aeverett

Rumple effectively tricked Hook into dying so that he could be the Dark One again. Hook sacrificed himself to get rid of the darkness forever and save his friends from being dragged to the underworld with no escape. Rumple could have allowed that to happen, let the darkness be destroyed forever and save the gang, but instead he took advantage and siphoned the power to himself. What's more, he failed to tell Belle about what he did, so now she's living and sleeping with him, thinking he's just a mortal man. Finally, he threatened Emma when she mentioned telling Belle. I like Rumple; he'd be a far less exciting character if he didn't have all his schemes, but he has done a lot of wrong this season.

As for Cora, she was wrong to use Henry Sr., but she was desperate. She was trying to do right by Regina. She just knows no other way but power and she's not had the time to redeem herself that Regina did (even if I think they writers did rush some of Regina's story-line a bit). She never got a real chance and now that she's trying to protect her daughter in her flawed way, she's punished for it. Not for all the terrible things she did in life, but for the one good thing she's done in the series. That's wrong.

Pan I think is unchanged and I don't think he wants to redemption with anyone. I'm surprised he isn't running Cruella's scam, which is the best so far of all the underworld villains.

Although, I have to say, if the author's pen can raise the dead, and Henry intends to use it, he has an obligation to raise all the fallen heroes too. Why should Neal or Daniel or Marian stay dead while Cruella De Ville lives? They all deserve to live and were taken before their time. Also, Lily deserves her light back and Emma her dark back. If the pen can raise the dead, there is no reason Henry can't fix that. That above all, he has an obligation to correct.

CityGal

I guess I'm not sure if Cruella's explanation of the pen is entirely true. It's possible, but I'm not entirely convinced. She could twist the pen's tale for Henry's benefit without fully explaining the consequences.

Hopefully, she'll return for more episodes and provide more clues. The question is does Henry believe her and will he tell his moms or act on his own.

Can't wait to find out.

Austenphile

I am more inclined to believe the Apprentice who said it couldn't raise the dead as well as both Rumple and Isaac who said it couldn't raise Bae. Now it might be able to get rid of their "unfinished business".

aeverett

I think Isaac didn't know it could be done. Remember, his previous writing had taught him that magic couldn't raise the dead and he probably believed that rule applied to the pen; it's a natural corollary and he wasn't the most clever of characters.

The Apprentices statements are less easy to read. Either he doesn't know the full extent of the pen's power because he was never told, or he was saying to Henry that he couldn't bring back Neal as one would tell a friend that they couldn't kill someone who angered them. Technically, murder is in the realm of human possibility for most people, but the consequence to murderer, victim, and society keep those that would end human life in check.

In Greek mythology, when Sisyphus successfully cheated death, nobody else on Earth could die either. Terminally ill people in horrible suffering were forced to live on, soldiers who'd been decapitated in battle had to keep fighting, etc. That was the cost of the dead Sisyphus preventing his own removal to the underworld.

Someone like Cruella wouldn't care, but someone like Neal would be horrified if Henry did such a thing on their behalf, which is what I believe the apprentice truly meant. It might also be why Daniel or Frankenstein/Whale's brother (who from what little we saw of him seemed to have a heroic bent to his character) couldn't be resurrected. Perhaps Daniel was lying when he told Regina he couldn't come back to her. Perhaps he meant he couldn't come back without causing untold suffering to others. Personally I'd prefer to see it that way; Daniel didn't lack the the agency to return, but he chose not to in order to be a hero.

I hope they address these ideas later in the underworld arch. It's certainly the right environment to do so.

destroyer of worlds

Congrats on the 100th episode, what a great milestone.

Jinzle

How the heck did he trick Hook? It was Emma's plan. IF Rumple had not interfered, Emma would have killed Hook and then would had to kill herself to stop the Darkness. If anything, Rumple saved Emma.

fox24

Rumple didn't save anyone. If hook didn't agree to sacrifice himself it would have been Emma and she would be the one who died for nothing getting tortured in the Uw


The darkness was going to be gone once one had sacrificed himself

Jinzle

Strongly disagree. Neither Emma nor Hook was a Hero who scarificed. They were just cleaning up the mess they made. Rumple is in no way responsible for their actions. He did not betray them. I am disappointed that he was so insecure he thought he needed to take back the Darkness. The only person he betrayed was himself.

Austenphile

No he betrayed everyone by keeping the darkness alive when it could have been destroyed forever.

fox24

Exactly

I get that from Hook it was wiping your own mistake but not Emma. She made a mistake to make Hook a Do but she never wanted to open the portal to UW.

It is a sacrifice whether heroic or not to give up your life. both of them were offering themselves to end the darkness and thr definition of sacrifice is to offer your self there is no word "heroic" in it

CityGal

In the name of protecting everyone in the town from the evil of the Dark One, Emma was willing to offer herself as a sacrifice. By killing the Dark One with Excalibur it would have destroyed the Dark One power forever.

Rumple couldn't face life as a mortal man and orchestrated a way for to take back the evil power. For himself. Emma's death would have been for nothing. The fact that is was Hook, in the end, matters not. Killian, even as a Dark One, couldn't allow Emma to do it. So Hook willingly gave up the the most powerful magic in all the realms. He volunteered to destroy the evil power and himself for the greater good of everyone else.

Rumple denied that sacrifice. The Dark One with the power to harm and destroy others still exist. Rumple didn't do it to save Emma. He did it because he couldn't live as a mere mortal man. He lacked the courage to face life's challenges and the daily sacrifices it entails.

miss denton

Good episode. I liked the scene with Regina, her father and Henry.

livstevi21

This episode gave me so many Regina feels I can’t even. It was awesome to see more Evil Queen, this episode almost felt like the classic episodes of S1. To see Regina finally be able to apologise to her father, and for him to see how far she has come, a daughter he could be proud of and for her to see him go off to a better afterlife was so amazingly heartfelt, I couldn’t keep it in. I bawled so hard! It wrapped everything that I had wanted to see more of Regina’s relationship with her father so perfectly, it was a long time coming since S1. The Under-World is very creepy, but I loved how we got to see all these characters who died come back for this episode, and I presume, the rest of this season, as I’m guessing the Under-World is where we’ll be spending it. Cora. I gotta say, it was nice how Regina went to hug her mother…after everything that Cora did….I mean, she did die just before there was a chance of her actually being a good mother to Regina. Also, it really is a testament to how far Regina has come now that there were no rebuilt grudges against Mary Margaret, since she was the one who killed Cora. So the mission for this half of the season is to find Killian in the Underworld and bring him back, and to possibly help others find a better afterlife. And no guesses as to who rules the Underworld! Hades of course! Though I have to admit, when I was watching the episode it never clicked with me that it was Hades until his hair went blue! I watched the episode last week right after the previous episode and I meant to come here to share my thoughts on it but I was so wiped out I completely forgot. So the episode isn't as fresh in my memory now so I can't remember what else I wanted to say regarding the episode. Oh well. Now on to the next one!