GrhmLz

Finally got to watch - will share my thoughts later when I get out of work!

Slayerfan714

Yay!

Static Waves

She has expressed that she was sorry, I think its clear through her actions and words. She is trying to convince people that she didn't sleep with Emmett out of malicious intent, to purposely be evil and cause drama. It's not like she is not taking responsibility for what she has done, she is just trying to make herself not seem like an evil person. The school has painted her as a **** that went out to ruin people's lives. Sadly, some of the fandom is doing the same.

I'm sorry, but people who hate Simone passionately obviously are doing it because she broke up E/B. I'm not even crazy about Simone but I think its crap when people talk about her being unredeemable. Why aren't we saying the same things about Emmett? Why isn't he unredeemable? He should be able to be redeemed, I just think the same courtesy from the fandom should be extended to Simone.


It's not exactly fun to have the entire school (+a website?) screaming that your a ****.

Slayerfan714

I don't hate her, but at the same time I can't help that I don't love the character.

I don't like the website, and I appreciate them trying, but we all are going to see it differently, and I just am not feeling it. But like I said, we all see it differently. Nothing wrong with it. I'm sure other people will like Daphne and Jeff, and I know I won't like it.

My Simone feelings are not just limited to the cheating, I will say that, but it didn't do her any favors.

I absolutely do not condone the tendency by society to use the term **** or other degrading terms so willingly, but I kind of want them to wrap up her arc as soon as possible. Redeem her as best they can, and let that be it.

Wes&FredFan

I think she could be redeemed. I'm still a little mad at Emmett for cheating on his GF (don't ship E/B ... but I don't like that the was made into a guy who'd cheat on somebody), and I'm still a little mad at Simone for cheating on Toby. Love Toby!

I see your point - a lot of hate is going Simone's way for coming in between just as it went Daphne's way when she told Emmett she had feelings for him. Was she confused? Most likely - feeling scared, overwhelmed, etc and not wanting to lose her best friend, who had been in her life first for a long time. She may or may not have had true feelings, but it was during that time that Bay AND Daphne were trying to stake a claim since their lives were upended. Bay was possessive about Liam, and Daphne was that way about Emmett. They didn't want to lose what they had to the other. Gradually, though, they just kinda realized that they could still keep their friends/family and no claim had to be made. They've learned to share and it worked out. Liam's not even in the picture, but he represents what Bay considered as hers before Daphne met him. Probably the whole point of his character - a period of adjustment.

It's not fair that Simone is getting more hate than Emmett, but she wasn't involved in a popular pairing. She didn't seduce Emmett - they were both extremely willing participants. Clearly, he wasn't saying/signing "No, I'm with Bay." He was very physically involved. However, in an effort to reunite E/B, it seems that he's going to be treated with a gentle pen now.

AnneH

yeah, i didn't care for simone before the emmett thing and i don't care for her now.

but i don't mind that they are trying to redeem her. i just hope once they do we don't have to see her again.

GrhmLz

Okay, VERY late to this discussion party but here is my review for the episode (I actually got to rewatch too):

Alot of build up going on.

First off - I liked the emphasis on Daphne this episode and how it explored on a deeper level her 'people pleasing' tendencies and how she attempts to keep everybody else happy. It's hard for her, she keeps her true feelings bottled up inside and I can see how this is being used as a platform for Daphne eventually becoming involved with Jeff. She's going to turn to him as an emotional outlet because she won't show how she's truly feeling at home: There is alot of change going on. She has to deal with her feelings regarding Angelo being so closely involved in her life now, it's different because Regina can't 'sign' at this point, Wilke is gone, and Emmett holds her to this pinnicle of perfection. You could tell that frustrated her.

Regina: I kind of feel bad for her because I get the sense she's in a catch 22. It was kind of like she was 'dammed' if she didn't marry Angelo and 'dammed' if she did, lol - especially when it came to making both her daughters happy. At one point, it's clear that she knew Angelo wasn't good for her but then again, is he really willing to change?! She's kind of in a position of trying to please everybody at once, and unfortunately, that's just not possible, even though she gets points for trying. I'm not sure if her mother will turn out to be right on this one regarding Angelo but we'll have to wait and see.

Personally, I would like to see Angelo and Regina make it work.

Well, looks like poor John got his record broken! LOL. Yikes - his ego has got to be hurting. Kathryn is constantly supportive, though, which is nice. What she said was sweet, that he'd always be Daphne and Bay's father and that for her, he'd always be the one.

Whoa - so Toby finally reacted! Gosh, not surprised, it was a long time coming, I think. Not good to keep things bottled up, Bay made a good point. He does walk around like he's fine with everything, he and Daphne appear to be alike in some ways when it comes to that. I really do have to give it to him, he is a SUPER decent guy. He's not at all supportive of what Simone did but at the same time, the dude has class. I admire him for looking down at it and not supporting that website attacking Simone.

Still not cool with what she did to Bay and Toby but I'm not at all for that website that was put up. *sighs* And it's completely a double standard. I know Emmett is sorry but it still doesn't erase that fact that he is just as guilty for the act as Simone, yet the girl gets labeled 'the big ****.' I look down on that kind of crap. I wonder who actually is behind it. I wasn't sure if it could have been that group of guys Toby let have it or if they were just ragging on the site, helping to feed the 'gossip mill' as they say.

Cool that Bay meet a fellow street artist - Medusa.

KBrownie

In regards to the Simone/Emmett supposed double standard, how do we know that he isn't facing the same repucussions at his own school?

Of the four people involved in this situation, Toby/Bay/Emmett/Simone, it is important to not forget that Emmett is the only one of the four to not go to Buckner. The Buckner kids probably have no idea who he is, so of course they aren't going to be calling him out for his actions. If he did go there, he would probably be called out as well. The reverse is possibly also true in that the kids at Carlton probably have no idea who Bay/Toby/Simone are. Also, Simone was presented as someone who got around before the thing with Emmett, so those kids may be responding to that as well. It is still wrong however.

Right now, Emmett is facing the exact same consequences as Simone from those directly affected by their actions: Bay and Toby. Bay doesn't want to be with him and Toby shoved him in this latest episode. Same with Simone. Bay doesn't want her around her and Toby isn't getting back together with her.

Simone would be smart to do what Emmett is doing and back off and stop trying to justify what she did. I think the differences in fan reaction to Simone and Emmett is that Emmett is actually a character that the audience has come to care about where there was a clear buildup to what he did. The audience have not been given such a clear picture of Simone. What we were shown when it happened was that she was upset that Toby wouldn't come to the tournament, so I don't know what she was talking about that she thought she and Toby were broken up. Also, what was that lie about her thinking Emmett and Bay were broken up? It was made clear in the following episode that the two could not communicate at all so how did she know that. They were both dead wrong and there is no excuse for what they did.

I personally don't care about Simone and wish she would go away. There's no point to her now. Toby and Bay may forgive her, but how is she ever going to fit in with Toby/Bay/Daphne/Emmett? If they try to give her some sob story about being an alcoholic to redeem her I'm going to . If you wanted me to care about her, then it should have been done from the start, not after she's done this awful thing that she's sorry for when she wasn't sorry for any of the other bad things she did before. She is a weak character when compared to the others. There are so many other stories to be told with the main characters that I feel like the show is wasting valuable time including her issues, especially with such a large cast. There's no time to try and fix the Simone character.

GrhmLz

To be fair we don't. But at the same time, as of right now, I saw nothing to indicate that he is. Sure, his personal relationships are effected, as I suspect Simone's would be. Toby doesn't want to have anything to do with her.

My issue is definitely the double-standard with such a website. The girl is labeled the **** while the guy who is guilty of the same offense, slides under the public radar.

Plus, I just think it lacks class. It's just ... so 'beneath oneself.' It's caddy and gossipy and it really doesn't change anything that happened nor does it help to improve anything. It just brings somebody down to someone's else's level of inappropriate behavior, I think. Whoever is responsible, shame on them.

I wouldn't excuse it but the only one I can kind of give some leeway to would have been Bay, had she done it. In the heat of the moment, with her hurt feelings, it at least would be understandable since she was the one 'cheated on.' And we know it wasn't Toby, or at least, it appears that way. I'd be shocked if we found out he was hiding that. Anybody else who did it?! Pfft.

KBrownie

The point I was trying to make is that they don't know who the guy is to call him a **** though. All they know, and Wilke said this to Simone during the movie shoot, is that Simone hooked up with someone at the basketball tournament. Wilke only figured out it was Emmett because he saw the texts on Simone's phone. Simone, on the other hand, is someone they see everyday at school and who has a previous reputation that they do know. Again, I'm not saying that what they are doing is right, but calling them out for a double-standard isn't fair I think since they don't have all the information. They don't care about the guy, not because of a double-standard, but because he isn't someone that they know and see everyday like Toby, Bay, and Simone. If they knew who Emmett was and still only called Simone a ****, I would totally agree that it was a double standard, but as of right now, I don't see it. They are just being mean and malicious boys with that website. Honestly, I don't see them having any problem with calling out a boy as well. There probably is a male version of that site that exists as well.

Slayerfan714

Unfortunately guys are players, bro-ho's, man****s, but even then, it's not used in the same way.

I don't even know if the Buckner kids know about what happened, or maybe Simone lost even more control over the summer and partied heavily and something happened that made her reevaluate her choices, hence AA. I mean, Bay seems more like a loner, and Toby does too. So, yes, Wilke said there were rumors about Simone having somebody in her room, but I don't think people know the extent of it. In other words, that it was Bay's boyfriend.

I don't know if the website is related to the cheating or just Simone's past actions. I agree, it is tacky, and I don't agree with it. Doesn't mean I like Simone, nor do I think her actions are excusable, but these days it's too easy to use a website like that to destroy someone. One drunken night and suddenly there's naked pictures everywhere and then that can hurt you in the future. Of course the caveat there is be mindful, but the truth is, people do stupid things all the time.

I'm not defending Simone; I just don't like the tendency society to deem women tramps and ****s, but sadly a lot of the female gender plays into that as well. Soaps play on it all the time. I don't know if it will change.

I agree though that Emmett isn't getting off scotch free. He isn't getting called a ****, but he's lost Bay, and his sort of friendship with Toby is definitely gone, but again, the fact that they are from two different worlds and schools play into it. If Emmett had been dating a deaf girl at Carlton and something happened like this, I think people would be giving him similar treatment, especially if the girl was someone who was well liked.

AnneH

from the first time i watched the episode, i never thought the website was directly tied to simone cheating on toby. that guy said, "simone just gives it away and still has you whipped" so it seems like since their break up she's been making some poor choices (hence the AA scene). that still doesn't justify someone putting her on a **** site, but it seems more that her reputation for "giving it away" is spreading around the school.

americanamuchacha020

Simone and Emmett are both guilty for this. I'm an Emmett fan but I don't hold him on some pedestal and think he can do no wrong, I know he's done wrong. I just think he's done a better job of handling the aftermath than Simone has. He stayed away from Toby and Bay, he's only come around her when she texted him or got the OK first. Simone has gotten in both Bay and Toby's face about this, wouldn't leave them alone. Yes they're both guilty but I give Emmett credit for knowing what he has to do. Simone isn't respecting that. Emmett never justified his behavior, Simone has. That's why I'm not a fan of Simone. The website was wrong and Toby does have a lot of class, especially with how he's dealt with her but Simone should respect that he wants nothing to do with her and leave him alone...Emmett has respected that with Bay. Big difference.

Mayberry

I agree with everything Slayer said, but I want to emphasize that I loved that one scene with Manish/Daphne. Still miss Wilke, but I got the shipper feels.

Felt a glimmer of sympathy for Simone, but that's because I'm intrigued about them doing a teenage alcoholic storyline, so that may be just the storyline I'm reacting to and not her.

GrhmLz

True, but I was generalizing in my statement there. Which means that, hypothetically speaking, had they known who Emmett was had he attended school there too, I don't believe he would have received the same treatment on the same level as Simone.

Like Alyssa said (Slayerfan) - it's just the way society seems to approach these things. Unfortunately, as nice and 'ideal' as it would be for both genders to be called out equally in these matters when it comes to stigmas being attached, I just don't see it working that way. I don't think I'm taking a big leap here in assuming that these 'guys' are subconsciously engaging in 'double-standard' behavior. I don't believe for one minute they would have done this to another guy, promoting such material, regardless of who's responsible for initially putting it up there to begin with. Girls to other girls?! Sure. But that's just me.

Personally, Alyssa, I do question the timing. I would have to say that it has everything to do with what happened with Emmett, word got out and this website is only now being 'promoted' after the Bay/Emmett break up. Simone may have a past but I think her actions with Emmett likely prompted this. How the word spread is a completely different matter, though, I actually wouldn't be surprised if Simone isn't in for a wake-up call of her own soon. She might have 'spilt' the secret to one of her so-called friends, who in turn, used it as gossip against her and started spreading the word.

Like you pointed out above, hence the AA meetings. She could have confessed during a 'drinking binge' or something to that effect, lol.