[ollibear]

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) I fear that the writers will put Bay & Emmett back together this season. I no longer believe Emmett is a good person, so that thought bothers me greatly. It's not that I think Emmett is evil. It's just that he is weak and stupid. I would hate for anyone to be saddled with him as a life partner. Travis made a joke about Mary Beth being his ball and chain, well, Emmett has proven to be a REAL ball and chain, for anyone unlucky enough to get stuck with him.

I'm talking to myself here, but I really and truly am OVER the writers' need to have Emmett behave in ways where, later, he is forced to say, "It was a mistake. I was stupid. It didn't mean anything. I'm sorry. It was my fault. I was the stupid one not to figure it out. It's all my fault. You got dumped by your idiot boyfriend."

Those lines of dialogue are just a few of the MANY that his character has shared with the audience. I don't remember Bay or Daphne ever berating themselves like that.

In my opinion, the writers have made Emmett's character appear so weak and so stupid that I do feel sorry for whomever gets saddled with him as a life partner. With the way the character is written now, who would want Emmett as a partner? Can his character ever resist temptation? His line to Bay, in Season 1, appears so ironic now, "You are going to drop this the way that you drop everything." Emmett is the one who drops relationships, not Bay. He dropped Daphne's friendship and his relationship with Bay twice. He fell for the catfish scheme. He has allowed Skye to manipulate him.

Emmett's character seemed savvier than that, when we first met him.

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) I'm not sure about Daphne and Mingo. I've let go of my hope that Wilke will return. Things have changed so much now that it wouldn't be all that great, even if he did. I suppose Daphne and Mingo should work things out and spend a lifetime together. They'd make a good couple. Mingo turned out to be a great guy, and he could continue to encourage Daphne in all of the ways that she needs, especially with all of her insecurities. If the writers continue to redeem Daphne, then Mingo is a good partner for her. If the writers take Daphne back to the dregs, as she was at the end of Season 3, then I would like for her to end up with Emmett. It would be amusing to watch the two losers get stuck with each other.

I do believe the writers have set up an interesting dichotomy between the teens who are deaf and hearing. Bay and Toby (representing the hearing teens) are good and moral people who would never purposefully hurt others. Daphne and Emmett (representing the deaf teens) are amoral. They lie. They cheat. They abuse. They abandon. They often lack the capacity to forgive. They are both selfish, in a way that Bay and Toby are not.

I wonder what is the meaning behind the writers' decision to paint the two teens who are deaf, as characters who lack scruples.

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) I would like for Bay to find someone like Mingo, too. I really and truly hope the writers don't stick Bay with Emmett, in the end. He isn't good enough for her. He never was. If the writers wanted, they could write Garrett to be as wonderful as Mingo, and Bay could continue a relationship with him and develop that connection that she felt was lacking, at first.

It's easy to allow myself to be sucked into the Bay & Emmett fantasy. It is difficult to take off my rose-colored glasses, when it comes to Emmett.

But if I had a friend whose boyfriend cheated on her when they were 16, and then abandoned her after she was raped, when they were 19, then I would think that boyfriend is a loser.

I don't care what kind of grand gestures he might pull in the name of romance. I'd be done with him.

I still remember John cautioning Bay not to underestimate Emmett's ability to handle what happened between her and Tank. Well, Bay didn't underestimate Emmett. I would like to see another scene between Bay and John, one where he tells her that there are better men than Emmett.

Do you all think that John will be pleased to see Bay dating Travis? I could see that making him happy.

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) Garrett offers Bay several things she desires. He is a connection to her East Riverside (blue collar) roots. He is a part of the Deaf community, which she loves and may even feel she was cheated from experiencing, because of the switch. And he is heartfelt, respectful, and romantic, as evidenced in the episodes last season. I was disappointed Garrett did not attend Bay's art opening in the Season Finale. Perhaps Nyle DiMarco had obligations with his ANTM contract. I like Garrett's romantic overtures better than Emmett's empty gestures. Garrett does not do anything over-the-top. He is sincere, unlike Emmett.

Garrett has the potential to offer Bay everything that both Ty and Emmett offered her, in one package. But my instincts tell me that the writers have no intention to explore that. It's a shame, because I would be interested in following a Bay and Garrett romance. I could allow Emmett to fade into a distant memory, if we could only see Bay fall in love with Garrett.

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) As for Travis, I don't know what will happen to him. I have the feeling that Travis and Mary Beth are over for good. I hope Travis isn't meant to spend a lifetime with Bay, because I don't like him. Plus, Travis will always have connections to Emmett, and I'd prefer Bay stay as far away from Emmett as possible. I don't think Travis is meant for Daphne. I'm not sure who Travis is meant to be involved with romantically.

Did someone suggest a Travis and Iris relationship earlier? Both of them felt the same exact way about Daphne dating Mingo. They both called him shallow.

Travis and Iris might be an interesting combination.

[~AnastasiaGrey~]

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) I'm talking to myself here, but I really and truly am OVER the writers' need to have Emmett behave in ways where, later, he is forced to say, "It was a mistake. I was stupid. It didn't mean anything. I'm sorry. It was my fault. I was the stupid one not to figure it out. It's all my fault. You got dumped by your idiot boyfriend." Those lines of dialogue are just a few of the MANY that his character has shared with the audience. I don't remember Bay or Daphne ever berating themselves like that. In my opinion, the writers have made Emmett's character appear so weak and so stupid that I do feel sorry for whomever gets saddled with him as a life partner. With the way the character is written now, who would want Emmett as a partner? Can his character ever resist temptation? His line to Bay, in Season 1, appears so ironic now, "You are going to drop this the way that you drop everything." Emmett is the one who drops relationships, not Bay. He dropped Daphne's friendship and his relationship with Bay twice. He fell for the catfish scheme. He has allowed Skye to manipulate him. Emmett's character seemed savvier than that, when we first met him. I do believe the writers have set up an interesting dichotomy between the teens who are deaf and hearing. Bay and Toby (representing the hearing teens) are good and moral people who would never purposefully hurt others. Daphne and Emmett (representing the deaf teens) are amoral. They lie. They cheat. They abuse. They abandon. They often lack the capacity to forgive. They are both selfish, in a way that Bay and Toby are not. I wonder what is the meaning behind the writers' decision to paint the two teens who are deaf, as characters who lack scruples. It's easy to allow myself to be sucked into the Bay & Emmett fantasy. It is difficult to take off my rose-colored glasses, when it comes to Emmett. But if I had a friend whose boyfriend cheated on her when they were 16, and then abandoned her after she was raped, when they were 19, then I would think that boyfriend is a loser. I don't care what kind of grand gestures he might pull in the name of romance. I'd be done with him. I still remember John cautioning Bay not to underestimate Emmett's ability to handle what happened between her and Tank. Well, Bay didn't underestimate Emmett. I would like to see another scene between Bay and John, one where he tells her that there are better men than Emmett. Do you all think that John will be pleased to see Bay dating Travis? I could see that making him happy. Garrett has the potential to offer Bay everything that both Ty and Emmett offered her, in one package. But my instincts tell me that the writers have no intention to explore that. It's a shame, because I would be interested in following a Bay and Garrett romance. I could allow Emmett to fade into a distant memory, if we could only see Bay fall in love with Garrett. Did someone suggest a Travis and Iris relationship earlier? Both of them felt the same exact way about Daphne dating Mingo. They both called him shallow. Travis and Iris might be an interesting combination.

I dont know but they need to change something because clearly somethign isnt working

[Kassiek]

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) I'm talking to myself here, but I really and truly am OVER the writers' need to have Emmett behave in ways where, later, he is forced to say, "It was a mistake. I was stupid. It didn't mean anything. I'm sorry. It was my fault. I was the stupid one not to figure it out. It's all my fault. You got dumped by your idiot boyfriend." Those lines of dialogue are just a few of the MANY that his character has shared with the audience. I don't remember Bay or Daphne ever berating themselves like that. In my opinion, the writers have made Emmett's character appear so weak and so stupid that I do feel sorry for whomever gets saddled with him as a life partner. With the way the character is written now, who would want Emmett as a partner? Can his character ever resist temptation? His line to Bay, in Season 1, appears so ironic now, "You are going to drop this the way that you drop everything." Emmett is the one who drops relationships, not Bay. He dropped Daphne's friendship and his relationship with Bay twice. He fell for the catfish scheme. He has allowed Skye to manipulate him. Emmett's character seemed savvier than that, when we first met him.

When Emmett said that to Bay I thought that was very unfounded. And I thought it was a projection of himself onto her. She actually has a hard time letting things go and they normally come back later. Emmett always seemed like a bit of quitter to me. I loved their relationship, but it was very young. It wasn't really a mature relationship in my eyes. I'm sure Emmett will grow as he ages, men do age maturity-wise a little slower. In fact, a study showed that cognitive empathy doesn't even begin in boys until age 15 whereas it starts in girls at 13 and they have a decline in affective empathy during the ages of 13 to 16--where it would then start to rise again all the way through age 21. This literally means that Emmett has a harder time to understand or empathize with Bay even at 19.

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) Io you all think that John will be pleased to see Bay dating Travis? I could see that making him happy.

I think he might be but you can never be sure with John.

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) Garrett has the potential to offer Bay everything that both Ty and Emmett offered her, in one package. But my instincts tell me that the writers have no intention to explore that. It's a shame, because I would be interested in following a Bay and Garrett romance. I could allow Emmett to fade into a distant memory, if we could only see Bay fall in love with Garrett.

I don't like Garrett at all. He's super smarmy in my opinion. I also don't think he's the type to settle down anytime soon. He's a love 'em and leave 'em type.

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) Did someone suggest a Travis and Iris relationship earlier? Both of them felt the same exact way about Daphne dating Mingo. They both called him shallow. Travis and Iris might be an interesting combination.

Ehh...I also really dislike Iris. I think she's insincere and a bad friend. I really feel like the only reason she's even friends with Daphne is because she was an in to the Deaf Community. Otherwise she doesn't listen to Daphne or really respect/talk to her. She can just be written off the show like Mary Beth. Get rid of them both! I'd love to see an actual good friend for either of the girls. The show really takes a dump on female friendship which is a shame because it can be really beneficial to girls at that age (or any age)!

[~AnastasiaGrey~]

Originally Posted by Kassiek (View Post) When Emmett said that to Bay I thought that was very unfounded. And I thought it was a projection of himself onto her. She actually has a hard time letting things go and they normally come back later. Emmett always seemed like a bit of quitter to me. I loved their relationship, but it was very young. It wasn't really a mature relationship in my eyes. I'm sure Emmett will grow as he ages, men do age maturity-wise a little slower. In fact, a study showed that cognitive empathy doesn't even begin in boys until age 15 whereas it starts in girls at 13 and they have a decline in affective empathy during the ages of 13 to 16--where it would then start to rise again all the way through age 21. This literally means that Emmett has a harder time to understand or empathize with Bay even at 19. I think he might be but you can never be sure with John. I don't like Garrett at all. He's super smarmy in my opinion. I also don't think he's the type to settle down anytime soon. He's a love 'em and leave 'em type. Ehh...I also really dislike Iris. I think she's insincere and a bad friend. I really feel like the only reason she's even friends with Daphne is because she was an in to the Deaf Community. Otherwise she doesn't listen to Daphne or really respect/talk to her. She can just be written off the show like Mary Beth. Get rid of them both! I'd love to see an actual good friend for either of the girls. The show really takes a dump on female friendship which is a shame because it can be really beneficial to girls at that age (or any age)!

Yeah I agree

[ollibear]

Every so often, in this thread, we've broached the subject about whether or not Emmett has a right to be jealous of Travis's interest in Bay.

I fall on the side of yes, yes, he does. And I believe Kassie and some others feel he doesn't, though I may be wrong about that.

I've seen lots of people on Twitter and Facebook express that Emmett has no right to say anything about Travis dating Bay, or to feel any certain way, because he cut Bay loose himself.

So I've been thinking about my position and wondering if I'm wrong. I've been analyzing the situation and trying to figure out why I feel so strongly that Emmett has that right, the right to ask Travis not to make a move on Bay.

And I haven't figured anything out yet.

But I do still feel just as strongly about my conviction that Emmett has that right. The weird thing is that a part of me wants to convince myself otherwise, and so far, I haven't been able to do it.

I did see a few interesting things this week that play into my thoughts at the moment.

One thing I saw was a question and answer in an advice column that somehow came through my news-feed on Facebook:

A woman wrote that her son had dated a young woman for three years, before college. This person accompanied them on family vacations, visited their home often, and she felt almost like a daughter to the woman. During her son's freshman year of college, the two broke up. Her son didn't want to talk about it. A year later, the young woman married someone else, and the mother wanted to send her a note to say that she thought of her often and wished her well in her new life. Her son did not want her to do so.

The advice columnist was adamant that the mother should NOT send a note to this young woman, since her son made his wishes clear. The advice columnist said that there is no way to know what went down between the two, and for the mother to reach out to the young woman would be seen as an act of betrayal by her son.

I am not sure that I agree with the advice, but I do agree that the mother's loyalty belongs to her son. And I guess that's where I am at with Travis.

Of course, Travis is a fictional character, and we have not seen much of his bonding time with Emmett. But Melody considers them both to be her sons. She has stated that they are brothers, and that she needs them to be brothers, now that she is adopting the twins.

Travis's loyalty should be with Emmett. If it is not, then they are not truly brothers.

I understand that romantic feelings are different from the motherly feelings that this woman had for her son's former girlfriend. And I even agree that all is fair in love and war, to a certain extent. But at the very least, given the fact that Travis has no real idea what went down between Bay and Emmett. And what Travis does know (about the rape) is troubling and should concern him for his brother and his brother's girlfriend, for Travis to make a move on Bay this soon, it seems disloyal to me.

I really don't think Emmett was troubled by the idea of Bay dating someone. I think Emmett just did not want that someone to be his brother. I don't blame him. If things work out between Bay and Travis, and they marry and start a family, then that will be a reminder to Emmett for the rest of his life of what happened when his relationship to Bay fell apart.

In the same way that Daphne took Bay's side over Emmett's, I really feel that Travis should have taken Emmett's side, over Bay's.

But I'll keep working on it, because I do have this desire to convince myself otherwise.

[AnneH]

Because Travis and Emmett are meant to be like brothers, I do think Emmett Can be upset about it. If they were simply just friends who lost touch then it would be different. But melody considers Travis family and he lived with Emmett as family.

It's why I think Travis and bay feels very wrong.

[Kassiek]

I do stand on the side that Emmett has no right to get in the way. He can be jealous all he wants but he has no right to have any say over who anyone else dates.

As for the advice columnists, I agree with them. The girl was dating the boy and most likely never felt as close to the mother as she did. It is inappropriate there. Actually, my friend was just telling me tonight about how her parents are still in touch with her ex and goes over to her house sometimes (she lives out of the country) and how it doesn't bother her at all. So it all depends on the people. This isn't the same situation with Emmett and Travis. And like I've said repeatedly, I don't think they ever even felt like brothers to each other. Both can support Melody and as long as they can get over themselves (which they should), then it shouldn't be a problem if Travis dates Bay.

[AnneH]

I don't think or want Emmett to tell anyone who they can or cannot date, but I think he's allowed to not be comfortable with it.

[~AnastasiaGrey~]

He even said that he hate the thought of her dating anyone else so he will be upset by it .

[ollibear]

Originally Posted by Kassiek (View Post) I do stand on the side that Emmett has no right to get in the way. He can be jealous all he wants but he has no right to have any say over who anyone else dates.

It's not that I want Emmett telling anyone who they can or cannot date. Even if he and Bay were married, he wouldn't have the right to do that. People should be free to enter and exit relationships, as they choose.

For me, it's about family loyalty. If a real-life person, like, for instance, Sean Berdy, broke up with his girlfriend, I wouldn't expect his brother to start dating her a few months later.

It doesn't matter why they broke up. It would feel wrong. Maybe that's just me, though.

Originally Posted by Kassiek (View Post) As for the advice columnists, I agree with them. The girl was dating the boy and most likely never felt as close to the mother as she did. It is inappropriate there. Actually, my friend was just telling me tonight about how her parents are still in touch with her ex and goes over to her house sometimes (she lives out of the country) and how it doesn't bother her at all. So it all depends on the people. This isn't the same situation with Emmett and Travis. And like I've said repeatedly, I don't think they ever even felt like brothers to each other. Both can support Melody and as long as they can get over themselves (which they should), then it shouldn't be a problem if Travis dates Bay.

I actually disagree with the advice columnist.

When my first boyfriend and I broke up, I stayed in touch with his parents. We talked on the phone. I moved 3000 miles to live near them. They came over to my apartment for dinner and visited my restaurant for parties, years after I broke up with my boyfriend. I visited them in their home, without their son present, had dinner, and then, watched TV with them in the evenings. We were friends.

I don't know how my first boyfriend felt about all of that. He may have had some mixed feelings at first, but he knew that he broke my heart, so maybe he tolerated it because of that. Or who knows? Maybe he asked them to look out for me.

There at the end, before I moved 3000 miles back home, he used to join us for dinner at both my apartment and at his parents' house, so he must not have felt too bad about it.

I love them separate from him, and that's why I think the advice columnist is wrong. In my opinion, the son should be mature enough to see his parents as individuals who are allowed to have their own friendships. But who knows? Maybe his girlfriend had done something awful to him. Maybe it would have felt like a betrayal for his parents to continue a friendship with her.

As for Emmett and Travis not feeling like brothers, we have not seen much evidence that they do. But if Travis pursues a relationship with Bay, then there is not much hope that he and Emmett ever will bond as brothers. The ending of a romantic relationship carries mixed feelings. Even if you are sure that it is better to part ways, it is still painful to see someone you love with someone new. To be reminded of that pain at every family event, for the rest of your life, is like inviting the enemy into your home. It's too much.

[~AnastasiaGrey~]

I dont know I guess we will see when it comes. I mean he will be bothered by it but at the same time he would think there isnt much he can do about it.

[ollibear]

Originally Posted by ~TwilighterTee~ (View Post) I dont know I guess we will see when it comes. I mean he will be bothered by it but at the same time he would think there isnt much he can do about it.

It won't be a big problem unless Emmett returns to KC. And even then, it will only be a problem if Travis and Bay are all lovey dovey in front of Emmett, or if Emmett returns with a girlfriend or wife and takes her to family events that Travis attends with Bay.

The Bledsoes were going through a divorce when we met them. Now that Melody is marrying Gabe and adopting twins, we will see if they have their own version of grill night and expect the boys to attend. If Emmett is in LA, then he's off the hook for family dinners. It would only be family vacations that might pose a problem, or big events in the twins' lives.

When it comes to predicting what the writers will do, I'm always wrong. Always. But my intuition is telling me that Emmett is going to seriously date a Deaf woman next. And he may return to KC, too. That's what my intuition says that the writers will do.

But like I said, I'm always wrong, so you can be sure that won't happen. I've never predicted anything correctly with this show.

I do believe Bay will date Travis and their relationship will be serious, like extremely serious. But I guess we will see what happens.

[~AnastasiaGrey~]

Originally Posted by ollibear (View Post) It won't be a big problem unless Emmett returns to KC. And even then, it will only be a problem if Travis and Bay are all lovey dovey in front of Emmett, or if Emmett returns with a girlfriend or wife and takes her to family events that Travis attends with Bay. The Bledsoes were going through a divorce when we met them. Now that Melody is marrying Gabe and adopting twins, we will see if they have their own version of grill night and expect the boys to attend. If Emmett is in LA, then he's off the hook for family dinners. It would only be family vacations that might pose a problem, or big events in the twins' lives. When it comes to predicting what the writers will do, I'm always wrong. Always. But my intuition is telling me that Emmett is going to seriously date a Deaf woman next. And he may return to KC, too. That's what my intuition says that the writers will do. But like I said, I'm always wrong, so you can be sure that won't happen. I've never predicted anything correctly with this show. I do believe Bay will date Travis and their relationship will be serious, like extremely serious. But I guess we will see what happens.

Yeah that is also true guess we will see what happens

[ollibear]

Originally Posted by ~TwilighterTee~ (View Post) Yeah that is also true guess we will see what happens

I'm hoping Emmett stays in LA. I don't mind if he pops in to visit during a couple of episodes, but I would rather he continue what he started in LA. It wouldn't make sense for him to quit school anyway, when he loves it so much.

If Emmett stays in LA, then all the love triangles and squares become simpler. We really only have to worry about Bay and Mary Beth fighting over Travis.

I hope Mary Beth is cool with it. She should be. I want to see some happy relationships. I'm tired of the triangles.

[Kassiek]

We can always just go with my option and write Mary Beth off the show...lol. Okay, okay I'll stop being mean now.

I do think it makes most sense no matter what to keep Emmett in LA right now. The writers need to stick with it.