LuvLuke

I'm sorry I didn't have a chance before to thank you all for the warm welcome earlier (work has been a bear and I have hardly a moment to think straight)--I'm so happy to be here with lovely, fellow Mary & Matthew shippers! Hi LaraJo. Yeah, that board used to be interesting, but it's been taken over by a group of Sybil/Branson fans and that is all they talk about. Lots of anti-Mary and Matthew stuff, too, which is just ridiculous. They are the main characters of the show whether they like it or not. How can anyone not like them??? They must not be paying attention to anyone but Sybil/Branson. But who needs them as I now have you all to chat with!

Anyhoo, Michelle Dockery had said at the beginning of this series that the war hardened Matthew and that Mary wasn't going to be able to get anything out of him like she did in the first series. Meaning, like someone else said in an above post, that Matthew wasn't going to be wearing his heart on his sleeve. I think Mary really hurt him by hesitating to marry him and he's just trying to protect his own heart now. But Mary has worked hard this series to correct her mistake and prove to him how much she does love him. She's put his happiness first by being so kind and welcoming to Lavinia on his behalf when inside her heart is breaking over losing him. It's humbled her and now she knows what it means to love someone and put their needs above her own. I have to admire her for not throwing herself at him and demanding he give her another chance. She knows she blew it with him and knows it's up to her to prove herself to him. She gave him her beloved stuffed toy to take into battle and I doubt she would have ever done that for anyone else. She prayed for him, felt cold when he nearly died, nursed him despite never having or wanting to nurse anyone else before--that is a woman who truly loves. Matthew can hardly fail to see her efforts and see how she's changed and grown. But he attached himself to another before he realised how much Mary truly loved him and he is now too honourable to back out of the engagement. The only way to get him away from Lavinia would be if Lavinia was exposed for something underhanded--perhaps she's really not who she appears to be--or if Lavinia finally notices that Matthew's heart belongs to another. She must leave him in order for him to feel released from his obligation to her. Although Matthew is very honest--perhaps he will be like Captain Von Trapp in "The Sound of Music" and tell Lavinia, "It's no use, you and me. When two people love each other..." and confess he loves only Mary and cannot in all honestly commit his life to Lavinia. My fear is that Mary will let Carlisle intimidate her into marrying him and then it will be too late. I can only hope that Carlisle will be exposed for doing some dastardly deeds (perhaps having Vera killed??) and then Mary will leave him before she says "I do." I will be so angry and upset if Matthew marries Lavinia and/or Mary marries Carlisle. Nothing knocks me down more than investing in two characters only to have them never end up together. Perhaps in the Christmas episode Matthew will have sent Lavinia on her way and comes just in time to Mary and Carlisle's wedding to interrupt it and demand it not go on!! Well, a girl can dream, can't she?

lisztomania

no, i'd rather the crime of being responsible for vera's death be left to bates. i need that guy to have his flaw again. i'm hoping we'll get the von trapp thing. that sounds nice. maybe if matthew agrees to marry her, her "ruined reputation" wouldn't matter much anymore anyway once exposed by the scorned carlisle.

LuvLuke

Aww! Poor Bates! But, yes, I do understand where you're coming from. It sure will be interesting to see what comes of the whole Vera thing!

Yeah, I'm hoping Carlisle will think he can ruin Mary only to find that once the Pamuk scandal comes out Matthew doesn't care (and probably already knew about it) and declares Mary as his true love and marries her right under Carlisle's nose.

silverduck2day

@Larajo - you make some great points and I'd like to add that I think when Violet tells Matthew Mary loves him, he'll see all the great things she's been doing and it'll all fall into place - he won't doubt her again. Then he'll realise he loves Mary still, when he finally allows himself to admit it. I think too, they'll make it clear enough to the viewers that he does love Mary.

I do hope neither marries anyone else - it would just change things too much for me. Also, I don't want them to use "death" as yet another way of getting rid of something. I know the spainish flu killed loads of people, but I don't want it to kill off either Lavinia or Carlisle. I want something more original to get rid of them.

I do hope we get an ending for them this series! Not sure I can last til the christmas special!!

Famagusta

Michelle looks gorgeous in the Radio Times article (the pose in jeans). I just love her face. It's not Miss Universe gorgeous but she is just so charismatic and striking. In any scene in Downton, if she's around, she is the person I automatically zoom in on even if the scene is not about her.

The suspense will near kill us this week as to how it works out (or not) after the Violet chat.

But I am comforted by these words from the Series 2 Press Pack on Isobel : "...it is Isobel who sees more clearly than her son when Matthew's rigorous sense of honour is forcing him into a decision that will only bring unhappiness in its wake. No one can say she does not do everything in her power to avert it."

So not only do we have Violet rooting for a Matthew/Mary coupling but also Isobel although of course it's not enough that these 2 people are pushing for it --- Matthew himself must still love Mary. I am hopeful we get our happy ending, and I think we will. It's just a question of when. Downton has been played so clichedly and I just think it would be intolerably cruel that the biggest storyline of the programme will not get their Happily Ever After.

silverduck2day

As soon as I read that line in the press pack I immediately thought of his engagement to Lavinia. I bet the honour is what causes him to stay engaged to Lavinia and that's what Isobel convinces him not to do. I'm not sure she specifically ships Mary/Matthew, I think it's more Matthew/Happiness, but if he's only marrying Lavinia out of honour, (which I really reckon will happen) he won't be happy.

I think it will be M/M in the end, but I need it at the end of series 2! I don't wanna wait any longer, been waiting nearly a year since series 1 as it is!!

LuvLuke

That press packet statement actually scares me because I read it to mean that Isobel does her best to stop Matthew from making that decision but does not succeed--that he goes through with his decision which is why unhappiness is brought in its wake. Oh, please let me be wrong!!! I don't think I can stand waiting for another series until they admit they love each other and want to be together! That would be too cruel.

kindness is free

There must be a Downton special in the Radio Times this week I'll have to get that

About the bit in the promo where Violet tells Matthew how Mary feels I see him looking back on the things Mary has been doing and it will all fall into place and he'll know her feelings are true. Also getting Matthew to think about his feelings and realise who truly lies in his heart.

I agree something more original to get rid of Carlisle and Lavinia is needed. I don't want them to just kill them off with the Spanish Flu!

I don't want either of them to marry anyone else either. In my ideal world Mary and Matthew will be each others only marriage

I've never been on the Digital Spy forum either but if there are MM haters there I will give it a miss.

Famagusta

Ok guys, so I have just seen the 'This Morning' clip and it looks very likely that it was shot whilst Series 2 was being filmed and not during the Christmas episode, although not 100% obvious. I haven't bothered to put that in spoiler tags because it's neither here nor there so it's status quo on that aspect.

However, this is in spoiler tags and I speak with

silverduck2day

Ohhh, thanks for that! I've been on ITV Player for ages but they've not uploaded todays show yet. Thanks for describing the scene so well! Makes a LOT more sense and fits nicely with my theories.

Now, we just need it to be Sunday so we can see what happens after!

Oh and in that line from Isobel - I think the actress is being delibrately coy so we don't know one way or another! There's still hope!

destroyer of worlds

Your graphics are not rubbish. Though I will probably add more things and change things around in the OP, over time. And yup, I'll add that in now.

Wow, yeah ... I hadn't thought of that but that's very true. I love how that toy dog was so important for Mary but nothing mattered more to her than his safety so she gave it to him. And I know it hasn't been tested yet, but if he had to choose between two of them, I think he would choose Mary over Lavinia in a heartbeat.

LuvLuke

Oh, thank you so much for that--that is fantastic!! And glad to hear that the This Morning clip was most likely shot during series 2 filming and not the Christmas episode! Whew!!!

Now do you think from this clip that:

I've been thinking I need to rewatch the episode where Lavinia tells how she's connected to Carlisle with the whole scandal with her uncle. There has to be more to their relationship because why else would JF connect Lavinia to Carlisle? I mean, they could have just brought her in as simply the nice girl Matthew met and decided to marry--no need to complicate her further--unless it has to play into the story further down the road. I think the key to getting rid of Lavinia and Carlisle is what really happened between Carlisle and Lavinia. C. was clearly trying to intimidate L. when Rosamund came upon them--much like C. was trying to intimidate Mary in last week's episode. I don't think either will die in the flu epidemic--I think something more will be exposed between them that will leave Matthew and Mary free again.

holding my heart

Thanks for the new thread

Natasha Romanoff

Finally caught up with Downton Abbey. Please add me to the list they keep breaking my heart in every episode

holding my heart

Welcome