[MarvelousToons]

Originally Posted by PhoenixRising (View Post) Ouch! Painful threesome. I do agree that Marvel made mistakes with Jean, and perhaps that's one reason why Claremont decided she should die in the Dark Phoenix Saga. But perhaps that's also why the creators of X-Factor decided to bring her back, to do her right and atone for how badly they treated her. For a time, they succeeded, but then freaking Grant Morrison came along...

I feel the fumbling up with Jean Grey came from lack of a consensus between writers, which lead to Jean becoming an insane level Mary Sue, and the Phoenix Force becoming a joke in latter comics *COUGH* AvX *COUGH*. There also wasn't a perfectly clear interpretation of what the Phoenix needed to be. Jean's resurrection became a convoluted mess and, its the reason for my narrative, I've abandoned the majority of Jean and Phoenix's development, to create my own thing, and in all honestly, more USE Phoenix/Dark Phoenix saga to introduce a more suitable "Phoenix" superhero.

My thing with Morrison, I didn't mind some of the ideas he came up with and explorations, like the Phoenix Egg and exploring WHR and the Crown, but he didn't solidify these ideas into anything that other writers could build on. Also, the whole White Phoenix thing bothers me, because it's the primary cause of Jean Grey's out of control toxic fandom. I'm so sick of how this has been used by Jean's rabid fans to make her out to be some god over creation, or some 5hit.

I also found Grant's work confusing when it felt he was trying to explore Jean as Phoenix, and just ugh... Like I said, I'm winded with Jean. I hope what I bring to her as a character can inspire much better ideas and concepts in the future. Stop making her a Mary Sue center of the universe, most powerful of us all type 5hit; she needs flaws, hiccups, and things to make her human. Also, do better to show she can stand on her own without some cosmic force super boosting her.

[sum1]

Grant Morrison sure screwed up the X-Men beyond repair, but Jean was never a good character.

[PhoenixRising]

Well, I did like what they did with Jean in the 80s in X-Factor, when she was found in that cocoon off the coast of Long Island and it was revealed that she was never Dark Phoenix at all, it was a doppelganger. I felt like they gave Jean a second chance and did right by her, but then when the started the new X-Men comic in the 1990s with guys like Jim Lee and Rob Liefeld guiding the direction of X-Men, it seemed like they were going in a weird direction that was reflective of the "extreme" culture of the 90s, and Grant Morrison just took that ball and ran with it in the 2000s. But Morrison was also taking influence from Bryan Singer's interpretation in the 2000 movie, and I felt that the original trilogy had too much influence over the outcome and direction of the comics in the 2000s. They did some really stupid stuff. If they'd just stuck with where Jean was in the 1980s and stayed consistent with that, none of this crap would've been necessary. They didn't need to bring back this Phoenix crap all the time.

[MarvelousToons]

Originally Posted by PhoenixRising (View Post) Well, I did like what they did with Jean in the 80s in X-Factor, when she was found in that cocoon off the coast of Long Island and it was revealed that she was never Dark Phoenix at all, it was a doppelganger. I felt like they gave Jean a second chance and did right by her, but then when the started the new X-Men comic in the 1990s with guys like Jim Lee and Rob Liefeld guiding the direction of X-Men, it seemed like they were going in a weird direction that was reflective of the "extreme" culture of the 90s, and Grant Morrison just took that ball and ran with it in the 2000s. But Morrison was also taking influence from Bryan Singer's interpretation in the 2000 movie, and I felt that the original trilogy had too much influence over the outcome and direction of the comics in the 2000s. They did some really stupid stuff. If they'd just stuck with where Jean was in the 1980s and stayed consistent with that, none of this crap would've been necessary. They didn't need to bring back this Phoenix crap all the time.

I agree. They should have never brought the Phoenix back to her story. Like I said some time before, I love the idea of a hero called Phoenix and their powers associated with the mythical bird. But to me, Jean Grey was the wrong character for that mantle.

After her revival, they NEEDED to shelve the Phoenix, wait a good while, build up a new character to become the next permanent Phoenix. and again, it needed to be an antihero to well suit the internal conflict of good and evil, on an epic level. Jean is simply NOT the character that can do that.

[sum1]

Originally Posted by PhoenixRising (View Post) Well, I did like what they did with Jean in the 80s in X-Factor, when she was found in that cocoon off the coast of Long Island and it was revealed that she was never Dark Phoenix at all, it was a doppelganger. I felt like they gave Jean a second chance and did right by her, but then when the started the new X-Men comic in the 1990s with guys like Jim Lee and Rob Liefeld guiding the direction of X-Men, it seemed like they were going in a weird direction that was reflective of the "extreme" culture of the 90s, and Grant Morrison just took that ball and ran with it in the 2000s. But Morrison was also taking influence from Bryan Singer's interpretation in the 2000 movie, and I felt that the original trilogy had too much influence over the outcome and direction of the comics in the 2000s. They did some really stupid stuff. If they'd just stuck with where Jean was in the 1980s and stayed consistent with that, none of this crap would've been necessary. They didn't need to bring back this Phoenix crap all the time.

They did zero weird stuff with Jean in the 1990s. It was just like the '80s. Don't blame the mistakes this century on the '90s.

[MarvelousToons]

*make Jean tongue bathe Blob from head to toe*

[sum1]

:tells Jean that Rachel is better:

[PhoenixRising]

You should tell her that Madelyne is better. That would burn her.

[MarvelousToons]

Originally Posted by PhoenixRising (View Post) You should tell her that Madelyne is better. That would burn her.

Even better...

*forces Jean to eat Madelyne's "cream pie"*

[PhoenixRising]

[MarvelousToons]

Originally Posted by PhoenixRising (View Post)

LOL I can do worse...

*now forces Jean to eat fem!Gambit's "cream pie", after Dark Beast and Colossus filled him/her up*

LOL okay that's the LAST Boston cream I'll do... for now...

[sum1]

I don't know what "cream pie" is supposed to mean and I don't want to know.

[PhoenixRising]

Originally Posted by sum1 (View Post) I don't know what "cream pie" is supposed to mean and I don't want to know.

[MarvelousToons]

Originally Posted by sum1 (View Post) I don't know what "cream pie" is supposed to mean and I don't want to know.

Hmm... time for some sex ed...

Using the example below, fem!Gambit got his/her "cherry popped" and filled with Dark Beast's "cream". Then I gave Colossus a ton of viagra so he can also beat Gambit's "cherry" and fill it up with his "cream". the overflow is called a "cream pie". To relieve the overflow of "cream" and kinda soothe Gambit's throbbing and very sore "cherry", I forced Jean to come in and "eat the cherry" out, by sucking and swallowing all the "cream" that was inside.

Now you know what a "cream pie" is

[sum1]

Can we get off this subject?