PhoenixRising

Is she coming back to Boriga?

Nikki K

Yes she is. I think she's in almost all of the first nine s2 episodes that are listed on imdb.

PhoenixRising

And are they still using the same actor as Joffre? Has he.....grown?

BL.Arinna_1982

I don't know.

PhoenixRising

Man, the not knowing is killing me. Doesn't Joffre die before Cesare at some point as well?

Nikki K

No he doesn't. He fights by his site for a long time until Cesare's imprisonment. Cesare tries to reconcile Joffre and Sancia before he got deported to Spain and Joffre goes with him to Spain, asking for time to think about it, as far as I read. In the meantime Sancia dies and Joffre stays in Spain for a long time until he marries his cousin Maria de Mila and they move back to Squillace. They have a bunch of children actually and its the branch of the Italian Borgias which I think lasted the longest. Joffre dies a few months before Vanozza and Lucrezia. I think there's a letter in which Lucrezia states how distraught she was by Joffre's death. That was in 1518.

But you can read all of that in the super informative OP which I whipped up.

PhoenixRising

Oh, man. Sancia died? and Joffre married his cousin? Well then it's not hard to believe those rumors about Cesare and Lucrezia.

If he died before Lucrezia then it wasn't that long after Cesare died, since Cesare died only 12 years before Lucrezia did. Wow, they all died so close together.

Thanks again for the info, Nina.

Nikki K

Well, I mean it was a very very distant cousin. I can look up the relationship if you give me a second.

Well Sancia died in between 1504 and 1506 (not entirely sure about the DOD), Cesare died in 1507, Joffre and Vanozza died in 1518 and Lucrezia died in 1519. Okay, let me look up Maria de Mila. (I hope we get to see her, well on Borgia I bet we get a shot at that.).

Okay, here it goes on Maria de Mila -- we do remember Adriana de Mila (played by Andrea Sawatzki on 'Borgia') so that was this part of the family.

So Rodrigo's mother was Isabella and she had a sister named Catalina who married one Juan de Milá, Baron de Masavalés. They had two children: Luis Juan (who became Cardinal along with Rodrigo when their uncle Alonso became Pope Calixtus III) and Pedro who married Cubella Dolce. The two of them had five children:

(1) Juan de Milà, Baron von Masalaves ∞ Isabella-Lucrezia de Borgia Llançol de Romanì
(2) Adriana de Milà ∞ Ludovico Orsini, their only son Orsino married Giulia Farnese
(3) Luis de Milà (probably a cleric or died early)
(4) Caterina de Milà ∞ Gasparo, Count of Procida and Aversa
(5) Jaime de Milà, Comte d'Albaida ∞ Leonor de Aragón, their only daughter was Maria who married Joffre ... so through all the twisted inbreding she was a distant cousin of both Joffre and Sancia.

And here goes my evening lesson.

So you see it wasn't that close of a family relationship. His grandmother was her great-grandmother's sister.

PhoenixRising

Thank you once again, professor Nina. I guess it's true when they say many couples are distantly related. Still a shame about Sancia.

Nikki K

It's a mess. No wonder there was so much insanity going around.
And haha... hardly professor of anything ever. Plus I'm better at explaining things I actually teach... well taught.

BL.Arinna_1982

I can't see them.

PhoenixRising

Yeah, I think there's something wrong with the pics you posted, Nina.

Nikki K

Sometimes it's just plain annoying when people don't let you link to the pictures. If you don't want that, just say so but honestly all those huge sites should have enough server space to support this. Anyway... let's see if that works:















Source: zimbio.com

BL.Arinna_1982

Okay, it's scary how much she looks like Nina Dobrev!

Nikki K

I'm jealous that she is naturally tanned but then what did I expect being very pale and very blonde. You always want what you can't have.













Source: zimbio.com