[Kylebraxtonisthebest]

Btw I'm caught up to the Sept 15 episode now.

I called it a rewrite but Phyllis' realization she had once admitting to Jack about how the Marco trauma made her feel towards him and the fact he listened, understood is what opened her eyes as to why she turned to Billy in the first place. She realized she was in self-destruct mode (like Billy goes into every few years) and punishng herself for not listening to the signs that Marco wasn't Jack. Phyllis has every right in the world to hate Victor's guts something which Jack should have shared in but for some god forsaken reason hasn't and that pushed them apart and made her think she couldn't count on him to understand her feelings.

[eternalfate]

Originally Posted by Kylebraxtonisthebest (View Post) Btw I'm caught up to the Sept 15 episode now. I called it a rewrite but Phyllis' realization she had once admitting to Jack about how the Marco trauma made her feel towards him and the fact he listened, understood is what opened her eyes as to why she turned to Billy in the first place. She realized she was in self-destruct mode (like Billy goes into every few years) and punishng herself for not listening to the signs that Marco wasn't Jack. Phyllis has every right in the world to hate Victor's guts something which Jack should have shared in but for some god forsaken reason hasn't and that pushed them apart and made her think she couldn't count on him to understand her feelings.

Finally happy you did. The only episode I'm not caught up on is the September 16th episode... which I might wait to watch on Tuesday or something.

I actually like the whole way you view it. And I agree with you, it makes sense.
With Jack it was difficult with him because he looked exactly like Marco and he really never has her back, he always points out how she should feel and telling her to back off where as with Billy, he acted the way Phyllis probably which Jack acted. He listened, understood her hatred towards Victor and was encouraging her to keep it going.
I said that months ago on the Billy/Phyllis thread that I feel the main reason they were drawn to each other was because of the non judgement. Billy always get it from Victoria, and Phyllis always gets it from Jack and the fact that for the first time in a long time, they were around another person who didn't judge them.

I love that a fan tweeted it.

I feel even in real life, if you are continually getting judged for all of your past mistakes, and get no support, eventually anyone will get tired of it... I'll recommend not turning to your loves family members but I'm just saying.

[Kylebraxtonisthebest]

It's actually interesting seeing the Hevon affair being brought up (even though I dont like or care about Neil after the crap he's pulled) amidst the Philly affair being outed

[eternalfate]

Well it's smart for the affair to be brought up because it was sort of the same thing. Being cheated on by a family member.
However, for me, I feel what Devon did was worst than what Phyllis did because he did it to his blind father. So, yeah it doesn't get worst than that.

So, I feel that Neil is sort of the right person to understand what Jack is going through even if people like Hevon and dislike Neil, he was the one wronged and cheated on although Hilary should've never married Neil in the first place.

[Kylebraxtonisthebest]

Originally Posted by eternal◘fate (View Post) Well it's smart for the affair to be brought up because it was sort of the same thing. Being cheated on by a family member. However, for me, I feel what Devon did was worst than what Phyllis did because he did it to his blind father. So, yeah it doesn't get worst than that. So, I feel that Neil is sort of the right person to understand what Jack is going through even if people like Hevon and dislike Neil, he was the one wronged and cheated on although Hilary should've never married Neil in the first place.

I totally agree it's perfect crossover. Similair situations given it being family members as the affair/triangle and Neil is the right person for Jack to turn to and/or learn from of how not to handle things. I liked/like Hevon and thought that storyline was great but I dont see it as Devon being worse than Billy they're both as bad as each other for affairs with their loved ones wives but imo I felt more genuine guilt/remorse from Devon than Billy has shown during each respective affair.

[eternalfate]

For me what Devon did is worst because Devon/Neil relationship was way closer ...

I keep forgetting if you stopped watching Y&R or did you watch straight on for years.

However, I'll tell you the difference, and prepare for a long (most likely bad grammar) pst from the back of my mind.

Billy/Jack - Although Jack was sort of a father figure to Billy at times, their relationship hasn't always been brother-brother, or father-son. Billy is the screw up in everyone's eyes, especially Jack's. And sadly since 2013, it's got damaged even more and more and really never recovered, and it's to the point where Billy doesn't even show compassion to Jack.
Jack literally choose the man (intent or not) who is responsible for his daughter's death over him and protected him.
Billy got fired from Jabot a couple times from Jack, and even at one point sent to another Country I think.

In 2015 (when you were watching) it got to the point when Billy told Jack that John Abott (their father) would be a lot more proud of him than Jack who is nothing but a coward. All of this happened before the affair.

So, when the unexpected affair happened, I feel that Billy feelings for Jack sadly faded. I believe he'd be sad if something bad happened to Jack, but their relationship hasn't be good for years!


Devon/Niel - Close father/son relationship, although at first the relationship with his adoptive mother Dru was closer.
At first Neil wasn't sure about Devon living with them at all and oddly enough Devon was actually attracted to Lily at first. How odd does that seem? lol but yeah he was and Niel just didn't trust Devon too much but over time he grew to love him as his own son. When Devon was going to be homeless, it's when Neil finally made the arrangement to adopt Devon. When Devon couldn't here, Neil was right by his side. So, yes they were pretty close but sadly when Devon was dating Roxy (nice little relationship.) Devon cheated on her with Tyra, the person who was with Neil... and it was a mess. However, they moved passed it.
Hilary/Neil stuff happens all after that.

In conclusion, the Devon/Hilary affair hit me most because I loved Devon/Neil's relationship over the year, whereas the Phyllis/Billy affair still doesn't make me feel that bad for Jack because of how Jack has acted for the past few years. Not saying he was suppose to be cheated on but he really hasn't been there for Billy, or Phyllis that much for me to be that touched.

[Kylebraxtonisthebest]

Put like that then yes Devon's betrayal was worse on a deeper level given the closeness at the time between Devon/Neil. Hevon/Neil's story was written alot better and I prefer Devon over Billy when comparing the storylines.

[eternalfate]

Yeah I understand.
I remember chatting with you during the Phyllis/Billy affair and how the writers were trying to make Jack/Billy close again, and I was like... really? why are the writers tryng to make them close out of convenience to make the viewers feel more sad for Jack when everything comes out.

I think probably one of the huge things is that there aren't much fans like me, as you probably know by now. I have such a long term memory that I really see things from ALL sides, even probably a character I don't like *cough* Chloe right now lol

I think it's sort of like what Eric Braedon said a few months ago during an interview:

"This is where the writers and I have had disagreements. They have their agenda. But I remember Victor’s history. When I see a script where Victor starts to soften with someone who has done him wrong, I say, “Bulls--t! I won’t act this!”

My God almighty, the behavior of Victor’s kids over the years has been outrageous! Remember when they each sued him for $500 million? Imagine that! And he still talks to them. As an actor, you find a way to justify it. As a human being, you look at it rationally and say, “Are you f—king kidding me?” - Source

Although I didn't agree with most of the interview from Eric. It's tough when you have such a long memory of stuff to just let some things slide. I feel SOAP fans only have a 6 months - 1 year memory at times...

[Kylebraxtonisthebest]

Originally Posted by eternal◘fate (View Post) Yeah I understand. I remember chatting with you during the Phyllis/Billy affair and how the writers were trying to make Jack/Billy close again, and I was like... really? why are the writers tryng to make them close out of convenience to make the viewers feel more sad for Jack when everything comes out. I think it's sort of like what Eric Braedon said a few months ago during an interview: [I]"This is where the writers and I have had disagreements. They have their agenda. But I remember Victor’s history. When I see a script where Victor starts to soften with someone who has done him wrong, I say, “Bulls--t! I won’t act this!”Source

They didn't need to bother trying to make Jack/Billy close again to make me feel bad for Jack that he was being betrayed by his wife and brother regardless of a lack of closeness between the brothers.

EB being like that with the writers is why Victor's written like a total ass.

[eternalfate]

I completely agree with you on that. I think that brings enough sadness. lol But I guess, Billy/Jack had to somehow be close again for some people not me .... people with a heart to actually feel more sympathy.

Actually I completely agree with you about EB. I've heard for years that people feel EB has too much control over Victor.

[Kylebraxtonisthebest]

Originally Posted by eternal◘fate (View Post) Actually I completely agree with you about EB. I've heard for years that people feel EB has too much control over Victor.

I'm all for actors having a say in what they portray but not total control like it seems EB has over it.

[eternalfate]

You won't get any disagreements from me about that.
Must have signed one great contract. lol

[Kylebraxtonisthebest]

True must be a great contract.
I'd like to see the hissy fit he'd throw if not given a choice in a storyline.

[eternalfate]

I've been loving Young & The Restless this week. The acting has just been terrific. Especially the action of Peter, Gina and Jason Thompson.

All of the scenes in the episodes were great to me. I sort of love how Nick is just going around giving advice to everyone. Sort of like what Neil has been doing as well. lol

That conversation between Billy and Victoria was probably my favorite scene of the episode because it just showed that Billy is just completely in love with Phyllis, and I really think it just shocked Victoria. Victoria really wished or even hoped that it was just a fling but it wasn't. And Victoria was mocking Billy by saying he was an mistake. Because that's what Phyllis called the affair. Of course when Billy heard that, it tore his heart apart. ... and of course all of this is just making Phyllis look so horrible because Billy and Jack are far from repair and Phyllis is the reason why and now she's just hurting both brothers more with each word she says. lol

Now back to the Billy and Victoria scene, when Billy expressed his love for Phyllis. I was shocked and the fact that Billy said he is sure Phyllis is talking out of guilt... sort of how I'm feeling. The way Billy is feeling is the EXACT same way I'm feeling about this. I love that he brought up that Phyllis choose him but Jill got in the middle and ruined everything because that is exactly what happen. They choose each other, but Jill got in the middle and everything got ruined.
So, when Victoria heard about Jill's blackmail, she seemed heartbroken.

Also, when Billy brought up how Victoria want to keep the kids away from him. I'm sorry I don't get that at all. Billy has an affair (not with her) so he can't see his kids? WTF. lol

Also, that Jack and Billy scene at the beginning of the episode was great! because again, Billy said all the words I said about why Phyllis cheated on him.
Oddly enough Victor said the exact same thing...
"Do I have anything to do with Phyllis being in your brother's bed? She didn't just want sex with him. She wanted to find someone who hated me as much as she did."

That quote is so heartwreching true because for some reason, it feels like it's something in Jack that can't hate Victor regardless of what he does. And Billy was everything that Phyllis probably wanted Jack to be but he wasn't.

[Kylebraxtonisthebest]

Originally Posted by eternal◘fate (View Post) I've been loving Young & The Restless this week. The acting has just been terrific. Especially the action of Peter, Gina and Jason Thompson.

They've been killing it since the reveal.