a fine mess

FireQueen

Thanks for the new thread

Here is her tweet. Maybe I'm overreacting....

Not as endgame. As a temporary LI while Iris is believed to be dead. Of course, it all depends on how many episodes they want to spend on this storyline. In the comics Iris gets killed and sent to the future. After mourning her death Barry tries to move on with another woman.
If they want to adapt this storyline they can have Iris trapped for half a season in another timeline or another Earth while introducing a new LI for Barry. I personally don't see them doing this kind of story justice. Given their track record, they'd sideline Iris and put all the focus on Patty 2.0. Remember that for them Iris doesn't exist outside of Barry. And now that she's with Barry, WA can't even get a proper uninterrupted date. I really really hope I won't have to post in the rants thread after the midseason finale...

That's fair and I sometimes do the same I can watch the movie if I have read the book but I rarely read a book if I have already watched the movie

Still, I really don't get it when people watch a TV show that is an adaptation of a comic book story and get all pissed and offended that the writers are following canon. The writers tell the story they want to tell and if said story includes respecting the source material you (not you you, general you) have no right to act like they're making a mistake because you demand to be surprised. You hate canon? You can always stop watching! Don't act all entitled and demand the writers to crap all over canon because you need the story to be unpredictable. Apparently these days writers should burn the comic books and give in to fans' requests. Following canon is wrong! Fan service is the way to go! Even when the people who are asking for things to change are not even the majority!
This is especially true when it comes to shipping. How dare the writers do WA when Caitlin is right there? I don't always like the canon romance. The Harry Potter series is just an example. I hated Harry with Ginny. Still, I watched all the movies expecting Harry to marry Ginny. I accepted it as a subplot of a larger story. It's the same with shows. I'm not sold on Matt and Karen on Daredevil. They're canon and the writers want to tell their story. I'm not begging them to change canon because I'd rather watch Matt with someone else.

bonnie51

TFTNT

Entitled would actually be people who in general, despite the fact that the show really ISN'T following comic canon, thinks that because they like something, whatever they like is important enough to demand that its kept in the show, but the other stuff... meh. that's ok not to be comic, but if I like something than how dare the show change. Only change the things i don't like or care for or matter to me cause that's not entitled at all.

never mind that according to the comic canon which must be protected at all costs
- even though incredibly brief, linda was never barry's li but rather wally's
- no particle acclerator was ever shown in the original comics
- harrison wells did not exist in the comics
- thawne's eyes never glowed
- zoom was wally's rival not barry's
- hunter zolomon was not a speedster
- none of the rogues had super powers
- the flash was not traditionally friends with the green arrow
-the speed force never interacted the way it did in season 2
-barry and joe is really his relationship with barry is captain frye's - which was from new 52.
- joe west didn't even exist in the traditional comics - Iris had a father but nothing to the extent that jesse has excelled at playing
- cisco "vibe" is not a scientist and more a street wise character
- caitlin is a an enemy of fire storm and certainly not married to him
- ronnie raymond was the prototype of a dumb jock in the comics
-star labs is more related to superman
- lisa snart was an olympic level figure skater who didn't use a gun
-captain frye took barry in in the comics because he was having an affair with barry's mom
-eddie thawne also is not in the comics
-the weather wizard does not actually have powers

i could go on for quite a while.

so don't give me they are following comic canon. the show can do what it wants and it will and people can ship whatever they want and they will. and people who don't like aspect of the show can keep watching and voicing their opinion about it and they can / will.
and all of that is fine and right and good. but then its hardly pandering or crapping on canon when the show does what it should do - and view the comics more as source material and consider itself an adaptation of it in order to try to create a compelling tv show to move things in whatever direction they determine is in the best interest of the show. if the show wants to keep something or not, i don't care because i don't have any power to do anything about it other than occasionally typing on a keyboard. but the idea of canon makes me laugh at this point. canon has very rarely been part of this show. rather, like any good show or movie imo its been bits and pieces of comic stories, tropes used by countless other television shows and movies and perhaps a creative idea all rolled into one.

FireQueen

False equivalence. I don't have to demand anything. The writers are already doing what I like. I'm not asking the writers to keep my ship on the show. The writers are keeping my ship on the show.

And it's one thing to expect the writers to respect the characters and do justice to the story they've chosen to tell. It's another thing to expect the writers to abandon the story they want to tell to give in to your requests and tell the story you want.

I'm not And please, tell me where I said that the show was wrong in changing those things you listed out of respect for comic canon.

Apparently it can't. The show must drop WA and do SB...

They can. That doesn't mean I have to stay silent when they act so entitled that they go up to the the writers and ask for a character's death and for their ship to happen. And they feel offended that the writers are not killing off said character and have no intention of pursuing said ship that they come up with absurd conspiracy theories.

The show can. The simple truth is that the show is not.

So you can and at me as much as you want but we're not describing the same situation. And if you're not one of those people that feels offended and robbed just because the writers are not doing what you want then what I said doesn't apply to you.

Summer Falls

Hey all sorry been out of the loop for awhile but what are we discussing?

bonnie51

I am not and perhaps wrongly so - but given my basically sole non WA person here I felt like some shots were being taken at me in your original post and responded...

if that was not the case then that is my mistake.

I am not offended by what they are doing - never have been and never will be. Disappointed? Perhaps. Wish they could write it better? Certainly. Offended? No. because its a tv show about fictional characters.

I have a tendency to take comments and innuendo's personally - no kidding - but not a tv show. if tv shows bothered me that much because they didn't do what i wished most of all i doubt i would watch a single television show and would never read or book, etc. i have no problem arguing - however uneffectively - about points or this or that, clearly - but offended by a tv show?


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that is horrible regarding the fans though sadly, not totally surprising. too many people are entitled, too many people operate with no sense of decency or filter and it seems a lot of people are just... hateful. in some of the oldest ways to new ones thru the advent of social media, etc. its awful enough to ask the writers to kill off a character but its abhorrent some of the stuff acters and actresses get from "fans" of other characters and a show or movie. somewhere along the line the fact they are people too gets forgotten by too many people or just ignored.

its one thing to talk on a fan thread or have disappointments, etc... but having some kind of belief that you have the right or need to message the actor or actress or the writer, etc.... that's just, well, not unbelievable sadly but too much...

and sadly, i imagine we probably don't know the 1/2 of it regarding how many times they get messages like that. i know they're probably aware it comes with the territory but that does not make a darn bit of difference.

FireQueen

I can't say if you're the only non-WA shipper in here. I clarified that I was speaking in general...

If you don't feel like what I said applies to you then there's no reason to take it personal.

I wasn't 100% clear when I said that the show is following comic canon. I meant that the show is following comic canon in certain areas, including the main romance. So you're right, not everything is straight out of the comics. My point is that just because the show changed A it doesn't mean that it must change B too or that you can expect it to change B too.
This is not an original story so if person X demands to be surprised then maybe it's better if X stays away from this show. X can't watch TF and be all "Why are they doing WA? Why does Flash run fast? Why is Wally here?", etc. X can't be all pissed and expect the writers to completely forget the comics when X knows that these are comic book characters. The writers can change things. It's just not true that the writers must change things or are expected to change things just because some viewers think it's too predictable or because Arrow did xyz.
I didn't have a huge problem with the changes they've done. My biggest issue is with this team formula and that's because it limits ALL the characters.

Back to spoilers...



No idea who the girl is...

Jesse is back...



(x)

lafcia

Seems whatever the ep they're filming now ( I think its 314 ) it's the one where almost everybody is put on alert and on their superhero mode....Joe is there too, kinda shook ( there are pics of him in a scene with TF, KF and JQ.) People say it's where Iris is getting kidnapped.

Also, I dont know what I post these but while making caps for a gif I stopped at these caps. I haven't caught that in the promo but this is the bit where Barry rushes to save Iris.

You can sorta see whoever the attacker is ( 2nd cap)...doesn't look like Savitar...

bonnie51

while not thrilled... it makes sense. given how really only speedsters can see savitar thus far...barry teaming with wally and jessie is how they stopped savitar's plans originally was a group of speedsters... it makes some sense.

that being said, not thrilled about her coming back. there are so many characters already on the show who are in desperate need of their character getting some more development and ST instead. less is more, sometimes show. less is more.

----


I think it is Savitar? The color of the metallic eyes and face kind of look like him,


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Summer Falls

See i agree i personally dont like how man speedster we have now its to many i prefer to focus on Barry learning to use his powers more its way to much

bonnie51

yeah, there are a lot of speedsters but its not even just about speedsters but just don't need all of the characters - regardless of powers.

even if jessie didn't have powers... i'd rather see any # of the regular cast get more screen time other than maybe grant or wells, solely because they are already pretty well on screen and used in most episodes.

a fine mess

Too many characters can distract from the series regulars. That's what happened with Arrow...

bonnie51

and i think that is starting to or at least running the risk of happening here.

look, every year you need to introduce new characters to a point in order to open new story lines, etc... but there is a fine line to me. and i think we are getting closer towards that point here.

they already struggle writing for everyone and creating an even and balanced show in terms of set locations, multiple characters with coherent character arcs etc...

adding more people to the table isn't going to make that any better

Summer Falls

I agree 100% it loses its edge i prefer not having new characters and stick to the ones we know or just have 1 new character not 2 or 3

FireQueen