the last thread in book 7 when Krum is highly romantically attracted to Ginny when he sees her at the wedding and he wants to date her. Harry got all jealous and had to lie that she was family and dating a guy that was jealous and protective just so Krum would back off, lol. The difference between Krum's feelings for Hermione versus Ginny are noted. Of course all we see in the films is Krum liking Hermione without the scene in book 7 between Krum and Harry when Krum wants to date Ginny and is highly attracted to her.

I can definitely understand the frustrations of the people who read the books because two of the key characters (Hermione and Ginny) came across so differently on the screen versus in the books. I can also understand why J.K. Rowling decided to step away from her involvement with the movies after the second movie.

[Jerry D]

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) I think that it makes perfect sense. There are a lot of boards here and we need a lot of moderators. The moderators you have, the more you need organization for managing them. I think that it's highly unrealistic to expect big group of people to be self organized or managed. So the more moderators you have, the more managers you need and sadly the more levels in organization you need. It's proven that groups should be no more than 6-7 people. Every person should report to not more than 4-5 people. Ideally even less. The same is valid for work. We are currently trying to do the same in my team. The team is 24 people and one manager can simply not have the visibility to organize all of those people. It's just not possible.

The Management Team here definitely grew and evolved over the years. I'm still a hands-on manager though and I help out where I can.

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) Oh I agree with you. They are definitely not the only ones and this had happened in the past in a lot of places.

Yes, religious persecution has gone on since the beginning of time and it will never end unfortunately.

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) I think that this is the point. It had happened for sure in a lot of places for sure but it's recent enough for us because we got freed in 1878 which is actually not that long ago. People still remember it and is still important for our history. We were part of the Ottoman empire from 1394 to 1878. That's a lot of time - almost 500 years. A lot of cultural development was actually not done here. It had to happen quite fast in the last 120 years and this is something that has impact on the society as a whole. People still feel sort of consequences from this enslavement. Like I said it's a subject studied quite extensively in school here. It has impact on our history, cultural development, literature. Most of the poets of this time have whole books and poems written about this time, about the wish for getting free, different organizations and initiatives to get free. We used to study this extensively in literature classes. It's really difficult to get into that mindset to understand what they meant. At least for me it was as it's far from the rather peaceful environment that we are currently living in.

Bulgaria also had it rough because it was under the Soviet sphere of influence after World War II and a Stalinist state was in place for many years. I'm glad that Bulgaria is a parliamentary democracy.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post) I can definitely understand the frustrations of the people who read the books because two of the key characters (Hermione and Ginny) came across so differently on the screen versus in the books. I can also understand why J.K. Rowling decided to step away from her involvement with the movies after the second movie.

Frustration all around, indeed. I am also glad Rowling backed away from being so involved. Honestly, I spent too much time being stressed over the films in hopes that they would accurately follow the books. The minute Rowling stepped away and beautifully told the fans to take the films and embrace as pure entertainment (and not the real thing in so many words) I stopped stressing. The only thing that still slightly bothers me is when some movie fans believe they ARE accurate and THE real deal, like they are coming directly from Rowling. Those loud ones don't have a clue but I try not to be bothered and just ignore the insanity.

[secretk]

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post) The Management Team here definitely grew and evolved over the years. I'm still a hands-on manager though and I help out where I can.

It's awesome of you to take your time to step up and help! I am sure that all moderators appreciate your help!

Yes, religious persecution has gone on since the beginning of time and it will never end unfortunately.

Sad but true.

Bulgaria also had it rough because it was under the Soviet sphere of influence after World War II and a Stalinist state was in place for many years. I'm glad that Bulgaria is a parliamentary democracy.

Overall let's just say that we had it bad since being under Ottoman Empire. Since then we have no luck. When we were taken over by the Ottoman empire we actually covered not the territory of our country, but also some of the neighboring countries like Greece, Turkey, Macedonia, Romania etc.

Unfortunately for us we were the center of the Ottoman Empire on the Balkans. The problem is that if you want stock/goods flaw from Asia to Europe you need go through the center of Balkans which basically means Bulgaria. At least at that time because there were no airplanes you know. But it still even now it;s like that. Even drug traffic bosses benefit from this territory which requires quite strict control. Because of this we were important (as far as territory goes, not as people ) for the Ottoman empire.

Out territory is also important for European countries. So actually our freeing up is a result of a war between Russia and Turkey (there are lots of poems of the actual fights actually that basically says that in the end the dead bodies of the soldiers were used as weapons). The end battle is on a mountain. Quite interesting is the whole strategy actually. My father dig this too so he had told me a lot about it . You could read about this here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Shipka_Pass.

The Russians and Bulgarians had made a gallant stand. Near the end having run out of ammunition, they threw rocks and bodies of fallen comrades to repulse the Ottoman attacks

It tells you how determined Bulgarians were to win this. I doubt that it was the Russians that tried to this and nevertheless it is proven that there were more Bulgarian volunteers than Russian soldiers. People talk about soldiers a lot and I do respect them but I respect a lot more those volunteers that risked their life to free the country. They did not have training, they were not prepared to be soldiers, they were not even asked. They volunteered for the whole nation and country. That's something that as a person I will always appreciate. And there is a reason why 3rd March (official end of the war) is a national holiday that appreciate their efforts.

Anyway back to the point. The war is between Russia and Turkey. Now you see Russia did not fight Turkey because they love us and find us relatives . They did it because they wanted to have influence on us. It's clear as a day.

Now once we were freed up there was a meeting between major European countries like France, Germany, England, Russia where they decided how our territory would be split. Yep, they decided. They split Bulgaria in 3/4 parts that were part of different countries even.

Nevertheless 7 years later on 6th September (national holiday) that unities the two main parts as far as territory goes - South and North Bulgaria basically.

The Russian diplomats knew that Bulgaria would not remain within these borders for very long — the San Stefano peace was called "preliminary" by the Russians themselves. The Berlin Congress began on 13 June [O.S. 1 June] 1878 and ended on 13 July [O.S. 1 July] 1878 with the Berlin Treaty that created a vassal Bulgarian state in the lands between the Balkans and the Danube. The area between the Balkan Mountains and the Rila and Rhodope Mountains became an autonomous Ottoman province called Eastern Rumelia.The separation of southern Bulgaria into a different administrative region was a guarantee against the fears expressed by Great Britain and Austria-Hungary that Bulgaria would gain access to the Aegean Sea, which logically meant that Russia was getting closer to the Mediterranean.

Source

So yeah we have always been a toy for the European countries. Russian influence was for a reason. And yes were were under Russian influence from 1878. The 1877-1878 war happened for a reason.

Also oh yeah there was communism here and oh yeah it was reflected in literature as well. So I had to get into that mindset as well in literature classes. It really sucked .

Jerry I am impressed that you know that much about Bulgaria's history. I highly appreciate that I can discuss this with you! Did you study it in college as part of your major or you were interested in the topic and read on your own?

[secretk]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Looks, female lead, charm.

I see.

I remember back in the day talking about it on the Harry Potter board. We were all so mad and disgusted.

It is disgusting!

No, lol. Not enough. But like I said, I stopped getting upset about it when Rowling told us she was going to stop as well, lol. That was before PoA (book 3) hit the large screen.

Makes sense . You have the books and you have enjoyed the story fully there!

[secretk]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) There are not different versions as far as the material isn't different, it is all the same... However, there are different covers... the American version has a few different covers that have developed over the years. Think about all the different countries in the world AND how many people love Harry Potter... so there are different covers for every country and then the English language is changed to their primary language too. I laugh at some of the illustrations... the French version cracks me up. LOL I know the American version/covers/art inside the books is the most accurate because the artist Rowling hired for the American books is the one that worked with her very closely as Rowling described her world and then the artist created it with pencil and paper. It is THAT accurate and the amazing thing is if I didn't even look at the American illustrations and just read and entered the World via Rowling's words, the appearance is the exact same as what the author created too... which makes sense since Rowling described the world and together, they worked on the looks of the characters and the description/appearance of the World as well.

That's cool. I think that the books I saw were in English but looked completely different. Had the same title, but the size was completely different and I was wondering how is this possible . I did not get into details, but I can check next time I go to that bookstore.

[Jerry D]

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) It's awesome of you to take your time to step up and help! I am sure that all moderators appreciate your help!

I'm not so sure about that sometimes!

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) Overall let's just say that we had it bad since being under Ottoman Empire. Since then we have no luck. When we were taken over by the Ottoman empire we actually covered not the territory of our country, but also some of the neighboring countries like Greece, Turkey, Macedonia, Romania etc. Unfortunately for us we were the center of the Ottoman Empire on the Balkans. The problem is that if you want stock/goods flaw from Asia to Europe you need go through the center of Balkans which basically means Bulgaria. At least at that time because there were no airplanes you know. Because of this we were important (as far as territory goes, not as people ) for the Ottoman empire. Out territory is also important for European countries. So actually our freeing up is a result of a war between Russia and Turkey (there are lots of poems of the actual fights actually that basically says that in the end the dead bodies of the soldiers were used as weapons). The end battle is on a mountain. Quite interesting is the whole strategy actually. My father dig this too so he had told me a lot about it . Anyway back to the point. The war is between Russia and Turkey. Now you see Russia did not fight Turkey because they love us and find us relatives . They did it because they wanted to have influence on us. It's clear as a day. Now once we were freed up there was a meeting between major European countries like France, Germany, England, Russia where they decided how our territory would be split. Yep, they decided. They split Bulgaria in 3/4 parts that were part of different countries even. Nevertheless 7 years later on 6th September (national holiday) that unities the two main parts as far as territory goes - South and North Bulgaria basically. So yeah we have always been a toy for the European countries. Russian influence was for a reason. And yes were were under Russian influence from 1878. The 1877-1878 war happened for a reason. Also oh yeah there was communism here and oh yeah it was reflected in literature as well. So I had to get into that mindset as well in literature classes. It really sucked .

Fascinating information Koni! Yes, Bulgaria and the Eastern European nations were used as pawns between first the Russian Empire and later the Soviet Union throughout the 20th Century, and I think it's a shame. We never should have let Stalin march into those countries at the end of World War II but the Soviets had the upper hand and Franklin Roosevelt was a dying man when he and Stalin and Churchill met at the Yalta Conference so Stalin and the Soviet Union had free reign to set up puppet Communist Regimes in your country and other countries in the Warsaw Pact. The Russians have always had evil intentions towards the countries in Eastern Europe and I feel that they still do.

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) Jerry I am impressed that you know that much about Bulgaria's history. I highly appreciate that I can discuss this with you! Did you study it in college as part of your major or you were interested in the topic and read on your own?

Well, I'm enjoying discussing this with you Koni! I took European History in both High School and College and since then I still love to read about the history of other countries. I've hated how your country and countries like Poland and other countries in Eastern Europe were used as toys between the warring superpowers throughout history.

[secretk]

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post) I'm not so sure about that sometimes!

They should!

Fascinating information Koni! Yes, Bulgaria and the Eastern European nations were used as pawns between first the Russian Empire and later the Soviet Union throughout the 20th Century, and I think it's a shame. We never should have let Stalin march into those countries at the end of World War II but the Soviets had the upper hand and Franklin Roosevelt was a dying man when he and Stalin and Churchill met at the Yalta Conference so Stalin and the Soviet Union had free reign to set up puppet Communist Regimes in your country and other countries in the Warsaw Pact. The Russians have always had evil intentions towards the countries in Eastern Europe and I feel that they still do.

This is where geography and history come together to be honest. Like I said Balkans are important territory for a lot of countries. I am not saying this to make someone believe that Bulgaria is something unique. It's not about the country or the name. It's about the geography in the truest sense. It is really important and ultimately this is what Central European countries wanted, what Russia wanted and what the Ottoman Empire wanted.

The Balkans were split in small countries because they did not want a big country to rule there. The whole reason why Bulgaria was not allowed to have the territory we have before the enslavement is because of this. No one wanted for us to be that important. Nevertheless we still were geographically speaking and this is why we were pawns. Now, it's still topic that our politicians are stupid and don't know how to play game. Instead of using this to their advantage, they let other countries playing us and they always manage to make the wrong decisions. In both first and second war they decided to support Germany instead of the other countries and in both cases we lost. It's other topic that in the second war in the end we decided to go against Germany and basically we were with Germany, but we saved actually the people and they were not persecuted in Bulgaria.

Well, I'm enjoying discussing this with you Koni! I took European History in both High School and College and since then I still love to read about the history of other countries. I've hated how your country and countries like Poland and other countries in Eastern Europe were used as toys between the warring superpowers throughout history.

Glad that we both enjoy this discussion! I would not want to bore you with details you don't want to read.

You are right. We are still pawns. And unfortunately I can't even understand USA's position here because sometimes your country is involved as well. I am not saying that they have something against us. I just can't understand the position fully and what's going on. Problem is most countries do not care about us, they are against Russia and they are using us in their cold war with Russia basically (I know that the cold war ended, but it's kind of similar) and in the end we are facing the consequences. Again I blame our politicians and not your or any other country. Our politicians are stupid. They do not know how to play the game properly. Countries benefit from our for one or another reason and we should use this to get something back. However they don't do it.

Btw I added some things in my previous post that I will transfer here:

The decisive battle for the Russia/Turkey war is on a mountain. Quite interesting is the whole strategy actually. My father dig this too so he had told me a lot about it . You could read about this here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Shipka_Pass.

The Russians and Bulgarians had made a gallant stand. Near the end having run out of ammunition, they threw rocks and bodies of fallen comrades to repulse the Ottoman attacks

It tells you how determined Bulgarians were to win this. I doubt that it was the Russians that tried to this and nevertheless it is proven that there were more Bulgarian volunteers than Russian soldiers. People talk about soldiers a lot and I do respect them but I respect a lot more those volunteers that risked their life to free the country. They did not have training, they were not prepared to be soldiers, they were not even asked. They volunteered for the whole nation and country. That's something that as a person I will always appreciate. And there is a reason why 3rd March (official end of the war) is a national holiday that appreciate their efforts.

Especially reading this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Uprising.

The revolt of Bosnia and Herzegovina spurred Bucharest-based Bulgarian revolutionaries into action. In 1875, a Bulgarian uprising was hastily prepared to take advantage of Ottoman preoccupation, but it fizzled before it started. In the spring of 1876, another uprising erupted in the south-central Bulgarian lands despite the fact that there were numerous regular Turkish troops in those areas. A special Turkish military committee was established to quell the uprising. Regular troops (Nisam) and irregular ones (Redif or Bashi-bazouk) were directed to fight the Bulgarians (May 11 – June 9, 1876). The irregulars were mostly drawn from the Muslim inhabitants of the Bulgarian regions, many of whom were Circassian Islamic population which migrated from the Caucasus or Crimean Tatars who were expelled during the Crimean War and even Islamized Bulgarians. The Turkish army suppressed the revolt, massacring up to 30,000[18][19] people in the process.[20][21] Five thousand out of the seven thousand villagers of Batak were put to death.[22] Both Batak and Perushtitsa, where the majority of the population was also massacred, participated in the rebellion.[19] Many of the perpetrators of those massacres were later decorated by the Ottoman high command.[19] Modern historians have estimated the number of killed Bulgarian population is between 30,000 and 100,000. The Turkish military carried on horribly unjust acts upon the vast Bulgarian populations. [23]

Another source about this:

But let me tell you what we saw at Batak ... The number of children killed in these massacres is something enormous. They were often spitted on bayonets, and we have several stories from eye-witnesses who saw the little babes carried about the streets, both here and at Olluk-Kni, on the points of bayonets. The reason is simple. When a Mohammedan has killed a certain number of infidels he is sure of Paradise, no matter what his sins may be ... It was a heap of skulls, intermingled with bones from all parts of the human body, skeletons nearly entire and rotting, clothing, human hair and putrid flesh lying there in one foul heap, around which the grass was growing luxuriantly. It emitted a sickening odour, like that of a dead horse, and it was here that the dogs had been seeking a hasty repast when our untimely approach interrupted them ... The ground is covered here with skeletons, to which are clinging articles of clothing and bits of putrid flesh. The air was heavy, with a faint, sickening odour, that grows stronger as we advance. It is beginning to be horrible.

See it here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Uprising (Eyewitness account of J. A. MacGahan on Turkish atrocities in Bulgaria, in a letter to the London Daily News of August 22, 1876[19]

The two cities - Batak and Perushtitsa are quite close to my village. Perushtitsa is actually just few miles from my village so that kind of hits close to me in the sense that I feel the energy of what had happened and home you know. It was full on massacre. But it made Europeans realize that the Ottoman Empire needs to be stopped. I had a classmate whose great great grandfather had survived this actually. He had a huge scar on his head but he survived. So yeah I get shivers just thinking about this.

Pretty much that right there explains the bad blood between Bulgarians and Turks. It's something that Bulgarians do remember and when emotions play high you could feel it.

My descendants from my father's side (his mother) actually migrated from Turkey. After the 1877-1878 war they remained on the Turkish territory not far from the border. They waited around 30 years to be freed, but this did not happen. In 1915 they started migrating and they decided to stay in this territory close to a city called Plovdiv. Half of the village is of such people that migrated together. Because of this we do not speak the regional slang in Perushtitsa or the other neighboring villages. My grandmother had actually gathered quite detailed information about this from her parents and around 20 years ago a woman wrote a book about this and interviewed my grandmother and used her research.

[jediwands]

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) That's cool. I think that the books I saw were in English but looked completely different. Had the same title, but the size was completely different and I was wondering how is this possible . I did not get into details, but I can check next time I go to that bookstore.

Hmm interesting. I don’t know what they could be. Could be the British version but those books are not any bigger than American ones. I have both the American and British books. Well, three sets of American paperbacks, 3 sets of American hardcovers, and one set of British hardcovers too, lol.

[Jerry D]

I'm going to buy the hardcover sets. I love hardcover books.

[Jerry D]

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) This is where geography and history come together to be honest. Like I said Balkans are important territory for a lot of countries. I am not saying this to make someone believe that Bulgaria is something unique. It's not about the country or the name. It's about the geography in the truest sense. It is really important and ultimately this is what Central European countries wanted, what Russia wanted and what the Ottoman Empire wanted. The Balkans were split in small countries because they did not want a big country to rule there. The whole reason why Bulgaria was not allowed to have the territory we have before the enslavement is because of this. No one wanted for us to be that important. Nevertheless we still were geographically speaking and this is why we were pawns. Now, it's still topic that our politicians are stupid and don't know how to play game. Instead of using this to their advantage, they let other countries playing us and they always manage to make the wrong decisions. In both first and second war they decided to support Germany instead of the other countries and in both cases we lost. It's other topic that in the second war in the end we decided to go against Germany and basically we were with Germany, but we saved actually the people and they were not persecuted in Bulgaria. Glad that we both enjoy this discussion! I would not want to bore you with details you don't want to read. You are right. We are still pawns. And unfortunately I can't even understand USA's position here because sometimes your country is involved as well. I am not saying that they have something against us. I just can't understand the position fully and what's going on. Problem is most countries do not care about us, they are against Russia and they are using us in their cold war with Russia basically (I know that the cold war ended, but it's kind of similar) and in the end we are facing the consequences. Again I blame our politicians and not your or any other country. Our politicians are stupid. They do not know how to play the game properly. Countries benefit from our for one or another reason and we should use this to get something back. However they don't do it. Btw I added some things in my previous post that I will transfer here: The decisive battle for the Russia/Turkey war is on a mountain. Quite interesting is the whole strategy actually. My father dig this too so he had told me a lot about it . You could read about this here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Shipka_Pass. It tells you how determined Bulgarians were to win this. I doubt that it was the Russians that tried to this and nevertheless it is proven that there were more Bulgarian volunteers than Russian soldiers. People talk about soldiers a lot and I do respect them but I respect a lot more those volunteers that risked their life to free the country. They did not have training, they were not prepared to be soldiers, they were not even asked. They volunteered for the whole nation and country. That's something that as a person I will always appreciate. And there is a reason why 3rd March (official end of the war) is a national holiday that appreciate their efforts. Especially reading this - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Uprising. Another source about this: See it here - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/April_Uprising (Eyewitness account of J. A. MacGahan on Turkish atrocities in Bulgaria, in a letter to the London Daily News of August 22, 1876[19] The two cities - Batak and Perushtitsa are quite close to my village. Perushtitsa is actually just few miles from my village so that kind of hits close to me in the sense that I feel the energy of what had happened and home you know. It was full on massacre. But it made Europeans realize that the Ottoman Empire needs to be stopped. I had a classmate whose great great grandfather had survived this actually. He had a huge scar on his head but he survived. So yeah I get shivers just thinking about this. Pretty much that right there explains the bad blood between Bulgarians and Turks. It's something that Bulgarians do remember and when emotions play high you could feel it. My descendants from my father's side (his mother) actually migrated from Turkey. After the 1877-1878 war they remained on the Turkish territory not far from the border. They waited around 30 years to be freed, but this did not happen. In 1915 they started migrating and they decided to stay in this territory close to a city called Plovdiv. Half of the village is of such people that migrated together. Because of this we do not speak the regional slang in Perushtitsa or the other neighboring villages. My grandmother had actually gathered quite detailed information about this from her parents and around 20 years ago a woman wrote a book about this and interviewed my grandmother and used her research.

Wow, what a fascinating and horrifying history Koni, and you tell it so well. It's so sad how the Bulgarian people have suffered over the years but they certainly took a brave stand against the Ottoman Turks along with the Russians.

I think that you're completely correct that the United States has played a part in using Bulgaria and Eastern Europe during the Cold War and it resonates to the present day. Vladimir Putin has pretty much revived the Cold War and I feel that he's as ruthlessly ambitious and calculating as Joseph Stalin was.

[secretk]

Originally Posted by Jerry D (View Post) Wow, fascinating and horrifying history Koni. It's so sad how the Bulgarian people have suffered over the years but they certainly took a brave stand against the Ottoman Turks along with the Russians.

Yeah . Of course this is in the past and it should stay in the past. I mean we should learn from it and move forward.

I think the issue is that because of this war there is still sort of division in Bulgaria. Some people are Russia supports, others are not. Some see Russia as saviors, others think that Russia had their own agenda. Same for communism. Some liked it because they benefited from it, others dislike it (because they were basically robbed).

I try to be neutral as possible. I know the issues in my country and I accept them. I still think that there are some interesting historical facts that could teach us something. And those are two separate things. For me studying our history is not so much about knowing that we were great once upon in the time and be proud about it, but to know why you were great and try to analyze and think about it.

What my father loves to focus is on analyzing our rulers and basically explaining to me why they were good or bad rules. Not good or bad people, but good or bad rules of the country. Those are two different things.

And no matter if it's monarchy or parliamentary democracy you need to know how to pick your leaders. And this is where studying history is useful.

Now obviously we evolve. We need to understand that most of those horrifying stories were not that weird back at that time. I mean the massacre was, but like I said it was pointed out and in the end it reached its goal. We were freed 2 years later. But let's be honest. Back in the day wars were regular thing. Countries used to fight for territory quite often compared to now. It was all about the army and the power and they were brutal. I know other brutal stories from our history both sides. Meaning brutal things that our rulers did and brutal things that other rulers did to us.

In a way we could see how much we evolved as a society. And we still have long way to go, but at least we know that we have been worse.

I think that you're completely correct that the United States has played a part in using Bulgaria and Eastern Europe during the Cold War and it resonates to the present day. Vladimir Putin has pretty much revived the Cold War and I feel that he's as ruthlessly ambitious and calculating as Joseph Stalin was.

I agree with this . This is why for me what we have now is basically Cold war. Most probably do not call it like that, but it seems like that. I also agree about Putin. I have my opinion about Russia. I do try to be neutral, but let's just say that their politics do not resonate with my overall views. That being said I do blame our own politicians, but that's a whole another issue. I have theory of my own where I blame communism for some issues that I currently see with people. It's an issue from psychological point of view.

Communism started as a really good idea for equality between people. Problem is that is not always fair. When you have two people - one is doing their job, the other is doing nothing and they get paid the same you end up with two lazy people . And that's just proven to be true. Such system forgets about the fact that we are emotional beings. In the same time there was actually no equality in real life. Communists had all sort of privileges - they were able to travel abroad, they had access to whatever they want. Others? Nah.

People were forced during election. If you don't vote, you did not vote for them so you are hated. If you voted, they don't know who you voted for. So yeah equality some other time . I call it BS.

I am OK about social benefits and good health care system, but when it comes to work people should get paid based on their performance. Of course then we need objective evaluation. Anyway the point is that the way the communism was done here promoted laziness to people. People tried to find all kind of ways to not work and get paid. People learnt that you could do whatever you want if you have friends on the right place.

But oh well. I could write so much about how the communism could be bad thing . I am not saying that capitalism is the best. Oh capitalism has its issues too - over exploiting people for one. So yeah let's just say that I do not think that we have evolved enough as a society to have found a good ruling or economical system. Like I said we are evolving, but we still have long way to go.

[secretk]

Originally Posted by The Apt (View Post) Hmm interesting. I don’t know what they could be. Could be the British version but those books are not any bigger than American ones. I have both the American and British books. Well, three sets of American paperbacks, 3 sets of American hardcovers, and one set of British hardcovers too, lol.

Could be . I will check and let you know!

[Jerry D]

Originally Posted by secretk (View Post) Yeah . Of course this is in the past and it should stay in the past. I mean we should learn from it and move forward. I think the issue is that because of this war there is still sort of division in Bulgaria. Some people are Russia supports, others are not. Some see Russia as saviors, others think that Russia had their own agenda. Same for communism. Some liked it because they benefited from it, others dislike it (because they were basically robbed). I try to be neutral as possible. I know the issues in my country and I accept them. I still think that there are some interesting historical facts that could teach us something. And those are two separate things. For me studying our history is not so much about knowing that we were great once upon in the time and be proud about it, but to know why you were great and try to analyze and think about it. What my father loves to focus is on analyzing our rulers and basically explaining to me why they were good or bad rules. Not good or bad people, but good or bad rules of the country. Those are two different things. And no matter if it's monarchy or parliamentary democracy you need to know how to pick your leaders. And this is where studying history is useful. Now obviously we evolve. We need to understand that most of those horrifying stories were not that weird back at that time. I mean the massacre was, but like I said it was pointed out and in the end it reached its goal. We were freed 2 years later. But let's be honest. Back in the day wars were regular thing. Countries used to fight for territory quite often compared to now. It was all about the army and the power and they were brutal. I know other brutal stories from our history both sides. Meaning brutal things that our rulers did and brutal things that other rulers did to us. In a way we could see how much we evolved as a society. And we still have long way to go, but at least we know that we have been worse. I agree with this . This is why for me what we have now is basically Cold war. Most probably do not call it like that, but it seems like that. I also agree about Putin. I have my opinion about Russia. I do try to be neutral, but let's just say that their politics do not resonate with my overall views. That being said I do blame our own politicians, but that's a whole another issue. I have theory of my own where I blame communism for some issues that I currently see with people. It's an issue from psychological point of view. Communism started as a really good idea for equality between people. Problem is that is not always fair. When you have two people - one is doing their job, the other is doing nothing and they get paid the same you end up with two lazy people . And that's just proven to be true. Such system forgets about the fact that we are emotional beings. In the same time there was actually no equality in real life. Communists had all sort of privileges - they were able to travel abroad, they had access to whatever they want. Others? Nah. People were forced during election. If you don't vote, you did not vote for them so you are hated. If you voted, they don't know who you voted for. So yeah equality some other time . I call it BS. I am OK about social benefits and good health care system, but when it comes to work people should get paid based on their performance. Of course then we need objective evaluation. Anyway the point is that the way the communism was done here promoted laziness to people. People tried to find all kind of ways to not work and get paid. People learnt that you could do whatever you want if you have friends on the right place. But oh well. I could write so much about how the communism could be bad thing . I am not saying that capitalism is the best. Oh capitalism has its issues too - over exploiting people for one. So yeah let's just say that I do not think that we have evolved enough as a society to have found a good ruling or economical system. Like I said we are evolving, but we still have long way to go.

Excellent points Koni. I completely agree that people should get paid based upon their performance, but here in America it always doesn't work out that way. The trend here is to exploit workers and give them as little as possible in many cases. I'll give you an example: My father was in a labor union in all of the jobs he worked in, and he never made a lot of money, but he was able to put us through college (we all worked though) and he was able to retire comfortably with a union pension at the age of 57. I'll have to work until I'm 70, and I don't have a pension and although I have money saved for retirement I worry that it won't be enough and that scares me. Most states here are now Anti-Union and they've passed "Right To Work" Laws that basically mean that companies have the right to hire non-union workers and fire those workers at any time for any reason, or for no reason. The Republican Governor of New Jersey, Chris Christie, refused to fund the Teacher's Pension Fund, which will eventually adversely affect many people, including Betty, and he was hailed as Presidential Material for doing that.

On the other hand, in my first job, the shop was a union shop, and many of the workers did little or nothing because the union would protect them, and they were grossly overpaid for what they did, so eventually the company moved to a Non-Union State and they all lost their jobs. Therefore, I think there needs to be a balance. I think that workers should be protected, but they need to actually work.