Star Wars - Constructive Criticism of the Prequels. - Page 4

AlexEvans · 12-25-2003, 05:19 PM

The Gungans aren't my favorite aliens. [img]smilies/frown.gif[/img]

The original trilogy showed some interesting aliens... some species that just looked really cool. Why not something like that?

[img]smilies/abduct.gif[/img] [img]smilies/read.gif[/img]

**Cryostar** · 01-13-2004, 07:34 AM

Unfortunately rumors are persisting that GL is going to be taking out some of those Original Trilogy aliens during the DVD making process and adding in aliens from the prequels, such as the gungans....

TheCheshireKitten · 01-17-2004, 07:07 AM

UGH.

My chances of purchasing the DVDs will lower greatly if he makes those kinds of changes.

**Cryostar** · 01-17-2004, 11:47 AM

If you'd like to venture over to the DVD discussion threads, i have a list of the rumored changes that may be happening. If not, I'm sure that TheForce.net will have something up shortly, they almost always do. [img]smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

Sick Boy · 01-20-2004, 10:55 AM

Gungans Suck!

Ahh GL thinks he can do anything now, amm fat head he has.

**Cryostar** · 01-21-2004, 07:06 PM

Not all the gungans suck...the soldiers were kinda cool.

It was just Jar jar pretty much.

TheCheshireKitten · 01-24-2004, 11:37 AM

I thought the Gungan race was actually pretty cool. I just hated the overdone humor they put into the movie with Jar Jar.

[ 01-24-2004: Message edited TheCheshireKitten ]

**Cryostar** · 01-24-2004, 09:42 PM

I completely agree...they're not as cool as say Gollum...but pretty good for late 20th century CG. [img]smilies/tongue.gif[/img]

TheCheshireKitten · 01-26-2004, 01:15 AM

I loved Gollum not so much for the CGI (though he looked GREAT), but because the character was so three demensional. I never thought of him as CGI when he was on screen with Frodo, Sam, etc... he was simply another well developed character.

I thought the Gungans worked as background characters, like many of the aliens in the SW universe, but found Jar Jar to be an unecessary, annoying waste of time. What would have been more to my liking - if Jar Jar had led Obi-wan and Qui-gon to get a transport, but didn't go with them on their journey. Instead, when Amidala wishes to return to Naboo and fight, Obi-wan or Qui-gon could simply remember the Gungans, and realize that the Gungans could help them.

Chandler in a box · 01-26-2004, 08:30 AM

Okay, this is a rip of a post I made over at iMDb, the guys over there liked it so I've copied and edited it for y'all [img]smilies/smile.gif[/img]

On the original trilogy Lucas had more than a little 'help from his friends' in terms of the scripting and the overall story arc, whereas this is not true of the prequels. I firmly believe that had talented collaborators like Kurtz (producer, ANH and ESB), Kershner (director, ESB) and Brackett and Kasdan (screenwriters, ESB and ROTJ) been involved with the prequels they would not be the poor films they tuened out to be.

The Phantom Menace I can deal with. It's light, but it's entertaining and flows fairly well. Liam Neeson is good and on the whole, the film keeps the spirit of entertianment that was there in the original trilogy. It's not a great film, but it's a decent start. Attack of the Clones is where things all fall apart. I'm going to ignore the dialogue (both in TPM and AOTC) because just about everyone finds it terrible. Gone is the wit apparant in ANH and ESB and the foreboding darkness of ROTJ (and there's place in AOTC for both) and instead we have some lame jokes and terrible melodrama. Honestly, the Days of our Lives screenwriting team could have done better.

Now, I by no means think that AOTC has a BAD STORY. It fits nicely with The Empire Strikes Back by separating the heroes of the first film and sending them on their own journeys in the build up to the climax. However, where Empire told such a story in a concise, well concieved story arc, AOTC does not. Therefore, ignoring the dialogue, and accepting that the story itself isn't bad, it's the way narrative is phyisically put together that destoys the film. AOTC is full of redundant scenes, useless scenes and scenes that should have been condensed. For instance, Obi-Wan's role in the story really irritates me because it seems like he has lots of scenes simply to prove to the audience "Yes, he really is an important character". The simple fact is, however, that most of Obi-Wan's scenes could have been condensed, but Lucas apparantly fails to realise that a character does not need lots of screentime to be important to the story. There are something like four cuts to scenes on Kamino when two would have adequately sufficed to tell that part of the story if the scenes were condensed. Had the Kamino section been shortened the flow of the film would have been greatly improved and the dramatic tension better sustained. Likewise, the scene with Yoda and the little kids is completely pointless because everyone in the audience already understands there's foul play afoot and having it spelled out to a Jedi Master by CHILDREN is almost insulting. Obi-Wan's story should flow directly from discovery to discovery, from the library to Kamino to the duel with Jango without farting around in these redundant, time grabbing scenes. AOTC's story gets bogged down because it jumps constantly between scenes that dish out information at a painstakingly slow rate, when they should have been done much faster. It's all comes down to very bad pacing, which at its heart comes from bad scripting on Lucas's part.

It is said that the hardest thing about being a director is having to 'kill your babies'; that is, cut or edit the scenes you love in order to enhance the overall pace and tension of the film. It is apparant from watching Attack of the Clones that Lucas has done no such thing, because there are more scenes like Obi-Wans that should have been condensed to improve the flow of the film. Furthermore, there are scenes in AOTC that shouldn't even be in the film at all, which makes the insult to viwers even stronger. The factory chase on Geonosis is by far the most horrid waste of money I've ever witnessed on film. There's several million dollars of computer generated effects on display, but like the blown out Obi-Wan scenes it simply drags the film out without serving the plot or the momentum of the film at all. Can anyone give me a valid reason for this scene to exist? The film *almost* gets into a good pace with Anakin finding his mother, watching her die, attending her funeral, recieving the message from the council and going after Obi-Wan. Once they land on Geonosis the film should launch RIGHT INTO the Arena sequence because that's where the momentum of the story is heading. In ESB, does Luke run around in a contrived ten-minute action sequence after landing on Bespin? NO! He heads straight for the confrontation with Vader which is where the story's momentum is taking him and at this stage of the film the audience shouldn't have to wait around for answers. So why in AOTC do we have this absolutely ridiculous scene that wastes a good ten minutes and isn't even exciting? Not only does the whole thing look silly, it absolutely DESTROYS the momentum that was almost established in the Tatooine scenes by again bogging the story down with indulgent trash! Lucas has failed in one of the most critical functions of a director, to cull what's not needed ("Kill his babies") with the ultimate priority being the maintenence of a good flow to the story that serves the overall narrative arc.

There are more scenes in AOTC that should have been shortened or completely cut. Star Wars fans frequently retort to this kind of criticism of these films with the oft used "But Lucas is a visual film maker" spiel, as has been heard many times in interviews with Lucas and his friends. I challenge this as absolute rubbish. All film makers are visually centred to one degree or another, and Lucas displays no sense of visual technique or skill in the prequel films, rather he relies to an extreme fault on computer generated graphics to do the hard work for him. There's nothing interesting in terms of film style, no good lighting or atmosphere as, for example, we saw in the Mos Eisley cantina in ANH - these are things look great on film, but can't be faked with computers. The cantina scene mixes the boozy, smokey look of a noir film with interesting 'galaxy far far away' touches like the glowing counter and freaky aliens. These heightened the impact of, but did not overpower the scene or detract from the narrative. Compare the cantina scene with the "Dex" scene in AOTC. This scene displays none of the style or interesting lighting or atmosphere we saw in ANH. There's simply stale and unrealistic use of computer generated effects.

These two elements - the poor pacing of the film and the over use of Computer Graphics hurt the film very badly. I think that AOTC is the worst Star Wasr yet by a long shot, and doesn't fill me with much hope for how the third one will turn out.

[ 01-26-2004: Message edited Chandler in a box ]

**Cryostar** · 01-26-2004, 07:06 PM

You know what bakes the noodle even more regarding Lucas' decision to leave these types of scenes in movies like AOTC? The fact that he chose the "love scene" and the "factory scene" while at the same time, cutting out the entire space battle over geonosis, and cutting the arena fight/attack on the droid control ship in half. In fact, he completely cut out the attack on the droid control ship. What's more, you might ask? cutting the Dooku/Yoda fight to 1/3 it's original length. Truly, for two great masters as those, would a fight be so quick?

LittleMilkJug · 07-10-2004, 07:28 AM

Oh I was just rereading Lucas's biography and about his mania to CONTROL everything. He's got really great ideas but I hope he got ALOT of help for the script of Ep3.

**Cryostar** · 07-12-2004, 04:54 AM

Once can only hope, however we all know that he'd never accept it.

I love your avie. INU YASHA RULES!

sevennationarmy · 07-13-2004, 10:09 PM

The prequels are needed in order to understand the whole story more.. it's like skipping the first half of a book. Meh.

**Cryostar** · 07-14-2004, 04:32 AM

Possibly. Though George has changed the focus of starwars by making it about the rise, fall and redemption of Vader now, instead of the whole galaxy and it's events. So now the story needed finishing, instead of already being finished.