Downton Abbey S5E3 Episode Discussion
 

Series 5 Episode 3
Sunday, October 5, 2014, 9:00-10:00 PM British Summer Time


Description
When it comes to the opposite sex, Lady Mary is a little ahead of her time. A foreign diplomat died in her bed during the first series, and following the death of her husband, she's been involved in a love triangle. Now she's getting up to mischief with Lord Gillingham. It's supposed to be a secret, but her cover story is almost blown - until Violet saves the day. It seems that the battleaxe may have more reason than most to sympathise with her granddaughter's position when a face from her past reappears, hinting at a hidden past of her own. Meanwhile, Carson is dismissive of Mrs Patmore's latest problem, Branson receives a proposition about the estate's future and the circumstances of nasty valet Green's demise are scrutinised - again.
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1. Please try not to insult any characters, ships or actors. Stay positive and respect your fellow posters.

2. Keep any criticisms of the episode constructive, please. Not everyone will be happy about everything in the episode, but try to keep things constructive. "This plot is ridiculous!" is not considered to be constructive criticism.

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4. Reminder: All storylines are a spoiler until the show airs so while the OP has storyline information, you can react but not discuss it until then even under spoiler tags. ;)

Thank you and enjoy the episode!


Countdown to 5x03

 

I hope by the end of this episode, a single plot thread would have merged. I really dislike the 'scattered' storylines. A single plot should emerge that ties everything and everyone together.

I've been hearing some things about this ep (elsewhere) and even though I'm unspoiled, I'm looking forward to this ep a lot. :)

Well, I don't know about anyone else, but I'm pretty happy.

Mary confirmed what I've thought all along -- as much as Tony is a nice guy, they have nothing in common and all their getaway did was convince her that she doesn't want to be married to him.

I'll have to watch again, but it also seemed to me like she alluded to Charles during her conversation with Tom -- she said something like, "Tony's not --" and then she stopped herself. I can't remember the phrasing, but it sure did sound like she was about to say another name....


Other thoughts:

* Still feel bad for Edith, but I think Drewe did the right thing putting his foot down and telling her she has to stay away for awhile. As much as he wants to help Edith, his loyalty should be to his wife, who is clearly freaking out. Though that does raise the question, why not just just tell her the truth? Why allow her to believe that Edith is either scarily obsessed with this random child or just using Marigold to seduce Drewe?

* I thought that one Russian aristocrat was a little over the top, even given the circumstances.

* The Bates story is still holding my attention -- I don't believe for a minute that Bates killed Green, but I'd like to know exactly what he's hiding.

* I missed most of the scene where Baxter finally explained the story behind the robbery, but I did hear Cora tell her that she will be allowed to stay. Please let that story be over now. (Though I did like Molesley's cool-headed advice to Baxter.)

* Poor Thomas. :(

* Carson had a lot of good reactions tonight.

* JF certainly isn't scared of making Robert look totally unsympathetic. I cringed at what he told Cora. But at least all of the "Robert doesn't appreciate Cora" moments did lead somewhere. Hopefully that story thread will continue to be explored in the next few episodes.

Thanks for the thread.

I don't know what to say about that episode, lots of things happened, but it seemed really boring until the last 15 minutes!?

Robert seems to be trying to excel himself in how big an idiot he can be, poor Cora, very dismissive of her.

Bates and Anna, I know a lot of people like them but I just find myself zoning out when they're on, I have trouble getting any enthusiasm up about them.

Interesting story with Mrs Patmore and the war memorial, there was big thing not so long ago about whether those shot for dissertion should be included on them, so it feels like a storyline ahead of its time really.

Loved Isobel and Violet in the car together in the last scene after the Russian visit.

Also adored Tom and Mary's little chat together in the library, some of us thought he had her number last week judging by the look on his face when she announced her "sketching" trip. They have a great confidant relationship, they don't judge each other and can talk about things they wouldn't trust with the rest of the family. Mary really wants Tom to stay doesn't she? I think he's torn as to what to do at the moment. Plus Tom is on the trail of Edith I think, he's the only one who is really noticing. Poor Edith, she is being tortured.

Sarah Bunting demonstrated her usual tactfulness, whatever your viewpoint on autocratic aristocracy, there is a time and place! Poor Tom is always left trying to get her out of awkward situations, that's all his storyline has been this series so far, it's getting a bit repetitive now.

Will anyone rid us of this teacher?

She essentially told him she loves him. I really loved that part. Oh, and I don't mean loves him, loves him. I mean as a brother and friend. You are right, puffball, she said she hadn't/couldn't/wouldn't (I cannot remember exactly) discussed this with anyone else.

I'll volunteer. Holy mackerel, she is just socially stupid or her name should be Blunting, or whatever. I like that she has Tom considering his options, but other than that, please make her gone.

I found it VERY slow. Yes, a lot of things happened but they should have been more exciting than they came across. The Tony/Mary "scandal" wasn't a scandal at all. Violet contained it right away and there was no threat of the secret getting out. Yawn.

God, do i hate the Bates Murder Mystery. All these scenes of people sitting at tables asking expositional questions...so static and tedious. It's S3 Poison Pie all over again.

I like Baxter but did we need yet ANOTHER scene of her explaining her story to Cora? It felt so repetitive even though she added her final element. I still didn't care. I knew Cora wouldn't fire her.

Why did Tom suddenly tell Mary that maybe he's interested in Sarah? They have not even had a conversation. I guess he just needs assurance that they will accept whom he chooses no matter what....because otherwise they're not really accepting him and his views. And if that were the case, he couldn't stay there any more.

I did like Cora/Bricker and God was Robert being an ass. Nice to see them fighting again and I mean that.

I understand Drewe's position but I did think she overreacted when she came home and found Edith and the baby were not in the house. She trusted Edith to babysit....now she automatically fears she has KIDNAPPED the kid?! Come on, her first thought should have been they were in the yard (as they were) or out for a walk.

I get why he has to tell her to stay away for a while but Margie was being really paranoid there.

Oh, so Cora's father WAS Jewish. I always suspected it but they never said so. Levinson is a Jewish name. And speaking of Jewish stuff.....of course Tom is the only one who notices Edith is distracted. He's such a mensch.

I did like the Tom/Mary conversation, the Cora/Robert fight and the Russians. But the first 45 minutes were slow. Oh, and the Patmore story is OK.

This was my least favorite so far. Hope it picks up next week.

That's sort of how I viewed it as well, he's trying them out although I think he already knows the answer.

But you're right it did drag.

It's impossible to put a positive spin on this episode for someone like me hoping for a Mary and Tony pairing. Mary had her week of fun between the sheets with him and now she's ready to kick him to the curb. She doesn't really even seem to be undecided about it. What's ironic is the speculation was Tony would be the one to break Mary's heart but it appears it's going to be the other way around. Mary's the cad not Tony. I guess my hope can be once she lets him go she'll realize she's made a mistake. To me though she seems pretty sure Tony is out of her system. It looks to be wide open now as to who Mary ends up with. Maybe the story moves on to another triangle, Mary/Charles/Mabel. Oh Mary why do you have to be such a heart breaker?

I did enjoy the Mary/Violet scenes very much. They were fun.

Oh my gosh with Anna taking Mary's "thing" home to hide it for her. The writing is on the wall that will cause misunderstanding/trouble for Anna And Bates.

Not much else stood out to me. Perhaps I was in shock from what was happening in the Mary/Tony story. :lol:

Aw Lauren. I know we don't interact but I do read your posts and I thought of you while watching this. It panned out the way some in the 'Charles' thread thought it would. I agree Mary is not being fair here so I don't mind someone like Charles taking her off her high horse every now and then.
It's quite caddish of her for handling the whole Tony thing so 'cavalier' although he sort of asked for it by being constantly around. I hope he reacts with real fire when she finally reveals her 'cold feet' to him. I would be disappointed if he takes it mildly.

Thanks Sunshinebright. I appreciate your understanding. I hope Mary doesn't string Tony along for too long. She needs to tell him so he can try to move on. If she knows he's not the one she needs to let him go.

It's pretty obvious (since series 4 (JF wasn't exactly subtle about it - e.g. the clashing, the pig adventure, him picking up George...so forced)) it's going to be Charles Blake she's going to end up with. Fellowes is just so predictable and unoriginal. Although, I have to say up until last year's Xmas Special (and especially that lame deus ex-machina in making him a wealthy heir..so convenient :rolleyes:) I hoped she'd end up with Evelyn Napier so I understand your disappointment. I'm indifferent to the Charles Blake character (neither like/dislike him), think he's one-dimensional whose sole purpose is to be Mary's love interest/next (potential) husband and don't like M/C together because there are just too many similarities with M/M imho. But I've accepted a long time ago that that's the direction it's headed in. And I understand why EN isn't the right guy for her. He's too much of a gentleman, so not really Mary's type.

Charles is clearly in the role of "Matthew", Tony in the role of "Pamuk"(in the sense that it was just lust, a physical attraction) and poor Mabel is probably in the role of "Lavinia" ( I don't think she'll die but she'll be rejected in favor of the glorious Mary (I always liked her but JF's always writing like she's this perfect creature, a "prize" that all men want is starting to get on my nerves) and she might end up with Tom, who knows).

I liked this episode. Nothing major happened, but it set the ground nicely for episode 4.

As expected, Mary isn't too sure about marrying Tony anymore and I'm curious about what will happen next. I guess Tony won't be happy when she tells him she isn't going to accept his proposal. And she has already rejected Charles, who seems a proud guy and might have moved on in the meantime.

The Patmore / Carson / Hughes storyline was good, as was the final scene between Violet and the Prince.

I also liked Cora, a character I never really cared for. Robert behaved like an idiot with her, as he usually does.

Thomas's storyline has potential. The conclusion of Baxter's OTOH was a bit anticlimatic, maybe it should have ended in episode 2.

Green's murder - IDK, I like whodunnits, so I'm not against a "who killed Green" storyline in itself, but so far it's too similar to what happened with Vera's death... why must it always been about Bates? And next week, we'll have "Anna Bates investigates - part 2", because this was really the best storyline of season 3, right?
Also the details of the story don't make a lot of sense - now Bates went to York first, and then to London, and then to York again, before returning to Downton? in one day? also in season 4 Carson had seen there was something wrong between Hughes and Green, and now he accepts her explanation without asking anything? Not sure I buy it.

I cant say I was enthralled last night, the ending had an interesting premise though, between Violet and the Prince, I thought that was very nicely played.

I wouldn't blame Cora if she left Robert for Richard E. Grant, he was so patronising towards her, obviously it won't happen, but I did feel sorry for Cora, sometimes she's just too dam good for that man.

The rest was pretty routine, Edith's becoming too obvious by hanging around the Drewe's farm, I wasn't surprised by how that turned out, and I agree about the Bates Murder Mystery, it's just going over old ground again, a sign of running out of ideas it seems like.

Just when I thought we were going to get a whole episode without Bunting, there she is being her usual tactful self, as someone's said, all Tom is mostly required to is apologise for her, if she turns up in the next episode, please can Carson or someone boot her out of Downton.....for good.

Mary and Tony I didn't care about anyway, so one big yawn, that pretty much summed up the episode.

Yup, pretty much. For me anyway. I liked the last fifteen minutes: Cora and Robert fighting (God I want her to dump his sorry ass), Rose with the Russians, Tom and Mary talking. The rest? Meh to the Nth degree.