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Old 05-07-2017, 11:07 AM
  #16
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Hey Issi!

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I was missing Francis big time in this episode. To go from a loving marriage to this abusive one is so sad I remember how crazy happy Francis was when he found out she was pregnant...and how she finally gets to have a child and it's with a man threatening to kill them both. So so sad.
It's heartbreaking. God, I miss Francis and Frary so much.

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I'm not ready to trust Bothwell knowing the history. Not sure if they will go for accuracy on that or not, but if they so he is a horrible human being so IDK.
I think they can find a way to portray him as a decent human being who really loved Mary, while still explaining how he got his historical reputation. In that way, they could still be historically accurate. At least that is the way I hope they go with his character.

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Aa much as I enjoyed Mary tearing up that paper...I think that was a mistake. Not saying she should have signed it because obviously that's a bad idea, but I think she should have been more tactful. That only served to piss him off and make things worse. She should have at least made him think he had a chance of earning his place. Shutting him down completely and giving him no hope makes him dangerous. Now he has nothing to lose.
I do agree. The way she handled the situation was rather rash and tactless - even if it was satisfying in the moment.

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Catherine should have been smarter. She should know better than to mess with that stuff and we know that it will likely bite her in the ass later. I can only hope it will take a few people down with her.
Yeah, her messing with the occult and black magic does make me nervous. It will probably not end well. Let's hope it works on some level to help her take down her enemies.

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Narcisse is an ass, pure and simple. Hasn't changed a bit. Losing Lola did nothing to make him a better person.
He's a disappointment. At least (at this point) he's being up front with Catherine about his treachery and where his loyalties lie. That's the only good thing I can say.

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Gideon ia a moron. He had no reason to rat Mary out. He may as well have just signed her death warrant. How does he just stop caring about her so quickly. Like I get that he moved on, but that was cold. Another instance of Mary should have listened to Catherine. She did tell her never to trust him...and what did she go and do?
Well, I understand why he felt he needed to convince Elizabeth that she needed to marry a Catholic for her own safety. Perhaps he could have found another way.

Exactly.... Catherine was right. AGAIN.
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Old 05-07-2017, 07:26 PM
  #17
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I love that Catherine's a cool sexy witch now and that language and that spell... awww that's my queen
I love that too! I watched the sexy black magic scene like 5 times. As fascinating as RL Catherine's life was, I'm definitely most intrigued by her interest in astrology and the occult.

As anti-Narcisse as I'm feeling right now, I can't help but want another hot scene between them, their chemistry is phenomenal and Catherine deserves a bit of fun :p I can't imagine them having a proper relationship at this point though, he is incapable of changing.
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Old 05-08-2017, 01:40 PM
  #18
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how on earth did Gideon make it to Scotland and back in one night? Did he travel by plane, horse and all?
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Old 05-08-2017, 02:01 PM
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I had kept an open mind about Narcisse even though I felt like I'd never ship it again, but still he let me down.
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Old 05-11-2017, 08:38 AM
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I am team Gideon here. Mary should have never but him in that position. His loyalty was always suppose to be to Elizabeth crown wise and she knew that
And now that he's "with her" his loyalty should go even more to Elizabeth.

What was he suppose to say to her, he was kidnapped?

Now that he's with Elizabeth, how could he keep that secret from her?

If Mary was a true friend to Gideon. She would have never ever put him in that position.

As for Narcisse, I actually think he's right as well. Charles has not shown himself to be a strong king.
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Old 05-11-2017, 07:30 PM
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NEW EPISODE DISCUSSION THREAD IS UP. --- Episode 4x12

^ I do agree with you. As annoyed as I am with Gideon... I understand where he is coming from. Maybe he shouldn't have agreed to lie for Mary in the first place, but she put him in a terrible position. It's just not possible for him to be "neutral" and support and protect BOTH queens now.

As for Narcisse, I understand why he would think Henri would be the best king for Francis, but it's upsetting that he gave up on Charles (and Catherine) so easily.
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Old 05-11-2017, 08:37 PM
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NEW EPISODE DISCUSSION THREAD IS UP. --- Episode 4x12

^ I do agree with you. As annoyed as I am with Gideon... I understand where he is coming from. Maybe he shouldn't have agreed to lie for Mary in the first place, but she put him in a terrible position. It's just not possible for him to be "neutral" and support and protect BOTH queens now.

As for Narcisse, I understand why he would think Henri would be the best king for Francis, but it's upsetting that he gave up on Charles (and Catherine) so easily.
I don't think its "so easily" look at how Charles has been acting. He has to sleep with Charles's mistress for him Charles to act like even a partial king.

I don't blame Narcisse for immediately changing course once he got to know Henry a little bit.

As for Gideon, HE maybe shouldn't have agreed to help but he did the right thing to find out what was going on.{r


As for Gideon agreeing to lie for Mary, he was KIDNAPPED. If he said no, Mary would have had him remain in Scotland. I don't blame him one second for lying to get out of being KIDNAPPED.

People keep on saying if Gideon cared for Mary. Well if Mary cared for Gideon she wouldn't have gone after Elizabeth, she wouldn't have included Gideon in her scheme, and she wouldn't have made him make promises that put his loyalty and position with Elizabeth on the line.

However Mary clearly has a habit of using others for her own benefit. Liked her brother James.
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Old 05-11-2017, 10:20 PM
  #23
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As I said in the Narcisse thread, I'm not making excuses for Charles' shortcomings, but we need to remember that he is young, and suffered through an extremely traumatic ordeal when he was kidnapped. He's just finally starting to heal and find the strength to fight for his position. With Catherine and Narcisse's guidance, perhaps he could be the leader he needs to be. Again, I just think Narcisse gave up on Charles (and Catherine) too quickly. Henri may be strong, bold and ruthless, but that's not everything necessary to be a good king. By pitting brother against brother, he is putting France and the whole Valois line in danger.

That's true... Gideon was kidnapped, and he didn't really have any other way out of Scotland other than agreeing to Mary's terms. I understand the desperate nature of Mary's situation, and I don't think she would have used Gideon if there were any other solution. But I agree that it was pretty awful of her to force him to make promises that put his relationship and loyalty to Elizabeth, and his position at English court, in jeopardy.
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Old 10-12-2017, 07:04 AM
  #24
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Damn I liked that Darnley and mary were working together in the beginning but things turned ugly quickly. I wish it had been like history where they were in love and then it later got ugly.
I agree Gideon was in a bad situation
Henri is being shady but he's nice to look at I do agree Narcisse gave up
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Old 10-12-2017, 07:24 PM
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It was so disappointing that we didn't get to see Mary and Darnley in love and working together a little longer before it went downhill.

I really felt for Gideon in this episode - being stuck in the middle of the two queens. All he ever wanted was for them both to be safe.

Yeah, at least Henri is VERY nice to look at.
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