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#196 | |||||||
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,198
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Sometimes I miss the simplest of routes (which could be a testament to a recent suggestion that I might be on the autism spectrum) but this is the best illustration there is of the individual nature of soullessness that for whatever reason that neither of us can remember (lol) I was attempting to argue. Spike didn't require a soul to have the capacity to care whether an action was right or wrong and feel remorse whereas Angelus did as soulless he enjoyed hurting people which Buffy was no exception to not just despite his soul's love for her but because of it. We see a specific example of the Angelus side of this in 'Eternity' when he, drug involvement aside, berates Cordy's performance in 'A Doll's House'. It was ONLY with a soul or in this case, the soul's dominance that he cared that his opinion would be hurtful and as such had a sense of discretion (despite that ultimately, Cordy preferred Angelus's complete honesty). For clarification, I'm NOT equating the specific situations, feelings towards someone's theatrical performance to essentially attempted rape but that both are instances of different soulless regards of someone. Quote:
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Fred spent five years in a demonic dimension and we don't see Cordy, who pre-Fred was the only woman on the team have a social life with other women since Harmony in 'Disharmony' which was uncomfortable and awkward for her with all the vamp/lesbian advances so AtS was in serious need of some girl bonding. __________________
"Monsters are real and ghosts are real too. They live inside us and sometimes they win" - Stephen King Last edited by Ashes Fall; 11-23-2019 at 02:41 PM |
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#197 | |||
Absolute Fan
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 6,831
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All in all, I've enjoyed this discussion. You brought up a lot of interesting points and got me thinking. We have our differences of opinion, but there's still overlap and areas where we agree. Good talk. Quote:
This is 100% fanon now and my own delusions, but I like to imagine Angelus already had a thing for her there. He could've snapped her neck ASAP or tortured her in really violent ways (and he probably would've if he'd had more time, but imma ignore that) but instead he just insulted her acting. What he said was harsh and he knew it would hurt her feelings, but come on, this was Angelus, he could've been so much more savage if he'd wanted to. He'd been trapped with the soul again and upon being freed all he did was insult Cordy's acting and do a imitation of her? (I find the imitation inappropriately funny. DB delivered it so well. ) I also like to head canon Angelus would want to turn, not just kill, her. This is probably from reading too much fic but #sorry not sorry, as the kids say. __________________
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#198 | ||||||||
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,198
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Sometimes retaliation is a strong temptation with some of the comments one might come across. Quote:
You make my 6 years kind of embarrassing. Quote:
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That moment made a great statement that a Slayer's supernatural enhancements don't make her the only woman in the world with the capability and strength to take on the monsters. An average adolescent woman, NOT a Slayer, armed with nothing but knowledge managed to deceive 'The Scourge of Europe', one of the vilest and deadliest vampires on earth with a bottle of spring water! Quote:
Think about it, he was aiming his focus at the time on those close to Buffy but at that moment chose to target Cordelia who hardly qualified under that category. This suggests that he had some form of unique interest in her. Quote:
He used pretty much the same format with Buffy, a verbal warm-up before he went into the real action; the drawings, the flowers, the dead fish, Jenny Calendar and the display with her body, etc. He just didn't have enough time, in this case, to get far. The question is, was he aware of that? I honestly, don't remember. I'm no expert but based on some basic research I did some time ago, I believe the drug essentially acted as a PCP so it's plausible that he might not have been. I read a fanfic that AU-ed that scene so that Wesley doesn't regain consciousness until the next morning and when he does he finds himself in the company of two vampires after Angelus spends the night raping Cordy. It's very good, I liked it, however, it's significantly flawed in that it doesn't properly understand the drug effect because Angelus is treated as pure/soulless in that Angel doesn't return. I'm so sorry, I hate telling you about fics that I can't provide. I could swear the site it was posted to was on the first page of the Google results for CA fanfiction but now it's nowhere to be found. The only one I found was Angel's Bliss by Gemjj but it's not nearly as good. Quote:
I find it quite plausible that Angelus would be attracted to Cordy's sharp tongue and 'take what she wants' attitude and her becoming a seer would have just been an enhancement (since we know he's into seers). __________________
"Monsters are real and ghosts are real too. They live inside us and sometimes they win" - Stephen King Last edited by Ashes Fall; 11-24-2019 at 02:43 AM |
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#199 | ||||
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 6,831
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Rebecca: “I just wanted you to relax a little, Angel. Oh, lower the defenses a little.” Angel grabs her: “What was it?!” Rebecca: “Just a little happy pill. (Angel drops his face on her shoulder, panting) Oh god. I’m so sorry.” I always assumed he knew he had a limited amount of time - which is why I thought it strange that's how he chose to spend it. You would've thought he'd go looking for more pills or cause as much chaos as possible. There's also the chance that he wasn't 100% Angelus...just more of an Angelus Lite (the soul was still in there). But I guess it's possible he didn't know. Or was so arrogant he assumed they'd never stop him and he had plenty of time still. Since we were just talking about this moment: https://starryeyesxx.tumblr.com/post/188089603193 Quote:
My fave vamp Cordy fic is Promise of the Night by Lysa. Quote:
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#200 | |||||
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,198
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We have some supporting dialogue for this: Angel [To Rebecca]: “Tell you what, I’ll torture you for a few unbelievably long hours and then you can tell me if this is the lifestyle for you. That doesn't sound as though he considered how much time he had. Then Wesley attempts to directly point out to him the nature of his condition but it might as well have fallen on deaf ears: Wesley: “Angel, I want you to listen to me. What you’re experiencing is not genuine. You’ve been fed a drug. It’s simulating bliss. All that you’re feeling is just a chemical suggestion. (Angel slowly strolls into the dark office) Angel?” Angel still in vamp-face: “Name’s Angelus.” Perhaps, there is a slight chance, however, that he did consider that if, in fact, he was on borrowed time the most efficient way to use it would be to leave the soul the ruins of his team as a welcome back gift. Though as plans aren't his forte, that idea was still lacking in that department. Still, it kind of succeeded. Cordelia was pissed off at Angel for not being honest with her about her acting enough to leave him in chains. Quote:
A woman who can face down 'The Scourge of Europe' with spring water couldn't possibly have stage fright? Quote:
Ah now Promise of the Night was a masterpiece. Her vamp!Cordy was sublime as was how it's so unsettling but has you rooting for her the entire time. Quote:
Rebecca: “Whatever you are going to do – do it. I’m not running anymore.” Hits him across the face with the candlestick as hard as she can. Angel: “Now that I respect.” As much as he enjoys the screaming, the begging, the squirming, he seems to appreciate strong women who face him down. On another topic, something has come to mind. In that GIF set of the Cordy/Angelus springwater trick, I noticed drug-induced Angelus seems to be wearing a dark green shirt. I can recall him wearing maroon at one point, I'm pretty sure sometime in 'To Shanshu' and blue at another (with the duster of course but still). Do we see him wearing that much color in BtvS? I know it's a common fanfic trope for Cordy to at least comment on his black and gray wardrobe being dreary so I'm wondering, did she convince him to buy more colors? __________________
"Monsters are real and ghosts are real too. They live inside us and sometimes they win" - Stephen King |
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#202 | |||
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,198
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As am I. As far as I'm concerned she's a CA fic legend.
In fact, just read me one of her works. A little Cordy pwning Angelus anyone? A Night to Remember __________________
"Monsters are real and ghosts are real too. They live inside us and sometimes they win" - Stephen King |
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#203 | |||
New Fan
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 31
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I know it is not the subject here but here in France on Netflix we have Grimm (another serie produced by David Greenwalt) and i must admit that I can't help mysef to see and make a parallele between Nick/Adalind and Angel/Cordy.
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#204 | |||
Extreme Fan
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,198
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I used to watch Grimm but it lost me before Nick/Adalind. It got too gimmicky.
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"Monsters are real and ghosts are real too. They live inside us and sometimes they win" - Stephen King Last edited by Ashes Fall; 11-28-2019 at 10:52 AM |
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#205 | |||
Absolute Fan
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 6,831
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Just popping in to say that I have final assignments due and final exams coming up, so I won't be able to post much here for the next 2 weeks, but I miss this thread and talking about C/A.
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#206 | |||
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,198
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I've already been missing you.
Best of luck with finals. I've got to focus on my Christmas shopping so I might be a bit scarce myself for a bit. __________________
"Monsters are real and ghosts are real too. They live inside us and sometimes they win" - Stephen King |
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#207 | |||
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In the meantime, some more pretty
otp meme: Angel/Cordelia - faceless https://sodemonizemealready.tumblr.c...delia-faceless __________________
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#208 | |||
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 6,831
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Thanks for that awesome giftset, starryeyesxx. Something about faceless gifsets are so cool and offer a different kind of intimate look. __________________
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#209 | |||
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Joined: May 2012
Posts: 2,198
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"Monsters are real and ghosts are real too. They live inside us and sometimes they win" - Stephen King |
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#210 | |||
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Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 6,831
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