“THE SIEGE AT FORLI” (2x07) Episode Discussion May 20
 

Hmm, it was an interesting episode, but I found it a bit boring for me.

Here we've learned that Juan got married and his wife's expecting his kid. Also, he's sick and he's about to attack Catherina Sforza. He fails of course.

I liked Cesare and Machiavelli action here. Have to say that I have curious to see how and when Machiavelli is gonna join Cesare's forces. Here we can see that friendship's building.

I don't think I have a favorite moment in this episode though. However, I've watched the promo and I have to say that I'm curious for the next episode.

Really? I enjoyed it. Juan brought his sister a panther. Loved how she was totally intrigued by it, until it bit her. And then her giving the panther to her potential suitor. :lol: I was almost surprise with her having the baby in front of everyone. Did they ever "explain" the baby?

No, I don't think they explained the baby and I'm really flabbergasted at them parading it around so openly. (Not that this ever happened anyway.)

I would have prefered a leopard tbh.

And I haven't watched the episode yet. Perhaps tomorrow.

It was a good episode...perhaps not as amazing as the others. But i quite enjoyed it.
Machiavelli's lines were good and I liked his interaction with those annoying kids.
Juan, omg I felt so sorry for that kid and I am a Borgia fan not a Sforza one. So it was like come on Juan.....there are other ways. I take it they are giving Juan syphillis then and not Cesare?
Michelletto was hilarious when he was staring down Savanarola.....he just says everything with his eyes and face. No need for words!
I wonder who they think the baby belongs too....also out of curiosity when Lucrezia gets married what happens to the kid?

Caterina Sforza was good, did not appreciate seeing her pubes....but it had a powerful message and she was definiately a strong woman.

The pope smoking the turd....hahaha priceless!

The episode was good but some parts were very boring.

I loved seeing Juan again and seeing Juan being Juan :lol: The last scene was really good with Juan running to the woods like a coward.
I was disappointed we didn't get to see his wife with him. I hope she shows up soon.

I love Lucrezia's interaction with her parents but this new "love" storyline is boring and predictable. The actor who plays the blond guy is good and they have some chemistry but the storyline itself it's really boring.

I'm glad the Florence's scenes were short because nothing really happened. Still Michelletto and Machiavelli had some interesting moments.

Caterina Sforza's famous line about being able to make more kids was included. I didn't feel bad for her at all. I know she's a strong woman but I can't watch someone treat her kid like he isn't worth anything. Of course she would never surrender to Juan but at least she could have attacked them.

I agree. If that was my child I would give my own life to save my child.

I was always under the impression that she didn't think much of most of her children. Now this was a "fake" one anyway if it's the one from 2x05.

I enjoyed this ep, even if it was a bit slower than the others. It's obviously mostly a filler ep.

Loved Juan being back! The fabulous troll that he is, giving the Pope 'turds' :lol: And did anyone get the feeling he wasn't particularly disappointed that the panther bit Lucrezia? His face almost made it seem like he'd wanted that to happen.

I almost felt sorry for the fact he's so ill...buuuut mostly not. I felt a nice sense of justice when he had to get that horrible treatment :lol: And how he acted at Forli was just...oh dear. He's really not cut out to lead anything, let alone an army!

I thought the Florence scenes were good if only for Machiavelli. I seriously adore him and I don't really know why. I just find him funny. I loved the little touch of him saving a book from the pile of 'vanities' to be burnt and sticking it under his robe.

"I have no vanities, I have only my intellect which I am reluctant to relinquish. And as you can see, with these looks, I have no vanities." And then giving those kids a stuffed owl :lol:

Lucrezia was still being a HBIC but her/random younger brother of her suitor is just..meh. Loved seeing her stand up against Rodrigo though. And Vanozza was lovely, as always :love:

Caterina Sforza is such a strong woman, I can't bring myself to dislike her, even if she was willing to let her son die.

Things seem to be in motion for an interesting finale!

Sorry I didn't leave my review last night, but the :ff: server was "busy" and suggested that I "come back later." :irked: :hammer_head:

I agree with Ellie and Arinna. No Cesare/Lucrezia action here, but this was pretty much a Juan episode. Poor Juan. :no: This just isn't his year. :lol: First he gets a butt-whupping from the French king, and now Caterina Sforza owns him. :P And on top of that, he apparently brought something more than just cigarros back from Spain. Syphilis! :puke: Can I just say, YEEEEEOOOOOOWWWWTCH!!! :jaw_drop:
And I thought what poor alfonso of naples had to endure was painful! :thud: That thing the doctor stuck up his urethra had to hurt! :eek:I guess Juan hasn't been faithful to his new bride, and has been spending some time with some ladies who must have caught the disease from the returning conquistadors who brought it back from North America. Sorry about that, Europe. :shrug:
I also think that Juan had been smoking too many cigars and taking too much mercury, given his lousy battlefield performance. A man suffering from syphillis, with burning urination and mercury in his veins can't be physically or psychologically fit for command. If Roderigo had known this I doubt he would have sent Juan to Forli, at least not alone. He was cleary losing it when he tortured Caterina's son and cut his finger off. and he was sent running home like a coward. :( He has the worst luck.

I loved Roderigo's comment about "turds." :lol: So we have Spain to thank for the tobacco industry. :P Looks like Roderigo is taking up the habit. And yes, Ellie, I think the panther biting Lucrezia was in Juans' mind a little payback for the chandelier incident. But she ended up learning how to properly feed the kitty. :cat: Lucrezia will also soon be getting her groove on with Calvino's brother Raffaello, and I'm wondering where all this is going besides another romp in the sack for Lucrezia since none of this is in the history. Poor Raffaello, every guy Lucrezia shags usually ends up dead. :lol: I think Lucrezia is getting fed up with being whored out, and perhaps this is why she becomes the woman history remembers her as.

The Florence scenes were just disturbing, and Savonarola is the most frightening man of the cloth I've ever seen. :eek: But I loved how Micheletto kept appearing in front of him and creeeping him out, even having an ash crucifix put on his forehead. :lol: it's almost like he's hinting that his time will be up very soon. Micheletto is the only one with a stare even creepier than Savonarola's.:evil_lol:

I agree, Arinna. :nod: Cesare and Machiavelli are proving to be great allies. I liked Machiavelli's respnse to the little brats at his door calling for a bonfire of the vanities. he gives them a stuffed owl. :lol: I laughed at that too, Ellie.

And can I just say that Caterina Sforza is a bad-ass? :eek: She's got more guts than Juan, and was willing to "expose" herself just to make that point about having more children who would take revenge on him. you could tell at that moment that Juan was outclassed. it shouldn't take long for Roderigo to realize who should have been leading the Papal armies all along. :D

Oh, and in closing, may I just say that Caterina Sforza could also benefit from an invention from the new world:

Brazilian wax.............just saying. :gone:

Actually they already did that in Ancient Egypt with a paste of sugar.

True. Both women and men waxed in Ancient Egypt.

Fascinating! :lol:

I finally watched the episode.

I'm ready for Tabatha to take over, she would fix the hair problem, teach NJ how to not make me cringe and show Juan how to run a successful military campaign in under a week.

The panther biting Lucrezia as Juan's revenge for the chandelier incident - possible. But I also thought back to how she talked to Djem about tigers and how fascinated she was, so Juan might have actually thought that would make a good present.

Oh it's Davros/Machiavelli again. Is it just me who is always disappointed when he comes on screen and there is no Dalek with him?

The Holy Person? Are we politically correct to make up for the smoking? And did I hear that right Juan says he's devoted to his wife? Judging by his face and gestures, it looks like he has haemorrhoids or kidney stones rather than syphilis. The treatment is looking painful but clever... albeit useless. Funny sidenote, taking arsenic (or "La Cantarella") would have helped a lot more with the syphilis.

Holliday is really over-acting in this episode. Yes, we get that Lucrezia is still pissed at Juan and her father. Can we move on now?

It's only been 15min and 15sec into the episode so far but it kind of does feel like an eternity (in hell), perhaps Savonarola has prophetic powers after all.

Oh, Micheletto has got himself a banjo from the refuse. Well, his career as a musican was over quickly.

Isn't it a bit unfair to Juan to give him all the **** that Cesare actually had to deal with in real life? First the syphilis, now Forlì/Caterina Sforza. (And the timeline screw up makes me cringe.) "Seal the gates!" when the enemy is literally standing in front of it? I'm just saying.

Jeremy Irons' face at the panther - he is clearly mimicking Cary Grant when he lost his mind in Bringing Up Baby. "I've got my sanity, I've lost my leopard!"

Oh Vanozza is pretty.

I understand that sieges are supposed to be tiring...

"Go to *the* store on the Piazza de Navonna"? I'm confused, there is only one? And yes, it is the perfect place (very pretty set with the rivulet, the ruins and the ivy, kudos to the stage designer!) but I'm not feeling it.

Oh look - yet another pop culture reference: "The owls are not what they seem!" You know Machiavelli trying to be clever here with that obvious metaphor "owls = wisdom" is totally lost on those creepy little boys. And that was kind of petty of Cesare not to warn Juan. I don't approve. As for Juan - blimey, now he totally lost it - he reminds me of Rumpelstiltskin (not the OuaT version but the original). David Oakes portrays that very well though.

I understand that we are supposed to feel something along the lines of "wow impressive acting and the genius who thought of it" when Micheletto stares at Savonarola and vice versa, but frankly, it is too obvious.

I really wanted to like Caterina Sforza making that little speech and flashing her vag but like with Lucrezia this week, I think it was over-acted.

Della Rovere needs a better storyline.

The best thing about the episode: the sight of Ludovico on his horse - priceless! The worst thing: it's a tie between Cesare's whinging/sulking and Raffaele Pallavicini's hair.

Oh and there was no Guila this episode!