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Fan Forum Legend
 
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{Cesare ♥ Lucrezia} #52 ~ "Don't you love God, Cesare?" - Lucrezia; "More than I love you?" - Cesare
Welcome to the 52nd Cesare ღ Lucrezia Appreciation Thread  If you are a fan and not yet on the list, let us know and you'll be added immediately. 
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 Credit: May ~Quotes~ Lucrezia: "Don't hate me." Cesare: "I regret many feelings towards you, hate is not one of them." Cesare: "The whole world whispers, you and I are lovers. Should we prove them right?" Lucrezia: "I want to die, brother." Cesare: "Will you not talk like that, please!" Cesare: "Can I hold him?" Lucrezia: "And wake him? That would be cruelty indeed." Cesare: "I must hold you then." Lucrezia: "But we never before had secrets between us." Cesare: "Some things are better left unsaid." Lucrezia: "So I must divine then, the dark cloud on my brother's soul." Cesare: "You are criminally well informed, sis. But I trust your soul is still of the purest white." Lucrezia: "You will be a handsome Cardinal. Let me hug you!" Cesare: "Lucrezia, sister, share my fortune and my fate. And remember that wherever I may be, a part of me will always be yours." Lucrezia: "As I also belong to you, brother." Lucrezia: "No one here loves me as I was loved by you. I've tried everything, Cesare. No one wants to hear our name." Lucrezia: "My soul dies when I imagine never seeing you again." Cesare: "Lucrezia, Lucia, forgive me. All will be well if you forgive me. But you must live, sweet sister, live. We are one blood, one heart, one spirit." Lucrezia: "Cesare, love me!" Cesare: "For all eternity. Cesare: "Cesare Borgia and Lucrezia, we shall be remembered. Be faithful only to me not to him, the unholy father who prays to a nameless god. You shall have the world, not the hereafter. And your name eternal." Lucrezia: "I shall be duchess of Ferrarra, it's enough for me." Cesare: "In name but nothing more." Lucrezia: "In name and nothing more." Cesare: "I promised you a heart, sister." Lucrezia: "Whose? Your own?" Lucrezia: "What does it say of us, brother, that you promise me this and I would accept?" Lucrezia: "Cesare? I would ask you something.” Cesare: “Then ask and it is yours.” Lucrezia: “I would ask you to marry me.” Cesare: “As you wish. My word is my word. We shall run away. Change our names, perhaps. Live out our days in some small fishing village by the coast. where no one will ever guess who we once were.” Lucrezia: "To Alfonso." Cesare: "Yes, yes, I know." Cesare: "My love for my sister outweighs my grief for my brother." Cesare: "Are you a shepherd of souls now? Lucrezia: "And I see before me a lost sheep." Cesare: "Utterly lost, my love." Lucrezia: "Then, by hook or by crook I shall save you. You may kiss my ring!" Cesare: "Don't I know how to organize a party for my sister?" Lucrezia: "Thank you, Cesare!" Cesare: "And I think I've done well. Look. I'm the one who chose the guests." Lucrezia: "They're all courtesans." Cesare: "Did you desire monks and nuns?" Lucrezia: "Oh, no! No formalities!" Lucrezia: "So then, I shall become a nun. For I shall never love a husband as I love you, Cesare." 
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Past Threads {01}{02}{03}{04}{05}{06}{7}{8}{9}{10}{11}{12}{13}{14}{15}{16}{17}{18}{19}{20}{21}{22}{23}{24}{25}{26}{27}{28}{29}{30} {31}{32}{33}{34}{35}{36}{37}{38}{39}{40}{41}{42}{43}{44}{45}{46}{47}{48}{49}{50}{51}   Credit __________________
In Loving Memory of Christine Dettloff(cheekymonkey503).  Rest In Peace, Dear Cheekymonkey. ~ Alex |
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Obsessed Fan
 
Joined: May 2018
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TFTNT Alex! And I'm happy you used my suggestion for the thread title
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You're welcome, Lila!
It was a good title. __________________
In Loving Memory of Christine Dettloff(cheekymonkey503). Rest In Peace, Dear Cheekymonkey. ~ Alex |
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tftnt, Alex!
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#5 | |||
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Obsessed Fan
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 5,358
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I remember reading older posts complaining that Ces didn't declare his love for Lu like she did for him when she asked, "Where is your love for me?" and then cried out to him, "I love you!" in s3e4. It's a woman thing, I think, that we wanted to hear him say those 3 words after they had sex. Thinking about it from Ces' POV, as a man and with his stoic character, he didn't feel those words were necessary. It probably didn't even occur to his masculine mind that she might've wanted to hear them  He felt that telling her he would've killed the king, violently ripping his heart out of his body, but didn't for the good of the family - which included her - was proof of his love.He had verbalized his deep love for her many times: "Don't you love God, Cesar? More than I love you? Did Abelard and Heloise love each other? With a love as PURE and ALL-CONSUMMING as the love of God. If anything happened to her, I'd die." His actions showed his love for her: Hatching up the idea for her annulment to Sforza when she told him about the baby and then carrying out the plan. Keeping his promise to her by murdering Sforza - at great risk to himself. (That rash action imperiled the family and forced Lu into another marriage for an alliance, but Ces was blinded by love and didn't think things through). And last, but not least, killing Alfonso and taking Lu for himself. So while he didn't utter the words, "I love you", his actions proved his love for her. Anyone can say the words, but Ces was a man of action and his actions were proof. Last edited by Mignonette; 02-20-2019 at 03:51 PM |
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#6 | |||
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Fan Forum Legend
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You're welcome, Arinna!
You're welcome, Lila! Oh, I understand that part, Lila. I did figure that it was a thing with Lucrezia that was more about her emotions and not really about her questioning Cesare's love for her. She was just really angry, not just at him, but the entire situation because, as usual, both she and Cesare were once again at the mercy of their father's position as Pope. And perhaps Cesare didn't feel the words were necessary because while he was also a puppet for his father's schemes, he didn't have to suffer nearly as much as Lucrezia. But yes, he finally did tell her those things as affirmation of his love for her. Oh, I always knew that he would eventually kill Sforza for that. Even though that's not what happened in the history, on the show there's no way anyone does that to Lucrezia and lives. You're right, after bedding Caterina and killing Giovanni, Cesare had to fight his way out of Forli with that knife with Giovanni's blood that he wanted to give Lucrezia. That was awesome.__________________
In Loving Memory of Christine Dettloff(cheekymonkey503). Rest In Peace, Dear Cheekymonkey. ~ Alex |
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#7 | |||
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Sforza has it coming since the beginning.
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#8 | |||
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Obsessed Fan
Joined: May 2018
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 that smug look off his face at their wedding and knew from the way he spoke to Lu that he would mistreat her. Cesar knew it, too. You could tell from the way he kept sneering at Sforza while dancing with Lu. I really wish he’d been the one to take Lu’s virginity (as he did in The Family & hopefully did IRL). I don’t care at all that it was incest: Ces loved her and a woman’s first time - especially at such a very young age - can affect the way she views love, sex, men, and herself as a woman for the rest of her life. |
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#9 | |||
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I know that in real life he was totally different and kind of a wimp, but the Giovanni Sforza on the show was just made for the audience to hate him and want Cesare to kill him. They foreshadowed Cesare doing that very thing with his "ungallant" promise to Lucrezia in 'The Moor' in season 1. And you're right, this is why I actually like the idea of Cesare taking Lu's virginity in The Family, to make sure that her memory of her first time was with Cesare.  __________________
In Loving Memory of Christine Dettloff(cheekymonkey503). Rest In Peace, Dear Cheekymonkey. ~ Alex |
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I've actually stopped reading The Family up until that moment.
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#11 | |||
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Fan Forum Legend
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You didn't real all of it, Arinna?
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In Loving Memory of Christine Dettloff(cheekymonkey503). Rest In Peace, Dear Cheekymonkey. ~ Alex |
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#12 | |||
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Obsessed Fan
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 5,358
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 The first time I read it, Rodrigo's involvement in Cesar's deflowering of Lu creeped me out. Not because it was his idea for Ces to do it, but because he participated in it by guiding Ces' hands over her naked body giving her pleasure and then watching them. But after reading it through again and thinking about it, it didn't feel like Rodrigo was being voyeuristic. Lu asked him to be there and even though Ces, at 17, had already been with many women, he didn't know anything about pleasing a woman. When they'd both undressed, Ces jumped on Lu and scared her, so Rodrigo stepped in to teach Ces how to please a woman and treat her with tenderness. If Rodrigo hadn't taught Ces how to truly MAKE LOVE to her, I doubt Lu would've fallen in love with him - or vice versa - because the experience wouldn't have had triggered those feelings for them. It would've just been sex and Lu would've been scared and probably resented the whole experience. I think it's really really easy for some people (not us shippers ) to just focus on the sex or the incest, but to do that misses the point and the depth of what was happening. Rodrigo intended for Lu to bond so strongly to Ces that he'd always have her primary loyalty. He knew that the man who took a woman's virginity assumed a powerful position in her life.But what Rodrigo didn't think about was how taking Lu's virginity would affect Ces! He'd only thought about it affecting Lu. After they'd made love (to the point of exhaustion ), Lu thanked Ces and told him she loved him more than anything. Ces didn't say anything, but the way he looked at her startled Rodrigo, because it was the look of a man utterly and completely lost in love with a woman Two of my favorite lines from The Family summed it up perfectly: Love EMPOWERS a woman, but IMPERILS a man. Lucrezia loved with a heart full enough to tame the wildest beast, so without knowing it, she became the WHIP. |
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#13 | |||
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Fan Forum Star
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And like I've said, that was the last thing I've read.
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#14 | |||
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Fan Forum Legend
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Wait, Rodrigo had to teach Ces how to make love to Lu, Lila?
 Man, I thought that Rodrigo had Ces make love to Lu because he just knew that Ces had what it took. I don't like the idea of Rodrigo guiding Cesare's hands over her body, though.  But yeah, I do think that some people miss the depth of Ces and Lu's relationship and just focus on the incest, like they were the Lannisters or something. But it goes way beyond that with Ces and Lu.  __________________
In Loving Memory of Christine Dettloff(cheekymonkey503). Rest In Peace, Dear Cheekymonkey. ~ Alex |
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#15 | |||
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Obsessed Fan
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 5,358
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He told Lucrezia of his plan and she agreed with it. He gave her the choice of which of her brothers she wanted to take her virginity. As he's talking to them, she's leaning on Ces' shoulder while Juan is by himself She and Ces are already very close, so it was no surprise that she chose him. Rodrigo had her take off all her clothes (she was only 13, but that's the IRL age she married Sforza  ). Juan wasn't allowed to be there. She asked Rodrigo and Cesar if they thought her body was beautiful and of course, they both said yes. Cesar took off his clothes and it was very obvious that he found Lu's body attractive  He was so excited that he literally pushed Lu onto the bed and jumped on top of her, scaring her and making her cry out to Rodrigo for help Oh Ces....  Rodrigo scolded Ces that although he'd been with many women at age 17, he had no idea how to pleasure them. Ces was angry, but so young that his lust wasn't...softened Rodrigo put his hand over Ces' and stroked Lu's breasts and ***** giving her an orgasm and then told Ces to be gentle, but to "take her" - which he did - several times until they were both exhausted and satisfied, lying cuddled in each other's arms.Like I said, it sounds so creepy to read, but if Rodrigo hadn't intervened and taught Ces how to make love to a woman, I doubt Ces & Lu would've fallen in love they way they did. Mario Puzo did years of research on the Borgias and I wonder how much of his book was based on what he'd learned and then assimilated into the story. It was fiction, but I know from my own research that it was pretty factual throughout. Last edited by Mignonette; 02-24-2019 at 04:02 PM |
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