Ashes Fall

Support, not shippers.
While true I've seen appreciation for them as friends, few seem to like the idea of them evolving into a couple.

True.
Although Lucifer is the only other fandom I've explored the fanfiction community of, even the other ships in the Buffyverse from what I've come across while searching for CA don't seem to have the exclusive libraries CA does.

You don't have to convince me.

It was a vague reference but telling nonetheless.

FAITH: Angel, when Cordelia died, you had everyone at Jacoby, Meyers and Satan working for you. In a world that still had magic. If it coulda been done, you'da done it then.

ANGEL: It's not that cut and dried. There have always been resurrection spells. Wolfram and Hart had dozens. They just aren't used much, because they're hard...dangerous...and they only work on the body. The soul's a whole different thing. You end up with a zombie...or worse.

I don't see how he could have known so extensively what W&H's resurrection resources were if he didn't look into it.

I hate season 5 period with the obvious exception of YW but agree that TCTONC was filler material though it had the potential to be a more direct reference to his emptiness since losing Cordy.
I don't remember the whole 'hero's heart' thing but great catch. That's beautiful symbolism.

Yup, that's what I was getting at and how that reference goes all the way back to the pilot.

"You’ve made a good choice. She’ll provide a connection to the world. She’s got a very – humanizing influence."

That line might very well have been the biggest foreshadow of the entire series.

That didn't even occur to me. Good point.

I'm on the fence as well, I feel that Cordy being a self-chosen pure human champion who fought with no special abilities is a large part of what made her such a strong character and set her apart from Buffy but at the same time, becoming part demon was her choice as well. The visions, the innocents in need, Angel, she chose all that over her long dreamed of stardom. That was the most astounding display of character growth I've ever seen, only matched so far by Lucifer's choice to return to Hell to protect his loved ones and earth from more demon invasions.

I understand. Although I've never had issues with the subject of rape, I've got a colorful rap sheet of being taken as rude or disrespectful due to poor wording choice even when I spent a **** lot of time on it or too much enthusiasm.
As a result, I've built the habit of clarifying myself as well when I am concerned.

Amen.
Here's something else to consider.

I believe Angel says at some point that he fell in love with Buffy when he watched her answer her calling. What if he hadn't?
What if he'd never met Whistler, never been specifically been pointed towards Buffy, what if he'd been drawn to Sunnydale by the Hellmouth or been pointed towards it rather than Buffy?

Do you think that would have changed anything?

Side note: We need to pick out our next episode. Any thoughts?

straws

I've seen a decent amount of romantic CA support on Tumblr. Again, the show has been off the air for a long time, so their tag isn't exactly hopping, but a lot of their shippers still love them, they just have shiny new interests.

His silence there is very telling. He doesn't deny it when Faith says he would've resurrected Cordy if he could.

My memory is honestly so rusty but the demon ( or whatever it was) was eating the heart of heroes.

Angel was upset the demon didn't want to dine on his:

ANGEL
The reason why I know this Aztec demon is not eating the hearts of heroes is... he didn't take mine. Am I honestly supposed to believe that it had no problem sticking a sword in my stomach but then decided, "Oh, wait, his heart's not heroic enough"? Ha! I don't think so.

More proof that Angel's heart just wasn't right after losing Cor and Connor.

I totally agree. That's why I love Cordy's "Demonize me already" moment even though I prefer her human. I'm sure I could've loved Cordy being a demon as well, had it actually been written. Instead, we got that awful retconny Jasmine arc. (And like we've discussed, I don't she was ever made into a demon at all - but part higher power).


Interesting questions. I'd like to read a fic that explores that.

I do think Buffy had a huge formative impact on Angel. She helped inspire him to fight the good fight in the first place. But Cordy helped inspire him to live instead of just exist.

When he was with Buffy, all he had was Buffy. He didn't have his own friends, his own life. He was on stand by, alone in the broken down mansion, until she needed help to slay something or decided to visit him.

Hmm. What other episodes were on our possible watch list?
Halloween, City Of...RWAV
Your Welcome but that's a heavy one (I always get teary).

Any requests?

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Makes sense.

That's a good point as well.

Oh wow. That's loaded with quite profound subtext.

That he refuses to accept that his heart isn't heroic and even considers himself a hero at all under his circumstances at this point has to be an ode to Cordy, a desire to be the man she believed he was.

"That's not betraying her, that's honoring her."

She didn't even have to think about it, just one glance at insane!Angel settled it for her.

I refuse to associate it with Jasmine though I do acknowledge that it was the official beginning of that dumpster fire.
As far as I'm concerned Jasmine started with Groo in WITW. So there!


I stand by that 100%.

Her powers of light and the fact that she doesn't experience vision headaches anymore while Doyle who was half-demon did scream 'higher power'.


Well, put and Sunnydale fics make that distinction excellently.
I would say that Buffy also taught him what it means to love which is what enabled him to love Cordy.


Those are good.
There's also TVT.

I'm feeling either City Of or RWAV.

straws

Fully agree.

Always happy to watch RWAV. It's not only chalk full of CA goodness, but one of my fave Cordy episodes of the series. I've seen it 100 times and am not tired of it.

TVT is a good future option too.

I'm re-reading My Senior Year by Dock. It's practically a summer staple for me.

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RWAV tomorrow it is then.


'My Senior Year' is alright but I didn't like how long it took CA to break up with Buffy and Xander especially with there having been no good reason for the prolonging.
I'm not a big fan of CA as an affair because it instills a sense of wrongness in their relationship.

The last one I re-read was 'When Irish Eyes Are Smiling' by Anneb.

starryeyesxx

Some pretty


https://livingfivebyfive.tumblr.com/...e-light-of-day

straws

I love the drama of it all and how much Jealous-Angel we get haha. It also has two of my all time favorite tropes: CA sleeping together/cuddles and tons of domestic CA. Plus it's set in the Sunnydale years. Just a win-win for me haha. I also love Dock's dialogue and she's good at writing hot scenes haha.

Thank you.

This underrated CA moment. Cordy defending Angel's germ intel and running with it lol. Everyone else thought it was a useless fact, but not her.

starryeyesxx

No problem, it's a really nice shot to use

Ashes Fall

That's true, all strong points of the fic.
Cordy being there for him when he's having a nightmare about Hell and the smut are things I find particularly favorable.

I might give it a re-read.

Wow. I do not remember that but there is some serious CA subtext there as well as a glimpse of her true intelligence despite the Scoobies' utter dismissal of her idea. The 'fake out' variation parallels with her fake holy water routine in 'Eternity' which had the Scourge of Europe cornered for at least a minute and a half to two solid minutes!

If the freaking Scourge of Europe could be deceived by a bottle of spring water, a box labeled 'Ebola' has merit against a germaphobe. Just ask Howie Mendel. He's so severely germaphobic that he for the most part refrains from touching people.

Something I do remember is that Charisma once joked on Twitter about giving out candy on Halloween as Cordelia holding a box with 'Ebola' written on it. Perhaps she actually did it, it was at least a couple of years ago so I can't remember the exact wording. I hope she did, it's an epic idea. Or at least it was at the time.

straws

Oooh, nice connection there.

And, yeah, it's such a small moment but it feels very ATS S1 CA, which I love.


Haha. That's hilarious. Wonder if she did it as well.

I'm currently re-reading Without You by Helen.

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Which one is that? I don't recognize that title though I know Helen's work.
I'm now re-reading 'The Fall' by Rachelle, a very well done C/Aus. I forgot Cordy was so Faith level badass in this fic!

So you wanna watch 'City Of' next? We've had that one on the table for some time.

starryeyesxx

https://ladysummers.tumblr.com/post/46670149099

eternalfate

Ashes Fall

"Don't stiffen up."
"Yeah, you either."


I love how she's so unapologetically blunt and aware of her power over men.

eternalfate