Gelfling

it was never obvious to me either. In fact it made no sense, considering Delphine had just gone to Shay to tell her to take care of Cosima for her. IF Shay had proceeded to come at her with a gun, I think Delphine's reaction probably would have been a bit more of "oh ****!" or at least angrier.
And it's not because I didn't have to see her face I love her face

I just don't love it like I love Delphine's

That's my theory too. She's valuable to Neolution and when Nealon offered her a job with the Neos, it was probably because they knew Evie was going to make a move against her.

Until the finale, I'd always thought her being shot and the Nealon thing were related but I've been OrphanBlacked Nice one, people, you got me.

they are blinded by science and by their faith that their "call" to "make the next evolution" justifies all the sacrifices but she's not.

I was surprised he was left alive but my gf made a good point. They may need his "biology" again, depending on how things go with the cure and the clone thing reboot so they keep him around just in case

MK is sick so I hope they'll bring her back to cure her.

That's a bit of Post hoc ergo propter hoc to me because we see the Hendrixes role playing and they probably had more on screen sex than any of the other characters (I can't unsee it either btw ) and that's not for villainy. It's just for fun, which is also what they used Rachel and Ferdinand's proclivities for.

Less Than Perfect

She's certainly smart enough to be there but surely if Neolution had been keeping tabs on her then they'd know her well enough to know that she's too loyal to Cosima and clone club to turn on them. I got the impression that Delphine and The Messenger know that there's something else about Delphine that sets her apart.

It would make sense if it was Westmoreland himself. The way Delphine glanced back at him was definitely less than friendly.

I think in Rachel's case the sex is certainly about her villainy. It's not just Ferdinand she's done it with but I'd say Paul too. But are Alison/Donnie's sex scenes just about role play? The garage sex was all about Alison wanting to be dirty after the two of them had just burried Leekie in the garage. Then their sex post Donnie's jail time was all about him wanting to be thought of as someone powerful because he'd been in jail. There was also Alison's car sex with Chad because she wanted to get back at Aynsley. Alison and Donnie probably have more blood on their hands than Rachel does, the show just plays their interactions off differently.

everlanded

I don't think roleplaying is nearly as taboo as BDSM or incest (Susan/Ira).

Scully_fan

In the the initial pitch for 4x10 MK was originally supposed to have a large role this ep and she was also supposed to die........ so it makes me wonder if she won't be alive for long in S5.

Though interestingly that whole board is super different to how the episode played out.

Could be. But I'm still thinking they want her expertise. Besides,, when they did take Delphine they took her after Cophine had been broken up for a while. Westmoreland Neos might have thought Cosima had moved on to Shay while Delphine was now tearing it up as HBIC at Dyad, even accepting Cosima's resignation, so maybe they didn't think Delphine's feelings ran that deep and she could be turned to at least prioritise science above everything else. Guess we'll find out. We know for sure she wasn't saved from the goodness of Westmoreland's own heart, he definitely has some purpose in mind for her.

MOOT

I enjoyed the episode, amongst the best of season 4, it's set the show up well for its final season. As it drew to its conclusion though I did start becoming concerned that we weren't going to get a reunion, but we did and it was great and there were tears!! Duko as the shooter, I'm kind of okay with that, maybe it isn't quite what they originally planned, but it does sort of fit with how season 4 unfolded. I don't remember, did Duko make an appearance at the end of season 3 or is he purely a season 4 character? Is it possible Delphine knew of him?

So after all the "maybe Rachel isn't quite as evil as we'd once assumed" the truth reveals itself, she really doesn't like her sisters. She has some serious delusions of superiority. I'm hoping that she finds herself completely out of her depth with the Neo's and they put her down a peg or two or something else! Ferdinand's about face regarding Neolution, considering how he dispatched his right hand last year, was a bit of a stretch maybe, is he really that infatuated with Rachel? I don't get the appeal myself. I do wish OB would cut out the kinky sex though, it generally serves no purpose and just gets in the way and takes up screen time of which there is precious little in OB.

As, as far as I am aware, human cloning wasn't possible in the eighties so I've always seen OB as a bit of sci-fi along with the drama so for me Westmoreland being Victorian isn't too muck of a problem, hopefully we'll get some insight into how he's stuck around for so long.

danvers

same. and I hope we won't have to in season 5. I'd happily live with this loose end.

BrooklynFan

Me too. I think Shay was definitely supposed to play a part, but not I think as the shooter. But her involvement in any way would require at least some delving into her backstory, and I'd rather have a loose end than waste precious time on that.

As for the Duko reveal, it was pretty underwhelming. However, I can see in the writers' minds that it made sense during the hiatus when they were saying we all should be asking who shot Delphine. Duko is Evie's henchman, so him as shooter points to Evie as the big bad to be revealed in S4. So in their minds I get why it would be important. Problem is, though, that we hadn't even met Duko yet so we couldn't even speculate about him during the hiatus, and then by the time we finally see the shooting Evie and Duko are old news (and both dead).

I just realized that having Delphine shot was Evie's first move in wresting control from Susan. Evie knew that Dephine would always advocate for the clones.

Aurora Cormier

Oh totally, me too, when a storyline is THAT bad it's best to forget it ever existed Her being a villain would only further validate my dislike, but I think being a pointless character is reason enough

I think he was only in season 4, but yeah, I assumed that given her position and everything she knew, Delphine would know many more people than just the ones we saw onscreen, so I didn't think the reveal was that bad And like you said, it did make sense with how season 4 played out

danvers

probably, because I don't remember ever seeing his face before.

Aurora Cormier

True!

Less Than Perfect

Why they thought it was important to have Susan/Ira in a romantic relationship is beyond me. It literally served no purpose. If Susan had raised Ira on the island and thought of him as her own son that would've been reason enough for her to want a cure. It's kind of like Art being in love with Beth. His friendship with her and the fact that he is a cop was enough for him to help the other clones.

I still don't think he was that willing to become Team Neo. She was basically strangling him before Ira came in. And yeah, he was pretty passionate about how much he hated the Neos last season.

Agreed.

Exactly, so I'm happy they couldn't bring her back. Or maybe they could and after the outrage over hiatus they decided to change it.

Oooh, nice!

Gelfling

In the case of Paul, I think it was more about Rachel's extreme control issues.

good point

You're probably right but I don't really see Ira/Susan as incest. They're not related and she didn't raise him, did she?

Interesting. I hope they kept her alive for further developments. I feel horrible saying that but if someone's going to die from that thing, I'd prefer it being MK than Cosima. Go ahead, you can boo me, I'm ashamed :ashamed:

since he's playing God, might as well go all the way.

Right. And that was a smart move too. Delphine was a bigger player than even Rachel realized.

Less Than Perfect

I thought she did raise him. Ira says he's never met any of the other Castor clones and Rachel makes a comment about Susan raising a Castor clone instead of her.

BrooklynFan

There was some reference to Susan "finding him at Yale," if I recall correctly, so I think maybe Ira's only been with her since college.

everlanded

Idr when he came into her life, but he called her mom, so.