Fan Forum
Remember Me?
Register

  New Forum Poll   |     Request a Forum   |     View New Forums

 
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-07-2017, 11:28 AM
  #1
Master Fan

 
ollibear's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 18,894
#506 "Four Ages in Life" ~ Episode Discussion

Episode Title:

Four Ages in Life

Air Date:

Tuesday, March 7, 2017

Synopsis:

Daphne takes a volunteer job at a clinic for extra credit and comes face-to-face with her old mentor, Dr. Jackson. While eager to mend fences with him, she grows alarmed when it becomes obvious he’s having trouble properly treating his patients.

Mingo leads the annual “Kangaroo Krawl,” but Daphne sees his foolhardy behavior as a reaction to the regretful costume party incident.

Bay finds Noelle is plagiarizing her work and uses the discovery to negotiate her own chair. John and Kathryn make an effort to rekindle their romance. Regina is put in a precarious situation when she decides to expand her business.

Director: Janice Cooke

Writers: Terrence Coli & Lenn K. Rosenfeld
__________________
Avatar by Brienna

Last edited by ollibear; 03-07-2017 at 11:35 AM
ollibear is offline  
Old 03-07-2017, 07:39 PM
  #2
Master Fan

 
ollibear's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 18,894
A couple of days ago, a fan tweeted that she believed John would be caught watching porn by Kathryn, and that would inspire the two of them to spice up their sex life. She guessed it. That's exactly what happened.

I've seen many fans predicting that the end of this episode would introduce the recipient of Angelo's heart, and it certainly looks like that will be the case. I predicted it, too, over a year ago, when they were filming this episode.

Is it that the minimal hints on social media are giving the storyline away? Or are the writers that predictable?

I'm not connecting with this episode.

Is it because the show has been cancelled, and I have detached? Or have the writers killed my interest in their characters? I don't know which it is.

Emmett was always my favorite character, and tonight, I don't even care that he isn't in the episode.

I don't care about Bay's tattoo job. It doesn't matter to me whether she is successful or not. I used to really care about her. It's weird we have not seen her interact with Travis in this episode.

I didn't even enjoy the scene with Bay and Toby at the beginning of this episode. Their scenes used to seem so powerful. Tonight, their scene together felt fake and forced.

I don't care about John & Kathryn's sex life. I don't care about Daphne and Dr. J. at the clinic. Daphne and Mingo felt flat.

I do like Luka, but I don't care about seeing Regina with him.

Even Bay, Daphne, and Toby's scene just now seemed lackluster.

And Kathryn telling off John didn't do anything for me.

I used to love this show. What has happened to my feelings about it?
__________________
Avatar by Brienna
ollibear is offline  
Old 03-08-2017, 12:59 AM
  #3
Part-Time Fan
 
Ruby Rose Scarlett's Avatar
 
Joined: Oct 2014
Posts: 155
This is an extremely confusing season so far. It doesn't feel like the last season of a show at all. There's no main plot that I can tell and nobody seems to be in any rush to bring the main characters to a happy place. This episode was very hard to watch as I kept wondering where the writers wanted to go with it. It was very underwhelming.
__________________
Emma

Harry Potter ~ The Lord of the Rings ~ Costume Dramas ~ Disney ~
Ruby Rose Scarlett is offline  
Old 03-08-2017, 08:29 AM
  #4
Dedicated Fan
 
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 865
The only thing about this episode that interested me was the last few minutes where we saw the recipient of Angelo's heart.

It doesn't feel like a last season to me either. Did the writers know this would be the last season when they wrote these episodes?
charming_essa is offline  
Old 03-08-2017, 10:14 AM
  #5
Part-Time Fan
 
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 254
Because nothing seems to be wrapping up, I'm beginning to think that there are going to be multiple cliffhangers when the final scenes are shown.
John S is offline  
Old 03-08-2017, 10:32 AM
  #6
Master Fan

 
ollibear's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 18,894
Quote:
Originally Posted by charming_essa (View Post)
The only thing about this episode that interested me was the last few minutes where we saw the recipient of Angelo's heart.

It doesn't feel like a last season to me either. Did the writers know this would be the last season when they wrote these episodes?
That's an important point.

The writers had no idea that they were not receiving the full 20 episodes this season. They only learned that news in the middle of filming the 100th episode, which will air on March 21st (since the show is preempted next week).

By the time the writers learned the news, they had already written the first nine episodes for the season. They may have gone back and tinkered with the scripts for episodes eight and nine, but I doubt they did too much. It's really only the last one, where they knew it was the end.

I felt Daphne and Mingo's story was done well in this episode. We started with Iris, Daphne, and Mingo, and there was continuity, because the protest was mentioned. I understood Mingo's point of view, and it was (somewhat) nice to see Daphne give him a pep talk, as he has done for her in the past. (Although I'm weary of everything "switching" so perfectly on this show. It's weird how everyone gets a turn, all of the time.)

Bay's story is what felt out of place to me. We absolutely should have seen a scene where she speaks of the fallout between her and Travis over the Emmett tattoo fiasco.

I'm also dismayed we have not touched upon Emmett's depression. It's obvious that there won't be any depth there this season. Everything is surface.

Overall, I'm disappointed this season.
__________________
Avatar by Brienna
ollibear is offline  
Old 03-08-2017, 12:53 PM
  #7
Dedicated Fan
 
Joined: Oct 2016
Posts: 865
Quote:
Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post)
That's an important point.

The writers had no idea that they were not receiving the full 20 episodes this season. They only learned that news in the middle of filming the 100th episode, which will air on March 21st (since the show is preempted next week).

By the time the writers learned the news, they had already written the first nine episodes for the season. They may have gone back and tinkered with the scripts for episodes eight and nine, but I doubt they did too much. It's really only the last one, where they knew it was the end.
Well that explains some things then, if they thought they had a lot more episodes than they actually got. Usually the best final seasons are the ones that are planned in advance. Unfortunately most shows don't know far enough in advance that they are being canceled to do anything about it. Once the episodes are written and filmed, they probably don't have the budget to go back and make a bunch of changes.
charming_essa is offline  
Old 03-08-2017, 02:26 PM
  #8
New Fan
 
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 70
I apologize if I'm going to be repeating what others have already said, but I just watched the episode and wanted to get my thoughts down before I read anything else.

I'm so frustrated by this episode!

My feeling throughout was: why does Daphne always get to be the saint, and Bay always gets dumped on? Here is what happened to Daphne in this episode: Daphne got an opportunity to work at a campus clinic to help her in her med-school quest; Daphne got to have her past transgressions excused by Dr. Jackson, because she had lost her father; Daphne got to be a hero and spot a problem with Dr. Jackson's health, and to offer him a solution, which, by the way, was possible because she had a great relationship with her professor and had previously been involved in yet another heroic quest for racial equality; she got to save Mingo from hurting himself; and she got to meet the person whom Angelo's heart had saved.

Here's what happened to Bay in this episode: she got told by her boss that it's fine for her work to be stolen because she's the intern; she got a chair at the tattoo parlor, but only on exorbitant terms; her parents came at an inopportune time and scared off her first client; Noelle views her as a rich girl who lied about her background, even though what Bay said was true; her next client turned out to be a minor trying to get a gang tattoo; Bay got in trouble with Noelle and the client's father and had to return the money she had been paid; she was able to get out of that scrape, and kind of built some rapport with Noelle, but it was dubious because the price of that was telling Noelle it was okay to steal Bay's work.

What the heck? Why do the writers hate Bay so much? Have they forgotten that Bay actually ISN'T a criminal, and Daphne actually IS?

Also, isn't this the 4th time Regina has mixed business with pleasure?
- Angelo invested in her business
- Wes was her boss and then became her boyfriend (sort of)
- Eric was also her business partner and boyfriend
- and now Luca (although in the end, she called off the business partner part)
teaholic is offline  
Old 03-08-2017, 09:29 PM
  #9
Fan Forum Star

 
~AnastasiaGrey~'s Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 240,109
This seasons seems to be all over the place
__________________
This is me, All of me and I want you in anyway I can. That I love you.
Christian ♥ Anastasia Edward ♥Bella
~AnastasiaGrey~ is offline  
Old 03-09-2017, 12:15 PM
  #10
New Fan
 
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 70
I was thinking about the title. It seems like the writers were going for some kind of theme about aging/age... I didn't find it very powerful or very interesting, but I guess it was there.

- John and Kathryn were dealing with how aging related to their sex life
- Dr. J. was dealing with aging and his career
- Regina and Luka were confronted with the disparity in their ages (and Luka's father forced Regina to face this again)
- Toby was entering a new phase of life as a stay-at-home dad, and talking about how that affected his career (which I thought was very sad, by the way, because it feels to me like his career had barely had a chance to begin, and now he basically jams with his baby son for his own pleasure).

Did anybody see any other aging-related plot points? I think Bay, Daphne, and Noelle were relatively untouched by it, although I guess the client who was underage but wanted the gang tattoo could be related to it.
teaholic is offline  
Old 03-10-2017, 03:35 AM
  #11
Master Fan

 
ollibear's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 18,894
Quote:
Originally Posted by charming_essa (View Post)
Well that explains some things then, if they thought they had a lot more episodes than they actually got. Usually the best final seasons are the ones that are planned in advance. Unfortunately most shows don't know far enough in advance that they are being canceled to do anything about it. Once the episodes are written and filmed, they probably don't have the budget to go back and make a bunch of changes.
Yeah, the writers did not learn that the show was cancelled until the middle of filming the next episode (the 100th episode) of the series. At that time, they were beginning to write the final episode (103). I wonder if they went back and made changes to the scripts for 101 and 102, or if they left them as written.

I agree that the best final seasons are the ones that are planned in advance.

On March 8th, Lizzy Weiss tweeted:
1/3 Re: the Noelle/Bay shipping...We actually had a fun story planned about Noelle's girlfriend not getting along w Bay.
1 reply 8 retweets 23 likes

2/3 Also a story about Mingo's girlfriend Amy visiting. And we wanted @KekePalmer to play her, cuz we love her, and she's a fan.
0 replies 6 retweets 23 likes

3/3 But we got canceled. Which means you guys will have to write those stories yourselves! And I hope you do.
9 replies 7 retweets 27 likes
With the second half of a Season 5 (and perhaps, even, a Season 6), I feel that the writers would have built a bigger story for Daphne and Mingo, one that would have given them somewhat of an epic, written-in-the-stars feeling, like the writers have done for Bay & Emmett. But with the series being cancelled half way through Season 5, I wonder if Daphne and Mingo will end up together. It could go either way.

I still believe that the writers will pair Daphne with Travis's competition on the baseball field, Chris, for the remainder of this season (at least, up until the final episode). And I find it interesting to know that with more episodes, the writers would have introduced an African American girlfriend for Mingo.

Keke Palmer is beautiful. I could see her character making Daphne feel insecure. Daphne needs to feel some insecurity. So much goes her way.

I also find it fascinating that Mingo is dealing with many students on his college campus (including Iris) believing that he is a racist, while he knows that his high school sweetheart, first (and current) love, is an African American woman. Perhaps Amy's arrival at UMKC would have opened Iris's eyes that there is more to Mingo than what she has been willing to see. Perhaps Daphne would have been able to end the series with both her boyfriend Mingo AND her friends' acceptance of him.

As a side note, in Season 4, I still remember Travis so harshly condemning Daphne for dating a "prom king" like Mingo, who was only going to break her heart. I always wonder if the writers plan these things, because I firmly believe that Bay (who was a "prom queen") is going to break Travis's heart before the end of the series.

So often in life, people condemn others for doing what they themselves do. It must be human nature to do that. If Bay does eventually break Travis's heart, then I will revel in the irony of that earlier line from Travis. I find so many moments like that in Switched at Birth, and it is one of my favorite things about the series' writing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teaholic (View Post)
I apologize if I'm going to be repeating what others have already said, but I just watched the episode and wanted to get my thoughts down before I read anything else.

I'm so frustrated by this episode!

My feeling throughout was: why does Daphne always get to be the saint, and Bay always gets dumped on? Here is what happened to Daphne in this episode: Daphne got an opportunity to work at a campus clinic to help her in her med-school quest; Daphne got to have her past transgressions excused by Dr. Jackson, because she had lost her father; Daphne got to be a hero and spot a problem with Dr. Jackson's health, and to offer him a solution, which, by the way, was possible because she had a great relationship with her professor and had previously been involved in yet another heroic quest for racial equality; she got to save Mingo from hurting himself; and she got to meet the person whom Angelo's heart had saved.

Here's what happened to Bay in this episode: she got told by her boss that it's fine for her work to be stolen because she's the intern; she got a chair at the tattoo parlor, but only on exorbitant terms; her parents came at an inopportune time and scared off her first client; Noelle views her as a rich girl who lied about her background, even though what Bay said was true; her next client turned out to be a minor trying to get a gang tattoo; Bay got in trouble with Noelle and the client's father and had to return the money she had been paid; she was able to get out of that scrape, and kind of built some rapport with Noelle, but it was dubious because the price of that was telling Noelle it was okay to steal Bay's work.

What the heck? Why do the writers hate Bay so much? Have they forgotten that Bay actually ISN'T a criminal, and Daphne actually IS?
Wow, seeing it all written out like that makes it unbelievable. You are right. I had not even picked up on how absurd it is, until I saw your two lists.

Unfortunately, I have just come to expect that Bay will always struggle for breadcrumbs, and Daphne will do nothing and have riches heaped upon her.

Maybe it is supposed to represent fate's way of righting the imbalance caused by the switch? Bay grew up in a two-parent, affluent home environment, whereas Daphne grew up in a single parent, impoverished home environment.

But I always felt as though both girls received the shaft in the switch, because Bay did not have an opportunity to grow up with parents with whom she shared commonalities. For Bay to grow up with an artist mom like Regina, it would have been more valuable than the Kennish's money. (Not that Kathryn and John did not provide their own value to Bay's life, because they did. It is just that nothing can replace what Bay lost not growing up with Regina as her mom.)

To me, both girls were cheated by the switch, but I have always felt that Bay felt the brunt of what she lost more than Daphne. Money is nice to have, but sacrificing it is not as monumental as sacrificing a feeling of belonging. That is what Bay lost, in the switch. Daphne never lost that, and she is not losing anything now. Perhaps Daphne is simply a golden child. If so, Bay might be the writer's scapegoat. Otherwise, I am at a loss to explain how their story has unfolded.

Golden child and scapegoat - daughters of narcissistic mothers

Quote:
Originally Posted by teaholic (View Post)
Also, isn't this the 4th time Regina has mixed business with pleasure?
- Angelo invested in her business
- Wes was her boss and then became her boyfriend (sort of)
- Eric was also her business partner and boyfriend
- and now Luca (although in the end, she called off the business partner part)
Yes. I think the writers are trying to show growth in their characters here at the end, so Regina is finally standing on her own two feet, and Bay is finally telling an ex-boyfriend that they cannot be friends, and Kathryn is finally being assertive with John, etc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by teaholic (View Post)
I was thinking about the title. It seems like the writers were going for some kind of theme about aging/age... I didn't find it very powerful or very interesting, but I guess it was there.

- John and Kathryn were dealing with how aging related to their sex life
- Dr. J. was dealing with aging and his career
- Regina and Luka were confronted with the disparity in their ages (and Luka's father forced Regina to face this again)
- Toby was entering a new phase of life as a stay-at-home dad, and talking about how that affected his career (which I thought was very sad, by the way, because it feels to me like his career had barely had a chance to begin, and now he basically jams with his baby son for his own pleasure).

Did anybody see any other aging-related plot points? I think Bay, Daphne, and Noelle were relatively untouched by it, although I guess the client who was underage but wanted the gang tattoo could be related to it.
Based on the title, I had really looked forward to this episode. I had imagined all sorts of stories about these characters we love, at different stages of their lives.

I prefer a story to build over a series of episodes, though, and John and Kathryn's sex life seemed to be abruptly plopped into the middle of this episode and resolved just as quickly. I like the Dr. J. and Daphne story a little better, although it was also abruptly plopped into the middle of this episode and resolved immediately. That's not storytelling, in my book.

As for Toby, I, too, find his story sad. That requires more analysis than I have time to do before work, but if anyone is interested, I could write more this weekend on that topic. If you look at his character from the pilot until now, his story is tragic, to me.

I saw Bay's story as dealing with aging/age. She is an apprentice, and sometimes, a lot of crap comes with that, when you are young. I could write more about that, too. For all of the stories in this episode, I am most interested in Bay's, but I find it absurd that she had no contact or mention of Travis or Emmett, at all.

Life isn't either family OR love interests. Life is family AND love interests. Bay's story should be that way, too.
__________________
Avatar by Brienna
ollibear is offline  
Old 03-10-2017, 04:39 PM
  #12
Fan Forum Star

 
~AnastasiaGrey~'s Avatar
 
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 240,109
How did you guys enjoy the episode?
__________________
This is me, All of me and I want you in anyway I can. That I love you.
Christian ♥ Anastasia Edward ♥Bella
~AnastasiaGrey~ is offline  
Old 03-11-2017, 04:44 AM
  #13
Master Fan

 
ollibear's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 18,894
Quote:
Originally Posted by ~AnastasiaGrey~ (View Post)
How did you guys enjoy the episode?
I was not impressed.

I do think the Daphne and Mingo story was done well. Everything else was a waste of my time.
__________________
Avatar by Brienna
ollibear is offline  
Old 03-11-2017, 08:02 PM
  #14
New Fan
 
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 70
Quote:
Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post)
Unfortunately, I have just come to expect that Bay will always struggle for breadcrumbs, and Daphne will do nothing and have riches heaped upon her.

Maybe it is supposed to represent fate's way of righting the imbalance caused by the switch? Bay grew up in a two-parent, affluent home environment, whereas Daphne grew up in a single parent, impoverished home environment.

But I always felt as though both girls received the shaft in the switch, because Bay did not have an opportunity to grow up with parents with whom she shared commonalities. For Bay to grow up with an artist mom like Regina, it would have been more valuable than the Kennish's money. (Not that Kathryn and John did not provide their own value to Bay's life, because they did. It is just that nothing can replace what Bay lost not growing up with Regina as her mom.)

To me, both girls were cheated by the switch, but I have always felt that Bay felt the brunt of what she lost more than Daphne. Money is nice to have, but sacrificing it is not as monumental as sacrificing a feeling of belonging. That is what Bay lost, in the switch. Daphne never lost that, and she is not losing anything now. Perhaps Daphne is simply a golden child. If so, Bay might be the writer's scapegoat. Otherwise, I am at a loss to explain how their story has unfolded.

Golden child and scapegoat - daughters of narcissistic mothers
That's quite interesting to think about. I agree with your view that both girls were cheated by the switch. I saw it as both of them missing something major before the switch was revealed: Bay, as you say, missed that sense of belonging, and Daphne missed having a father in her life (if we assume that Angelo would have stayed, had he not suspected Regina of cheating on him).

After the switch was revealed, I agree that Bay ended up more the loser: Daphne gained a father, a brother, and a new mom, plus she gained access to a lot of resources; whereas everything Bay gained was more indirect. You couldn't say she gained a new mom or a grandmother, considering how standoffish both Regina and Adriana were with her. She did gain a new dad with Angelo, but he was nowhere near as present or involved as the Kennishes were with Daphne. (And Daphne gained him too, she just didn't appreciate him very much.) Where Bay gained the most is in a new understanding of her roots, where she came from, and in getting exposure to a whole new culture (Deaf culture), eventually finding friends, love, a new school, etc. in that.

I would be very interested to read more about the golden child/scapegoat idea. It certainly seems a fitting description for the initial fallout of the switch being revealed: everybody doted on Daphne and wanted to be near her, and Bay was the "problem child." She definitely feels guilt over having grown up rich, too - and it certainly gets thrown in her face enough (most recently by Noelle).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post)
Yes. I think the writers are trying to show growth in their characters here at the end, so Regina is finally standing on her own two feet, and Bay is finally telling an ex-boyfriend that they cannot be friends, and Kathryn is finally being assertive with John, etc.

Based on the title, I had really looked forward to this episode. I had imagined all sorts of stories about these characters we love, at different stages of their lives.

I prefer a story to build over a series of episodes, though, and John and Kathryn's sex life seemed to be abruptly plopped into the middle of this episode and resolved just as quickly. I like the Dr. J. and Daphne story a little better, although it was also abruptly plopped into the middle of this episode and resolved immediately. That's not storytelling, in my book.
That's a good point - they do seem to be tying up some character themes. However, it feels like too little, too late to me - I mean, we've had 5 years with these characters, and only now for the first time does Bay figure out how to set boundaries with an ex-boyfriend? Only now does Regina try to stand on her own two feet? It feels stale rather than consistent to have these characters constantly running into exactly the same scenarios over and over.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post)
As for Toby, I, too, find his story sad. That requires more analysis than I have time to do before work, but if anyone is interested, I could write more this weekend on that topic. If you look at his character from the pilot until now, his story is tragic, to me.
Yes, please!!! I haven't thought very much about Toby's story, and I would welcome the chance to take a deeper look at it!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post)
I saw Bay's story as dealing with aging/age. She is an apprentice, and sometimes, a lot of crap comes with that, when you are young. I could write more about that, too. For all of the stories in this episode, I am most interested in Bay's, but I find it absurd that she had no contact or mention of Travis or Emmett, at all.

Life isn't either family OR love interests. Life is family AND love interests. Bay's story should be that way, too.
I agree. It felt odd to me. At that age, a boyfriend/love interest is so important (or at any age, really, but especially when one is young) that you want to be in touch often and share what you're going through. I expected to see either Travis or Emmett, or at least to have Bay texting them or something.
teaholic is offline  
Old 03-14-2017, 11:06 PM
  #15
Fan Forum Star

 
Barstool Prophet's Avatar
 
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 134,501
What is this show doing?

Regina barely bonds with her own daughter, Daphne commits two crimes and doesn't pay consequences for it, Angelo finds out he has a baby and the chick gives it up for adoption, then he has custody for five minutes and changes his mind, then he dies,: A baby with Down's syndrome, Drug addiction,

This season: Daphne is the champion of African American rights? Regina only cares about boning random unsuitable guys. Travis is a main's romantic interest? flailing school and job performance, people stealing intellectual property, John can't get it up and asks Regina's random boytoy about it? :lol ...... Dude see a doctor..

Why writers why?

Sometimes I think someone should take this show into the desert and put two between it's eyes.
__________________
"The purpose of life is a life with a purpose. So I’d rather die for a cause, than live a life that is worthless.”
-- Immortal Technique
.
Emily
Barstool Prophet is offline  
 

Bookmarks


Thread Tools



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:20 PM.

Fan Forum  |  Contact Us  |  Fan Forum on Twitter  |  Fan Forum on Facebook  |  Archive  |  Top

Powered by vBulletin, Copyright © 2000-2021.

Copyright © 1998-2021, Fan Forum.


TEST