WeBuiltThePyramids

Okay so...

I'm, like, so distressed. That hurt my heart so bad. I feel so bad for both of them, but Toby, he came through that for her, and she didn't WANT to say no, and I'm like so upset with Cabe for basically encouraging Toby to drink because addicts can so easily get addicted to other things and my uncle is an alcoholic and I know what that does to a person and their loved ones and he just got out of gambling for her and now he could plummet into something else like...

FauxDetective

I'm so disappointed. I thought for once a tv show was going to explore a relationship without resorting to ridiculous stunts like this. This relationship has enough dramatic potential in Toby's addiction, Happy's trust issues, etc. that they don't need to introduce a plot like this to keep things interesting. Not to mention, I've already seen this storyline done before on Bones.

The writers spend the whole season showing how Happy was learning to be more open and communicative and then end with this? Toby told Happy he was thinking about marriage weeks ago and Happy knows him well enough to know that he tends to move quickly. For her to not tell him that she's already married just seems kind of cruel to me. The writers are going to have to come up with a really good reason that she didn't feel like she could share this with him, especially after she just got done telling Walter that trust is the basis of any relationship.

WeBuiltThePyramids

The secret marriage trope is as overdone as the love triangle trope, even when it's not used as a direct relationship obstacle. Phoebe had a secret husband on Friends. Mac had one on JAG. Penny had one on TBBT. Beckett had one on Castle. IT IS SO TIRED AND OLD LET IT DIE.

This is my feelings on it, though. I can't be angry at Happy, I don't think. I have questions for Happy, but I'm not angry at her. This post did a good job of explaining how I feel about it.

FoxPhile

Yeah - secret marriage, yadda, yadda ho-hum; over it. There are SO many other things they could have done to put a roadblock in Toby's proposal. I even sort of get why they wanted to do that - Quintis has had SO much good progress, they felt they had to put the brakes on to up the drama. But this is just boring and it sort of insults the fans intelligence. I mean seriously - how many people are "secretly married"?

I am a bit perplexed at all the backlash on Happy. Obviously, there is something about this that is embarrassing or painful, or she would have been upfront about it. I rather doubt that it's Collins, though - because wouldn't Walter know about that? In fact, I rather think it must be something that happened long before Happy met Walter for precisely that reason. Which leads me to something she did as a teenager.

EDIT to add: I'm always a little perplexed when something like this happens on a show and people get very angry with the person and scream "she should have TOLD him!"

Trust in a relationship is not an instant thing, nor is it blanket. Happy and Toby have only been "official" for a few weeks. While their romantic relationship is being built on a working relationship and friendship which should already include a level of trust, Happy may not have gotten to the point yet that she was ready to talk to Toby about what is apparently a difficult issue for her – especially one that was bound to cause tension between them. When Toby told her to think about the possibility of a proposal, she may have realized she needed to advance the timetable on her revelation, but again, it is likely something that she needed time to work out. That’s not something you just drop over your breakfast bagels. I guess my point here is that it’s easy to say she should have told him. Being in a situation where you have something painful you need to discuss with your partner, then gathering the nerve and picking the time and place to do that, is not at all easy. I’m not saying she was right in putting it off – I’m saying it’s understandable and she shouldn’t be vilified for the lapse.

I also agree that Happy is not the only one in the wrong here. Toby was determined to do his thing and he completely ignored all the signals Happy was trying to send to say that she was not ready for this proposal. One of Toby’s great issues is that he does what he wants, when he wants and everyone else needs to go along or get out of the way. He’s demonstrated that with regard to this relationship before. That, too, is not the best trait to bring to a healthy relationship.

They both have a lot to work on. But I’m confident they’ll do that.

FauxDetective

The thing that bothered me is that by the time they got back to the garage, Happy knew that Toby was planning to propose and, whether she was ready or not, she was going to have to deal with the situation. Why would she not have pulled him aside and told him that she needed to speak to him privately about something very serious before he proposed? If she needed a bit of time to sort through her thoughts and feelings before they had that conversation, she could have asked him for that. It would have saved them both a lot of pain and embarrassment.

Edited to add: Toby completely ignoring Happy's signals didn't make much sense to me either. It was almost like they both reverted back to their season 1 ways just to set up the proposal scene. As much as I hate the whole secret marriage thing, I think if the reveal was handled differently, I would have less of a problem with it.

WeBuiltThePyramids

So many characters were off in that scene.

Happy: *doesn't pull Toby aside*
Toby: *ignores her signals and proposes anyway*
Tim: "Hey so that was awkward and people are upset but Paige still wanna go to the thing?"
Paige: "I'm the one on the team best equipped to help with this but I'm only going to stay if Walter wants me to."
Cabe: "Hey Toby I know you have addictive tendencies but just start drinking and hate yourself and I'm just gonna peace out and go home."

LIKE WHAT? WHAT?

FauxDetective

Hilarious and 100% accurate, Nicole.

It will be interesting to see where they take things from here. I have a feeling that any conflict between Toby and Happy won't really be about the marriage itself - I honestly can't imagine Toby being anything but understanding and supportive about that - but about the fact that Happy doesn't yet trust him as much as he thought she did. I was thinking about their conversation on the roof before he got her ring size. He basically said that they weren't like Walter and Paige because they actually talk to each other. Meanwhile, Happy's got this huge secret that she doesn't yet feel comfortable sharing. I think he was under the impression that they had reached the point where they were being completely open with each other but Happy's just not there yet.

FoxPhile

Nicole!

I was most struck by Paige up and leaving and by what Cabe said.

However, while Happy has made huge strides, and Quintis were in a good place - for a relationship that is barely three months old - I think Toby's assumptions about where Happy is and where the relationship is has usually been a bit further forward than reality. Even though he's occasionally touched on the idea that he's been in love with Happy for years whereas she's just getting started with all this, I don't think he generally thinks of that. He's so immersed in his own love for her that he cannot conceive that she doesn't feel exactly the same way. Standard procedure for Toby, the Behaviorist, is to push people to have conversations they don't want to have. Obviously, he should know not to treat the woman he wants to marry the same way, but he just isn't used to stopping what he's saying just because someone says No.

Happy is a bit harder to explain. I can understand that she wasn't ready to tell Toby about the marriage, although it's hard to imagine how you can start a relationship with someone when you're already married without bringing that up PDQ. I have to imagine there are circumstances to this marriage that make it moot in every way except legally, so what is the big secret about? That aside, she had to know once they got Toby free that he was going to ask, probably the first chance he got. The very fact that she didn't want to talk to him proves that. So it seems that she should have made her own opportunity to take him aside - get him out of the garage or up on the roof, whatever it takes - and let him know.

FauxDetective

I really hope that season 3 picks up with Happy and Toby having a conversation about this. I'd prefer that it be something that brings them closer and that they deal with together, rather than something that causes a rift between them.

WeBuiltThePyramids

I'm really wondering how they're gonna weave a CASE into this premiere with the team members all tense and two of them a full day's drive away. I wonder if Happy/Toby/Sly/Cabe and Walter/Paige just communicate by phone all ep as they work on the same case, or if there will be two. Either way I'm glad Happy and Toby are in close proximity so they can talk.

FoxPhile

I've been wondering the same thing. One possibility is that Walter and Paige stumble onto something case-worthy in Tahoe. They work on it together with Tim while consulting with the rest of the team back in LA. Or some of the LA team comes to Tahoe via helicopter. Sly would have to stay to watch Ralph, and it could be a way to dodge much of a Toby/Happy talk - and most of the awkwardness of working together - if one but not both of them go to Tahoe. So we could see whatever the Waige denouement is at the beginning of the ep, and the Quintis at the end, when they all get back from Tahoe.

WeBuiltThePyramids

I want to discuss this at length let's go to limited spoilers so we can.

FoxPhile

Follow me....wheeeee!

FauxDetective

Honestly, I'd be happy with an entire episode of Happy and Toby talking and working this out. Who needs a case?

WeBuiltThePyramids

We need a new thread! Any title suggestions? And who wants to open?