Marauders

Hang on, when did there become two christmas eve stories?

I assumed Fake red was coming home for christmas and thats his story. As for real red, Naomi said he disappeared on a week day and that her daughter wasnt even home from school, so musnt have been christmas eve.. he died in the fire so that wasnt xmas eve? Or am i getting way too confused now.


Ive also been reading alot of theories elsewhere, and even though I dont agree with it, what is everyones opinion on Red being Kat? Sorry if it has already been discussed or there is another discussion elsewhere. If there is then please direct me to that thread!

The more I read the redarina theories the more it unfortunately does make sense. There is alot of proof to prove (but also alot to disprove) this theory. I am not a fan of it, but its interesting to see different peoples theories, Even if in my opinion it is quite ludicrous!

Fangirl49

Marauders, we discuss anything and everything over and over! I've seen those theories too about Red being Kat. And yeah there are things about them that make a lot of sense. But I'm with you. I think it ludicrous and totally hope the show does not let this be the big surprise.

Red is taller than Katarina. His body build is different. His voice is deeeeep. A sex change would never be enough to do all that and make them look totally different. I know we have blacklisters who can change DNA. But this is one thing that would be totally unbelievable. If this was going to get the case, they should have gotten someone whose body and voice more closely resemble Katarina. Oh and no chest hair. Lol.

From Ressler book report, we know that the real Red never showed up at home on Christmas Eve. His car was abandoned by the side of the road. 4 years later "Red " shows up selling documents.

I think the four years later is when Naomi and Jennifer went into hiding. I think that's when she was pulled out of school on a weekday.

Lauren Helen Graham

Oh yes, the Christmas Eve stories are really confusing... We don't even know if it is two actually, we just assume it since the story that Red told Madeline Pratt was different from what Jennifer told Red how she remembered it. And now that you point it out, Marauders, Naomi said something different, too Now I'm even more confused

Miranda

There are several versions of the Christmas Eve story. I thought I would put them all here so we can see where they have differences.

Red: "It was Christmas Eve. I pulled off to the side of the road, seemed like it'd been snowing for days. No traffic. No cars to come help. Just me and a car full of gifts. It was more than 20 year ago. I must have walked four miles. Five, maybe. It was so still. Just cold and white. The whole time all I could think about was them in our house. The warm light in the windows. The smoke from the chimney. The sound of my daughter at the piano. The smell of the tree, and the fire, oyster stew on the stove. I was so upset to think that I'd ruined Christmas for them, being late, leaving the gifts in the car. But the closer I got, the more I realized how funny the whole thing was. How much they'd love the story. Daddy running out of gas. How every Christmas they'd get such joy from telling that story at my expense. And then finally, I got there, I walked... I walked through the door. And there was just blood. All I saw was blood. All there was was blood. I can... I can still smell the nape of her neck. Feel her little... fingers on my cheek. Her whisper in my ear. That's why I didn't show up in Florence. It's why I haven't shown up in a lot of places over the years."

Jennifer: "I'm your daughter. The one you abandoned 28 years ago on Christmas Eve. Did you think of me at all? In my pink room, in my pink pajamas, waiting for Santa. When I went to sleep, my world was perfect, and when I woke up, it was destroyed. My daddy gone. Did he just leave? Was it an accident? We didn't know. All we knew was my daddy my good, kind, and decent daddy was gone. And then come to find out you weren't good or kind or decent. You were a traitor. And we were sent into hiding. From you. From my father. And I'm telling you this because if you are at all happy to see me, which I'm sure you're not, but if there's one shred of relief that I made it through this ordeal, it's because of Ian. He saved me. Now the only thing That's why I'm standing here, asking you, my father, to please save him.

Naomi: "I had a life, you know? My daughter had a life with a house and a dog.
And then I woke up one day You can't imagine what it's like to have a man like Raymond Reddington turn your life upside down. They accused me of being a part of it. Somehow, I was a suspect. Put my life under a microscope every call, every charge.
My assets were I finally convinced them I was innocent. They said I had to go.
Give up everything. I remember it was a Wednesday afternoon. My daughter wasn't even out of school yet. And by Thursday, we were in Philadelphia, fending for ourselves."

So who is telling the truth? Or was it a mistake from the writers? Red and Jen are both talking about it being Christmas Eve and Naomi is talking about a Wednesday afternoon..

Fangirl49

It's so awesome that you put them here together!! Reds Christmas Eve story is first I think. Between 87 and 88.

So if you read Jennifer, she starts talking about how he doesn't show up Christmas Eve. That's 1990. And they don't know what happened. Then she says later we learn your a traitor and we go into hiding. That would be 94.

So I think when they learn he's a traitor, is when the investigation starts and Naomi's asserts are frozen until she convinced them she's not a part of it. They are placed in protective custody. I believe that is the Wednesday and Thursday they talk about.

Lauren Helen Graham

Hm... I really have no idea what to think about it. What if somebody really faked the deaths of Naomi and Jennifer, faked the bloody scene in the house and before told them all the lies about Raymond Reddington? So he arrived there on Christmas and they are not around anymore?

I know, it doesn't make sense with what Naomi pointed out

Miranda

Both of your theories are a very good possibilities. Both could have happened but I really don't know what to think either.

Fangirl49

The Real Raymond was dead before that Christmas Eve. He died in 1989.

I just wonder how they kept up the appearance of him being alive a year before Christmas 1990 when he didn't go home.

Lauren Helen Graham

We don't know that, Marilyn, do we? We just assume he died in that fire but we don't know.

Fangirl49

Think of the ending of S2. Liz learned she shot and killed her father the night of the fire. I don't think Red would let her believ it if it did not happen that way.

Miranda

I think I agree with Marilyn on that. I can't believe that Red would let Liz believe that she killed her father when she didn't. So she shot her father during the night of the fire and the real Raymond Reddington died that night and Liz was brought to Sam by either Kaplan or our Red and maybe because of all that happened he came up with the plan to take over Raymond Reddington's entire life?

Fangirl49

We need more details. I can't wait to see how his story unfolds.

Lauren Helen Graham

I'm totally with Marilyn about it as well

She was brought to Sam by Kaplan... We saw that.

Fangirl49

And Katarina tells Kaplan that Raymond says take her to Sam. That has to be our Red because the real one was dead.

Miranda

I think it was our Red as well. the real RR was already dead.