I empathized with both Florence and Edward, too. I think that was the whole point in having us readers know each of their thoughts. I was frustrated with them as well. I just wanted to shake them and say, "Just spit it out already!"

Did you side with either Florence or Edward? Did you like one more than the other? Did you think one of them was truly responsible for what happened? Do you think they could've worked it out?

Well at times I sided with one more than the other... but of course it must be intentional that you feel torn between the two. Though I must say that at times I couldn't really relate to Florence. She is rather uptight.

I think it is an important point that only with his elderly wisdom is Edward able to see what he did wrong at the beach. So the age (the experience that comes with getting older) is what makes him qualified to understand her. I don't think they could have worked it out.. they didn't understand each other and they weren't able to be themselves with one another and express their thoughts.

It takes two to tango… and even though they were dancing, they just stared at their feet to see if they did it the right way, forgetting the whole idea of the dance, which is to connect and to feel the passions. Well enough of my twisted imagery

That's really interesting I've discussed this with another person who's read it, and she also sides with Edward. She said the same thing as you -- how she can't understand how Florence is so uptight and why Florence reacted in the way that she did.

I actually sympathize with Florence more than Edward. I don't know if you read it or not, but I think Florence was sexually abused by her father when she was younger. It wasn't directly stated, but more hinted. That's why I feel a bit more sorry for her. That's probably why she's so rigid and uptight with the notion of sex. It's too bad that she couldn't communicate that with Edward.

Edward -- I felt for him, too, but I couldn't help being a tad bit more irritated with him. He's so obsessed with sex and with satisfying himself that it got a bit annoying. He got so angry with her as well. That last scene with them on the beach -- urgh, I was so mad at him. He reacted so angrily and selfishly. Florence said some nasty things to him as well, but I think it's because he kinda egged her on. Out of the two of them, I actually think Florence was a bit more mature. I think she actually loved him more than he loved her. She was willing to be with him and have him do whatever he wanted as long as he's happy.

I agree with you. I don't think they could be with each other, but if they had met in a time (later) when there's more open communication, then perhaps they could've talked things through.

It's heartbreaking, and the optimistic/romantic in me thinks that they could've saved their relationship. Especially since Edward ended up growing old alone. That last part that occurs in the future was so heartwrenching. I have to wonder whatever happened to Florence? If she were able to find love and happiness with another man.

I did actually see the hint and I wondered for a long time whether she had been abused or not. I concluded that she had not been abused, because when they are about to have sex she doesn't seem frightened or traumatized, but truly disgusted as if this is something dirty. She knows nothing about it and has had no one to talk to about it... which caused her to borrow that book.

I simply think that she is the product of non-sexual environment - she is not used to be touched or to let anyone cross her intimate boundaries. As described in the book her mother never really showed affection (never hugged nor kissed them). Being from a rich family (I don’t know if she is upper-class… I’m not too familiar with the English hierarchy) her parents have probably never showed affection towards each other in public/in front of others. She has lived a very chaste life. This also shows in her reaction when it goes wrong on the bed.

To be honest I don’t think Edward is that bad, I just think he is… a man . His biggest fear (which I understand is a common male fear) for the night becomes reality and her reaction on top of that… ouch. And I know she felt bad, but he doesn’t know that. He is hurt and humiliated… so he becomes angry with himself… but he transfer that anger onto her, because it is easier to be angry with her or at least it easier to express that anger. I think many would do the same in that situation, because when people are hurt they are vulnerable and the anger works a defence mechanism. I think he is very normal… she on the other hand could use some psychological help (abused or not).

I don’t really think they were suited for one another. I think he was very patient with her… but he was too consumed in making it work; getting to the next level, that he didn’t realise that there was a deeper problem.

At the end I think Ian McEwan is using a literary device to show that because Edward will never know neither will we. Therefore if ever in the same position take action yourself. Life does not come to you, you create it… or something something
of course that is just my opinion

According to Ian McEwan, Florence was sexually abused. This is taken from an interview:

So of course, she would react to sex as if it were a dirty act, she was abused. There's nothing nice about it from that standpoint. I believe Florence is the way she is due to this abuse. I agree; her mother was a very cold and unaffectionate person, but I don't think her father was. If I recall correctly, Florence was very affectionate with her father at times. She would want to embrace her father, but then hate herself for feeling that way. I've heard that abuse victims can feel that way towards their abuser -- a love-hate kind of thing.

I agree that Florence's reaction in bed was very over-the-top/irrational, but she already had deep-seated, psychological issues about sex due to the abuse. I sympathized with her though, because although she carried these internal feelings of disgust/hatred about sex, she still tried to 'make it work'. She read a how-to manual, and she was calm and willing to go all the way with Edward up until that unfortunate incident. That takes a lot of guts... and love for Edward. That was a pretty selfless thing to do, but agreed, she does need help for her psychological issues, poor thing.

Yes, Edward was being a typical 'man'... concerned about his sexual prowess and pleasure... I guess his reaction is understandable but still over-the-top. I find it interesting that you find him 'normal'. I think he had some anger issues, even before the aftermath on the beach. This was referenced when he got into a fight with that guy... forgot his name. I think he got a bit angry with Florence at times, too, for being so frigid, but he internalized it and held it in, so I guess that's what lead to the angry blowup at the end. It got too much, I guess. You called him 'normal', but did you wonder about whether he was affected by his upbringing as well? Did you think he was affected at all by his brain-damaged mother and by having to be brought up primarily by his father?

I agree with your assessment about McEwan's message. A lot can happen in your life even if you don't take any action.

Well I find it a little disappointing that her actions/thoughts are caused by an abusive childhood, merely because that story has been told a 100 times before. I found it much more interesting to explain her reactions through strictly chaste upbringing. If we talk hermeneutics, it could be interesting to discuss whether it is more important what the author intended to be the meaning or the reader that independently determines that meaning of the story. But as he says himself:

Either way this really doesn’t affect my view on Edward, who has no idea that she was abused. I cannot blame him for being oblivious. I remember the incident when he beat up that rocker (wasn’t it a rocker?) and got in some other fight around bars, but I didn’t see that as anger problems. I thought that reflected how his family never talked about their problems; ergo he has learnt to talk with his fists. I thought it reflected how he came from a less cultivated family, therefore he uses a less civilise method: violence.

I have to say, even though Edward’s father seems like a saint there is something about that military moustache that disturbs me. Even though their house is a mess it seems as if there is a certain way to do things, there is the same schedule for every day. Plus, “He expected to be obeyed”…there something very strict about the father, furthermore his is a headmaster.
I thought Edward was really patient with Florence… very careful with every move he made, being sure not to scare her off. But maybe I’m just comparing with guys nowadays but I definitely did not see Edward as having anger management problems.

I don't know if you could call it 'siding with someone' but I did prefer reading from Edward's POV.
And Florence sometimes really bugged me. I wanted to yell at her that she should tell him how she really feels already

you can hope for another end in the book

I know what you mean about Florence. She's definitely frustrating, and that's what pains me. I enjoyed reading from Edward's perspective, too, but I just wished we had Florence's perspective at the end. I really wanted to know how she ended up in life.