Nikki K

Yeah, I was really really puzzled when Andy died and then I thought, maybe they bring him back somehow after all it's a show about the supernatural but nothing ever happened. I was glad though that they never gave Prue another (serious) love interest. That would have saddened me so much.

Yeah, I don't know... I mean Cole... was more Angelus than Angel, no? At least most of the time as I can remember.

Mary Boleyn, yes... I mean ulimately Elizabeth actually was very very fond her cousins... it is after all possible that Catherine Carey wasn't just her cousin but also her half-sister. Looking at the portraits you can definitely see the resemblance to the Tudors with the red hair etc. whereas Henry Carey was defintely the son of William Carey. In any event, no matter how Henry VIII may have felt about Anne, he would have never given Elizabeth into Mary's care... so yeah... Hollywood, eh.

Nikki K

Yeah, I was really really puzzled when Andy died and then I thought, maybe they bring him back somehow after all it's a show about the supernatural but nothing ever happened. I was glad though that they never gave Prue another (serious) love interest. That would have saddened me so much.

Yeah, I don't know... I mean Cole... was more Angelus than Angel, no? At least most of the time as I can remember.

Mary Boleyn, yes... I mean ulimately Elizabeth actually was very fond of her cousins... it is after all possible that Catherine Carey wasn't just her cousin but also her half-sister. Looking at the portraits you can definitely see the resemblance to the Tudors with the red hair etc. whereas Henry Carey was defintely the son of William Carey. In any event, no matter how Henry VIII may have felt about Anne, he would have never given Elizabeth into Mary's care... so yeah... Hollywood, eh.

BL.Arinna_1982

Yes! I meant Cole! How could I forget his name?! :faccepalm: But my main ship was Leo and Piper and I was happy that they were the endgame of the show.

Nikki K

The show didn't switch things around too much. That was certainly good in the sense of not so terribly confusing.

PhoenixRising

Hi, Nina!

I think I read somewhere that Andy was always supposed to die from the beginning, but I don't know why. And yeah, I'm also glad that Prue didn't get another love interest, but then Shannen Doherty got fired from the show before we could find out for sure.

Yeah, Cole was closer to his evil self than Angel was, but Angel used to be human and had a soul, and Cole was demon who was never human at all. And ultimately Cole succumbed to his evil nature. But Leo/Piper weren't perfect either. He had to leave Piper and their child because of some "whitelighter" nonsense, which probably had to do with the actor's availability... or perhaps his breakup with Alyssa Milano.

Yeah, that was stupid of the filmmakers. I guess they may have been trying to tie the movie to movie Elizabeth, about her legitimacy being in question. It's also the clichéd Hollywood thing to do, having he heir to the throne being taken away somewhere until they're ready to rule. And which one was Catherine Carey?

Nikki K

Yeah, that's a good point about Cole always being a demon. Then again I thought he had come a long way but I suppose either the actor wanted out or they wanted the show to go in a different direction? I thought it was rather in a okay 'whatever' fashion that they let him crash and burn and just be evil at the end.

No idea about Andy, it was a shame though because I thought he and Prue had great chemistry.

Catherine Carey was Mary Boleyn's daughter and quite possibly Henry VIII's. (Mary was his mistress after all before he dumped her for Anne.) The thing is, Catherine was a girl so there was no need for him to legitimise her as he did with Elizabeth Blount's son Henry Fitzroy. When you look at portraits of Catherine's daughter Lettice Knollys, you'll almost think you're looking at Elizabeth I. – so that always made me think it's more than the Boleyn side at play here.

BL.Arinna_1982

PhoenixRising

Awww, that's a cute pic of Oliver and Felicity, Arinna! But are they really a guilty pleasure?

Well, I think the actor who plaed Cole(Julian McMahon) was moving on to bigger and better things, first with the FX series Nip/Tuck, and then the Fantastic Four movies. And yes, it did seem like lazy writing letting him crash and burn like that.

Yeah, I thought it was a shame as well about Andy. It was really cruel to do that to Prue. They did seem made for each other.

Ohhh, okay. Thanks for explaining who Catherine Carey is. Wow, it seems like Henry VIII actually picked up some of his grandfather, Henry IV's, bad traits in that area. So what happened to her?

Nikki K

Ach...

Nikki K

Yeah, that's what I thought, Nip/Tuck probably got in the way of it for Cole/Phoebe.
Infinitely sad about Prue/Andy even after all these years.

No, I don't think Oliver/Felicity are a guilty pleasure. I would be very surprised if they weren't endgame on the show.

I think you mean Edward IV.? His other grandfather was Edmund Tudor.

Catherine Carey married Sir Francis Knollys. They had property in Berkshire and Oxfordshire. During Mary I. reign they lived in Germany as they were staunch Protestants. As Elizabeth I. came to the throne they both advanced at court – Catherine became the chief lady of the bed chamber to her cousin. Her husband was treasurer of Elizabeth's household. They has 14 children. One daughter was Lettice Knollys who later famously married Robert Dudley, a favourite of Elizabeth I. – which didn't make the latter too happy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lettice_Knollys ... in the BBC mini series "The Virgin Queen", where Anne-Marie Duff played Elizabeth I. (and Joanne Whalley played Mary I.), Lettice was played by Sienna Guillory.

BL.Arinna_1982

That part of the history isn't my forte.

Nikki K

I only dabble too, Arinna. What part of history are you really good at?

PhoenixRising

Yeah, I'm pretty sure that Julian wanted to move on from Charmed. I didn't even know he was on Charmed until after I saw the later episodes in reruns on TNT. I stopped watching the show when it was on WB after Prue died.

Yeah, I agree about Olicity. I just wish The Flash didn't disappoint me so much.

Yes, I meant Edward IV, Nina. Sorry, I had just typed Henry VIII and I repeated the name Henry by mistake. I meant Edward IV, obviously. He was cheating on Elizabeth Woodville all the time, apparently. I know little about Edmund Tudor other than what I read on Wikipedia. Although ironically, Edmund was also the name of the 1st Duke of York, brother of John of Gaunt, Duke of Lancaster, and of course the ancestor of Edward IV. And from what I've read about Edward III I'm not surprised that both the houses of York and Lancaster fought over the right to the crown of England as direct descendants of Edward III given how successful he was. 50 years as king?

I think you mean Edward IV.? His other grandfather was Edmund Tudor.

Ahhh, okay. Thanks for all that info, Nina. You're better than a history professor.

Nikki K

Because you know, Henry IV. may have married twice and his first marriage to Mary de Bohun was happy and very successful if I recall correctly, the second to Joan of Navarre more a political thing but I honestly cannot recall him having many or any mistresses actually. He was far too busy fighting rebellions in Wales and Northumberland.

I think the problem with Edward III was that (a) he loved his wife and they had too many children; (b) his reign was too long. It's cynical but that brought this whole succession crisis about. Probably also a bout of seeing his parents hating each other so much that he realised that's not how he wanted his marriage to be. I mean maybe I'm projecting ideas from this century into the Middle Ages though.

The premiere was kind of boring – the only thing I wonder about is what is going on with Caitlin. She seems to have made some sort of deal and is somewhat able to control the Killer Frost thing but not quite. But yeah, I was a bit whatever about it all.

PhoenixRising

Of course, Nina. I knew very little of Henry IV other than he was the first king of the House of Lancaster. As for Edward III having too many children, perhaps he wanted to repeat what his ancestor, William I, The Conqueror, did by having four sons and five daughters which ensured that every ruler of England would be descended from him. Even Elizabeth II, Prince Charles, and Princes William and Harry are descended from him. But you're also correct that in having so many children it can create battles over the line of succession, which is why the Wars of the Roses began between the York and Lancaster houses, which ended with the Tudors.

Caitlin is by far my favorite character now. I used to like Barry, but I just hate what the writers have done to him now. I heard Caitlin is tending bar now? She's a biochemist and a physicist and she's serving drinks in a tank top? And "someone" with no qualifications in any scientific area is running the show at STAR Labs? Okay, I'm just gonna remain silent about this. I probably won't even watch the show anymore. I'm gonna stick to Arrow and Legends of Tomorrow.