Fan Forum - [4x03] Restoration: Episode Discussion

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Good episode and a nice change to see Oliver dealing with a meta human. Loved seeing the Original Gangsta's back together again :yay:

Nyssa to me was the MVP of the episode I loved all her scenes. Although did anyone else think that Malcolm and Nyssa looked like they were turned on by their sparring more then they should as bitter enemies :lol:

Her warning to Laurel was ominous, I'm guessing they wont be sharing many milkshakes in their future. I'm curious if they will at least give her and Sara some closure.

Things I Liked:

- Felicity pulling Oliver and Diggle's head in and getting some resolution on that friendship rift. I feel like there may be some lingering issues but for the most part Im enjoying the fact that it looks like we will be getting some more DigO bromance and OTA scenes. And Oliver is coming around to be calling Team Arrow!

-Curtis Holt's storyline. I loved the whole fish out the water element to his story and the whole "just an ordinary day at work turned into..." I feel like that a great introduction for him into the Green Arrow world. I also love the fact that Felicity is the one making up lame excuses now.

Although NOT loving that they had grew up in Vegas, card counter Felicity not know what the rules are for Poker :no:

-But loved baby girl defending herself and fending off Double Down by herself with a little quick thinking on the fly :cheerleader: And love Oliver's surprise and pride at the fact that his girl managed to hold her own.

-The Thea developments are interesting. I mean I have no words for Malcolm but I definitely am intrigued by the fact that Thea is clearly going to have two opposing forces playing a tug of war for her soul- Oliver on one side Malcolm on the other.

-And nice writers destroying the LP right in time for you to off someone...guess they are clear in the fact that they want everyone to know that this death is going to stick.

Felicity rocked this episode. :sigh:

Yes, the developments with Thea were intriguing. Also, Malcolm said that the only way to fix the pit side effects was to kill the person that hurt you. I found that interesting. Nyssa was awesome last night. I like that despite her love and grief, she really wants to do what's best for Sara.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hannahfan (Post 83734569)

My thoughts was how long does it take for Thea to realize that Malcom is the cause of her pain? He set the wheels in motion that led her to the position she is in.

I also wonder if pehwps Malcom wants her on his side as is top Asassin. I do see endless possibilities with Thea. I don't think she'll be in the grave

Oh and did anyone ever mention that HIVE guy not shooting Diggle? What was up with that?

Another thing that intrigues me is what is Phase Three? And what did Damien do during Phase 1 and 2? Do we think whatever is going on in the Island Flash backs is tied into Damien's big grand plan somehow?

Also it sounds like Damien has partners and isn't calling the shots unilaterally. Maybe working with Vandal Savage? It would be a good way to tie the two shows together.

Also does anyone else think that Island girlfriend looks older then Oliver or is it just the lack of make up that makes her appear older? I have to say so far the direction they have taken with Island Girl has been different then I initially thought. I thought she was going to be some lackey in the group Oliver is caught up in and ergo a bad girl, but it appear she is actually good hearted and brave....which suggest to me that 1. Oliver is probably going to fall in love with her perhaps in a more serious way then he did Shado and 2. she is soooo going to die by the end of this Flash back storyline and 3. I think Oliver is going to be involved or responsible for her death some how.

But plus side if she is suppose to represent a contrast to Olicity and she dies then there is no contrast if Felicity dies also. But I guess I appreciate the writers drawing the comparison to Island Girl being brave against people bigger and badder than her to Felicity doing the same with her stern talking to Oliver and Diggle and taking down Double Down.

So far I'm not hating Island girl too much yet :lol: I'm even finding the Romeo and Juliet set up to her relationship with Oliver intriguing if somewhat predictable and clichéd. I'm sure I will love her as much as I love Ray Palmer in time though :nod: ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cmtaylor531 (Post 83734759)

I think Thea gets now that Malcolm is nothing but a problem in her life. At least it seemed that way last night. I definitely think Malcolm wants to replace Nyssa with Thea. I see the possibilities as well. I feel like Thea has a lot of strong emotional points that can be written for right now.

I noticed that. I thought it was very weird that the HIVE guy just backed off Dig and ran. I have no idea why he'd do that.

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Originally Posted by Glader|4|Life (Post 83732291)

it shouldn't be difficult to understand why Laurel would bring Sara back?? You don't have to like it or even agree with it, but it's 100% understandable. I just don't understand the extreme hate she is getting for it :look:

Agree. I think the hate is a bit... too much. Wanting to bring her sister back to life makes her the worst character in the world?:lol:
If anything, it makes Laurel selfish because she put her love for Sara over the actual consequences but she just wanted her sister back.:( AND I'm more upset with the writers then Laurel because we didn't get to understand her emotions or anything during this episode.

Quote:

Originally Posted by hannahfan (Post 83732452)

And I do realize that bashing KC is uncalled for, but I always ignore that kind of stuff because it's not worth the hassle and most everyone is discussing the show peacefully and can separate realfrom fiction. One post does negate the sensible opinions about the episode that are being shared.

I agree. I just wish the writers wrote her character a bit better. They did well in Season 3, please continue this season.

It was just an odd episode from a Laurel perspective... like did the writers forget that Laurel/Nyssa became friends last season? that seemed to be all diminished during this episode.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pollock (Post 83732901)

Why does any conversation about Laurel require Felicity/Olicity being brought into it and vice versa? How does Oliver running for Mayor preclude him or become some kind of sign that he doesn't care about what his sister is going through? (Especially when recent spoilers indicate that Thea is supportive of his decision to run for Mayor) Laurel's actions are Laurel's actions, if it was Oliver bringing Felicity back after a year of being buried in the ground they would be Oliver's actions alone with nothing to do with Laurel.

Now if we want to compare Oliver's decision to bring Thea back to Laurel bringing Sara back then there is more ground because they are actual comparable situations. But I think for a lot of people this comes down to perspective and informed decisions- what perspective and information did Oliver have going in to make his decision, what perspective and information did Laurel have going in to making her decision?

Both their reasons are understandable they love their sister, they want them back as hey felt they didn't deserve to die. I think some people are just offended that Laurel chose to raise Sara after her family and loved ones had spent a year dealing with and moving on from their grief, where as Oliver's was a more spur of the moment action when Thea as near dead or brain dead not literally dead like Sara. Also though Oliver was warned that Thea might not be the same if she was raised from the LP Oliver had not seen the evidence of that- in fact he had seen that Ras had survived hundreds of years on the LP and seemed relatively normal. He hadn't seen the effect of the LP first hand. Laurel had via Thea.

Though I would argue that Laurel's perspective gave her the impression that whatever Thea was going through it was manageable and therefore she felt that if she is there for her sister she would be able to manage whatever side effects Sara had, but she didn't realise that Sara was going to go through a lot more because the side effects are a lot worst because Sara has been dead a lot longer.

She made a bad call, maybe even a selfish one. She is not the first character on the show and she wont be the last but like all the other characters on the show who have made bad decisions or selfish decisions she will have to pay the consequences, pay her dues and grow from them.

Anyway Im watching the episode now and very excited to see how everything plays out. Thoughts on the episode to come later :)

Well I'm an Olicity fan and I brought it up.:lol: I brought it up because how big the Laurel hate has gotten. My analogy was bringing out the most popular ship to the least favorite Arrow character, and I stick by saying if anyone else did with Laurel did in this series, they wouldn't have gotten as much hate as she did.

If anything, it's all the writers fault for not explaining Laurel's feelings more.
I understand that Laurel's actions are Laurel actions and Oliver's actions are his own but I feel that sometimes people come off a bit hypocritical when there is anything Laurel concerned.
Like if Laurel killed Sara while being under Malcolm's watch, Laurel would get hate for it but Thea would not... because yeah it wasn't her fault but if it was Laurel, let the ranting begin.

So I think it's difficult for Laurel fans to even discuss the character because the bashing has gotten way out of control, and it's translating to actor bashing about Katie Cassidy...
That's the point I was trying to get across. It's okay to dislike Laurel ... trust me during Season 1-2... I really find her as a pointless character however I never went on to say URG Katie Cassidy, or how I wish she would jump off a cliff.

I just don't understand why Laurel should just die for bringing her sister back to life?:shrug: I agree not agreeing with her actions but I think that's a bit over top.

Now with the rest of your post.:clap: Completely agree with you because I felt the same way.

I didn't mention my annoyances earlier.

One was actually Felcity and how many times they had her drive home OTA. It was cute in the opening scene when she called them OG or "original gangsters". That made me laugh. However at the end when the three of them were having drinks and she kept on it... Well it became annoying and tedious. They went to far with it for me.

Then I give Laurel a pass for most of this stuff because we all know they just want Sara back for Legends so yea it's all contrived. However, when Sara was all crazy and Laurel said, " Dad is gonna be so happy to see you." I had a WTF moment. I was like really Laurel now your the crazy one. :lol:

Quote:

Well I'm an Olicity fan and I brought it up. I brought it up because how big the Laurel hate has gotten. My analogy was bringing out the most popular ship to the least favorite Arrow character, and I stick by saying if anyone else did with Laurel did in this series, they wouldn't have gotten as much hate as she did.

Another Olicity fan who loves Laurel and Felcity. :hug: I used to think I was all alone. :yay:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cmtaylor531 (Post 83735412)

Oh I loved it.:(

I agree with you on the Laurel scene.:lmao: I don't get the writing for her character at all this episode which is why I disliked how she was written.:( Like I seriously wished I could have read her mind or something.lol

Like is Laurel doing it for her father? is she doing this because of her love? is she doing this because she never truly moved on from Sara's death.... but that doesn't add up to season 3: Laurel, she became stronger because of her sister's death and she honored her by becoming Black Canary... so I just don't get why Laurel couldn't have an perspective during this episode.

I admit I did love Olicty more during Season 1-2 for now I'm just going through the motions with them. Season 3 was a disappointment to me but Season 4, their relationship is going back on track!

Quote:

Like is Laurel doing it for her father? is she doing this because of her love? is she doing this because she never truly moved on from Sara's death.... but that doesn't add up to season 3: Laurel, she became stronger because of her sister's death and she honored her by becoming Black Canary... so I just don't get why Laurel couldn't have an perspective during this episode.

I said earlier that I got the feeling Laurel was doing it more for her dad then her. Which doesn't seem to turn out well from the promos. ;)

Quote:

motions with them. Season 3 was a disappointment to me but Season 4, their relationship is going back on track!

I shipped Laurel/Oliver in season one. Then in season two when he got back with Sara it sort of ruined them for me. I already thought Laurel had ton forgive a lot to get back with him. After season two it became to much for me. Laurel would have to be crazy to want him. She deserves better than Oliver ever treated her IMO. I actually started shipping O/F in season two never expecting it to happen. Then it did and in was so happy in 3x01. Granted that didn't last long. :lol: I started to become annoyed with them quickly from the writing. However the 3x20 goodbye scene is what brought me back. It was my favorite moment for them all f season 3. That was good angst. They have been written well for me so far this season so I shan't complain... Yet. ;)

I think the writers were just using Felicity as their voice in acknowledging that one of the big errors of last season was the fact that the let the OTA dynamic go to the way side when they experimented around with adding Roy Laurel and Thea into the mix. It was a wink and a nod to the audience that they know the OTA is a big part of the shows dynamic and what made them so successful in the first place.

This season is very much a back to basics season in a new and different way and so highlighting the OTA is just one part of that :shrug: especially since Marc said at the end of season 3 that season 4 focal point was going to be there relationships with each other.

^ I liked the focus on O/D/F. I love the "Original Gansters." :lol:

It was just that last scene for me. It felt a bit to much. I was like yea we get it. I understand what you are saying though about Felcity being the writers voice.

They were probably over the top with it, especially with actually making the phrase Original Team Arrow canon :lol: but yeah it was mainly a shout out to the fans. Sort of like the boxing glove arrow moment :lol:

Quote:

Originally Posted by eternal◘fate (Post 83735403)

[FONT="Tahoma"]Well I'm an Olicity fan and I brought it up.:lol: I brought it up because how big the Laurel hate has gotten. My analogy was bringing out the most popular ship to the least favorite Arrow character, and I stick by saying if anyone else did with Laurel did in this series, they wouldn't have gotten as much hate as she did.

If anything, it's all the writers fault for not explaining Laurel's feelings more.
I understand that Laurel's actions are Laurel actions and Oliver's actions are his own but I feel that sometimes people come off a bit hypocritical when there is anything Laurel concerned.
Like if Laurel killed Sara while being under Malcolm's watch, Laurel would get hate for it but Thea would not... because yeah it wasn't her fault but if it was Laurel, let the ranting begin.

So I think it's difficult for Laurel fans to even discuss the character because the bashing has gotten way out of control, and it's translating to actor bashing about Katie Cassidy...
That's the point I was trying to get across. It's okay to dislike Laurel ... trust me during Season 1-2... I really find her as a pointless character however I never went on to say URG Katie Cassidy, or how I wish she would jump off a cliff.

I just don't understand why Laurel should just die for bringing her sister back to life?:shrug: I agree not agreeing with her actions but I think that's a bit over top.

You make tremendous sense. Excellent, mature thoughts. Bang on.