[TheAngel]

This is a living creature we're talking about. Do you understand the psychological impact of a child growing up in an abusive home, or with the knowledge that they were a mistake? Most conservatives are about life, but what about the quality of that life? You seem to place no value on the quality of that child's life and simply want an adult to learn from their mistake. What about the woman who was raped? The one who was drugged? The one who will be beaten and abused by her father if he finds out she's pregnant? What about the one who can barely afford food for herself, much less a baby? Why does a child have to suffer for its parent's mistakes? Life or not, I would rather have been aborted than been unwanted and abused. Babies have no consciousness. All this crap about them being able to dream and feel pain is just that. No one can remember their time in the womb and even plants have pain reactions but that isn't stopping anyone from eating a salad.
I'm not pro-abortion. I'd love to see a day where abortion is obsolete because of access to birth control, good information about safe-sex and pregnancy, and strong self-esteem in women who feel like they can insist that a man wear a condom or can refuse sex without being afraid of some of the repercussions that exist now.

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Originally Posted by TheAngel (View Post) I'm not pro-abortion. I'd love to see a day where abortion is obsolete because of access to birth control, good information about safe-sex and pregnancy, and strong self-esteem in women who feel like they can insist that a man wear a condom or can refuse sex without being afraid of some of the repercussions that exist now.

That's where I am too.

Meanwhile...:

Maryland drops charges against doctors over late-term abortions (Reuters) - A Maryland prosecutor has dropped murder charges against two doctors accused of performing late-term abortions on fetuses that could have lived outside the womb, in a case that drew national attention as a test of fetal homicide law. Last December, Cecil County State's Attorney Ellis Rollins brought murder charges against Drs. Nicola Riley and Steven Brigham. But Rollins said on Tuesday a medical expert who originally offered his opinion that a late-term abortion performed by the doctors in 2010 was in Maryland, now said he was not sure whether it was in Maryland or New Jersey. The case was the first time Maryland's fetal homicide law was applied to doctors, who are provided with an exception. Riley and Brigham were charged with multiple counts of first- and second-degree murder as well as conspiracy to commit murder because prosecutors argued the abortions were performed on fetuses that could have "viably lived" if they had been born at that time. The charges stemmed from an abortion the doctors performed in August 2010 on a young woman, nearly six months pregnant, who suffered complications and had to be hospitalized. According to the charges that have now been dropped, she sought the abortion at Brigham's clinic in New Jersey, where she received preliminary injections. She then drove to the clinic in Maryland, where Riley performed the abortion procedure with Brigham present, the charges said. Groups both for the right to abortion and against it were watching the case as a test of a state law tied to the "viability" of an unborn fetus. Under Maryland law, people can be charged with murder if they "intend to cause the death of the viable fetus." The law defines a fetus as "viable" if "there is a reasonable likelihood of the fetus' sustained survival outside the womb." It provides exceptions for licensed doctors. The case in Maryland illustrates "an environment where people think that it's OK to target abortion providers," said Janet Crepps, deputy director for the legal department at the Center for Reproductive Rights. "It's just indicative of the fact that in some states in some ways, and generally in the country, we've gotten to a toxic environment" regarding abortion, she said. Abortion opponent Carol Tobias said the murder charges filed last December in the case had come as "a nice surprise." "If there were babies found past the stage where state law says are allowed ... the state needs to investigating these cases," said Tobias, president of the Washington-based Right to Life Committee. Prosecutor Rollins said abortion was not the issue. "This has nothing to do whether you personally believe it or you don't believe in it. This is a question of whether or not Maryland law was violated, period," Rollins said. The investigation remains open, he said. Source: Maryland drops charges against doctors over late-term abortions - 1450 WHTC Holland's Hometown Station

If you ignore the jurisdictional issues for a while, it's an interesting case. To me it underlines why the time-limits on abortion needs to be fixed and not using loose terms like "viable."

[Cristofle]

I am HOPING this Arizona law doesn't hold up.

Arizona Senate Passes Bill Allowing Doctors To Not Inform Women Of Prenatal Issues To Prevent Abortions | Addicting Info

[Gray Ghost]

TheAngel, you bash me for being such a pessimistic person yet you make it sound like if a child is put up for adoption or foster care that they're basically screwed for life. You claim to be a gay rights actvist yet you never talk about how a woman who chooses to do the right thing ie put her baby up for adoption instead of killing it would actually help gay people and couples that can't have kids.

If a doctor kills a baby that survived an abortion, he/she is no doubt a murderer and should be punished severely. I don't care if any of you disagree with me that though it wouldn't surprised me.

It's baby killing. Plain and simple. If playing the victim makes you sleep at night, go for it. Abortion is for the weak and not responsible or mature type.
You want to have sex but don't want to accept any type of responsibility for your actions. What kind of message is that?

Cristofle, I hope that Arizona law passes just for you.

[sunnykerr]

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