PhoenixRising

Okay, wasn't the Battle of Bosworth field in a field and not a forest?

The battle is on! Richard's forces seem to have the upper hand.

So what will Lord Stanley do? And Henry really looks lost here. I'm starting to wonder if Henry Tudor won by sheer luck.

PhoenixRising

Yeah, but this is the board where we all ship a brother and sister.

Richard just got knocked off his horse! A horse! A horse! My kingdom for a horse!

This is where everything gets real Shakespearean.

Are those Stanley's troops riding into battle? Margaret is freaking out. Elizabeth seems more stoic, probably because she doesn't have a son fighting.

Nikki K

Double post again... ach

Nikki K

Yeah and I ship Giulia/Alessandro on 'Borgia'. That's fine with me. What makes this icky to me – as I have written in the post you quoted from but probably didn't read the rest is the fact that there is such an age gap. He is the adult and she is merely grown-up. Plus whatever he says in that scene his reasons were once nefarious. So it all rings so false and is totally appalling. Whereas CL and Giulia/Alessandro were always devoted to each other. In truth, the only reason why I stopped shipping CL on 'The Borgias' is because I started hating Holliday Grainger. So...

And yeah it was a field but I guess the forest made for better scenery.

PhoenixRising

Richard was killed in battle. All hail, King Henry VII!

Margaret must be over the moon now. Margaret Regina? Everyone will bow to her now as a Queen? Way to be humble, Margaret. Was this God's plan too?

Elizabeth's son, Richard of York, is home! But he has to forget about revenge for his brother Edward. Look what revenge did to all their families. Now Lizzie mourns her beloved "Uncle Richard," and her mother is telling her that she will now be Queen of England, as she once was. On to The White Princess!

Actually, there was supposed to be a second season based on The White Princess, but BBC One decided to drop the project. The producers went ahead with developing a second series and STARZ picked it up three years later. That's why they have an entirely different cast.

Nikki K

No, not a second season, never a second season. This miniseries was closed in itself. But yes, they started talking afterwards about developing 'The White Princess' as a mini-series but the BBC wasn't keen, probably because TWQ was super expensive and TWP is a really weak novel if we're honest. So Starz went ahead by itself... and three years later. See you at the Joanne thread.

PhoenixRising

Well, the article I read called it a second season. But it was going to be a direct continuation of TWQ using I assume the same actors. But because the BBC decided against developing it the project languished for years until STARZ picked it up. I'm assuming that's why the actors are all different. But it's clear from the first episode of TWP that they are continuing the narrative from TWQ, even recreating Lizzie's affair with Richard with that scene with Jodie Comer and some unknown actor portraying Richard. We only saw him from behind, but we didn't see his face. And his death on the battlefield was similar, albeit more gruesome.

Anyway, thanks so much for the great watch, Nina! And for watching it with me! The White Queen was a great series!

Nikki K

TWQ was developed by both BBC and Starz. In terms of viewing figures it was a great success for Starz but only a moderate one for the BBC in terms of what they put in. So Starz wanted to develop another miniseries based on TWP but the BBC wasn't keen. I remember that distinctly at the time. It's true that the long lapse in time has probably contributed to the actors not being available etc. but the article you read is incorrect insofar as they never planned on a second season as such. Believe me, I know it, I was there when it came out.

And yes, of course Starz would continue the narrative – it is based on a series of novels after all and that's what brought them the success in the first place. No surprise there.

Nikki K

Okay, so we're through – let's recap. What was your favourite part?

Mine was probably Margaret of Anjou mocking Warwick as he was groveling that he was misled by Edward and had always known that Henry VI was the rightful king and God had put Margaret by his side as his queen... "You're too trusting, Warwick. I've always thought it." – loved that quote.

But David was great throughout!

PhoenixRising

David was great, as usual. But George was yet another jerk, similar to Juan Borgia. David plays these guys really well. And he went right from The Borgias to The White Queen. But his craziness at the masked ball was epic. I remember thinking, "There's Juan, just like I remember!" Cesare would've killed him long before Edward did.

Yeah, that part with Margaret of Anjou mocking Warwick was great. Mine was when Elizabeth and Jacquetta conjured up a storm that knocked George around on the sea. And Elizabeth putting Isabel and Anne's mother in her place.

Oh, and here are a few other articles I found from BBC History:

Richard III was a “great king” who achieved more than the Elizabeths and Henry V | History Extra

6 myths about Richard III – the supposed murderer and usurper who wanted to marry his niece | History Extra

Nikki K

Yeah as I told you, there's this Richard III society with a bunch of people hell-bent on exonerating him... it sometimes takes on ridiculous proportions to be honest.

If you are really interested in the Princes in the Tower, I'd suggest you read Alison Weir's book. Her non-fiction is usually very balanced. She wrote a very interesting biography on Lizzie too btw.

And yes, every scene with Jacquetta was great – I love Janet McTeer. She was brilliant.

True about David being a bit type-cast though his character on "Victoria" is very different. I think that's something you could probably watch when TWP is over with the others?

I'm curious about his role on "The Living and the Dead" but I don't think anyone will watch that with me.

PhoenixRising

What is The Living and The Dead, Nina? What's that about?

And thanks for the recommendation. I never heard of the Princes in the Tower until now. And it's an eerie coincidence that Teddy would end up in the tower as well, along with that other guy who may or may not have been the real Prince Edward.

Yeah, David has gotten bit typecast, but it's his own fault for playing these roles so well. An arrogant, jealous, ambitious, buffoon who is insecure about living in the shadow of his brother. Is that Juan or George?

And just when I thought that Margaret Beaufort was pure evil on TWP, along comes Cecily Neville, Duchess of York.

Nikki K

David is in the last three episodes. I'd really like to watch it so... yeah...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Li...ead_(TV_series)

And I don't know... I mean in season 1 of "The Borgias" Juan had some quite sunny moments. George never really had that, he was always frustrated about not being Edward.

I'll have a look at my ebooks... give me a moment. And yes, right? I mean in some ways TWP picks up where TWQ left off but then the characterisation is often so different. Like Duchess Cecily...

PhoenixRising

That seems interesting. I'd watch it with you if I had it on On Demand.

Yeah, the casting isn't the only thing that's different, but maybe it's partly to do with having different actors. TWP is basically continuing the same story as TWQ, but it's also its own stand alone story.

Nikki K

Oh, you don't have it On Demand? That's too bad. I had hoped you might.

I sent you a PM btw regarding the books.

Yeah, I mean I get why they had to change certain things and it's not like Gregory was terribly consistent in her writing either so I don't hold it against them. I still like the casting on both shows. They did that very well, I thought.