lisalu

You have to remember most TVD fans just watch the show every week and don't read spoilers or boards where serious fans speculate everything that is going to happen. I think most of the posters on here and others boards are tired of the storyline or the show in general because they spend so much time analyzing every little aspect of the show. My friends in real life that I talk to about the show still love it and don't have a problem with the story lines. They just enjoy the twists and turns and don't get bent out of shape when something happens they don't like. i.e. Stelena, Delena etc...

Also, I don't see how they can go by ratings these days for how popular a show is. I dvr almost everything and watch it when I have the time and so do most of my family
and friends.

Jaime Bee

I think most casual viewers do watch for entertainment but pay attention enough to whether what they watch makes sense.

I know the ratings system is outdated but that's still what they use it says that the people that watch at the time it's on is decreasing more and more.

I don't have anything else to add. We could go back and forth more about all this but I don't see the point.

Touldengal

Yeah, I think people do pay attention to what makes sense... Like the fact that Matt and Jeremy were immune from what the travelers were doing, but tbh, 90% of the time when I come here and read about certain plot holes, I didn't notice at all. Not only about this show, but any show. I just don't pay extra attention.
Obviously when it's something so outright ridiculous, people will notice it.

These days, netflix has been really good with updating their content. I started many series on there and only had the current ones to watch, which was made available not long after the seasons ended.

Many tv actors have referenced Netflix/Hulu and what it means to their shows. It's a huge factor to their networks. Anyways, you're right. No point in talking in circles.

Forwood4Bamon

so stefan/death scene wth? and I love tyler. flawless as always.

LabuanPearl88

Finally I was able to re-watch the episode!! I loved it very much, very emotional in many parts (Stefan!!!! ) and I’m actually enjoying the travellers SL, they can be very badass So curious about the finale, can’t wait for it!


Liv/Luke: I like them, I didn’t think I would haved, but I do They have that annoying witches’ attitude of feeling superior, but I like that they both have no remorse to kill people in order to protect their own magic, but at the same time they have a conscience that made them feel sorry for Stelena anyway Wonder if they’ll stay longer, I wouldn’t mind, they can familiarize with MF’s people very well for me


The travellers: oh, thank God, finally some villains bloody, with no remorse, selfish and whatever! Say whatever you want, but Markos is smarter than he seemed to at first, and I actually enjoy his character, he’s badass, mean, I’d like to see what he can do with all the full power, but at the same time it’d be our gang is dead, so better he doesn’t Also I find the travellers very creepy with this obsession with blood, ugh Maria wasn’t so special for me to say I’m sorry she’s gone, it’s just a pity because she could have helped

About the plot-holes, I think that technically Matt would be alive anyway: yeah the magical ring’s power that brought him back from the dead is nullified by the travellers’ spell, but so is also the reason Matt died in the first place, so he should be alive. Not sure if this makes sense For Jeremy it should be the same, but he actually died for un-supernatural reasons in season2 (Liz shot him), so yeah, he should be dead, maybe he didn’t show symptoms, like Caroline, because he was away from MF and the spell hadn’t reach him yet


Bonnie: kind of like her in this episode, not as boring as usual, especially in the last scene with Stefan and Enzo


Tyler: I fear he’ll be gone for good this time


Caroline: the “lollipop” comment made me laugh so much I liked she made herself useful to find a solution for Tyler and for everyone when she discovered the truth from Bonnie, and that at the same time she was freaking out, it was real, I like this kind of things Perfect in the end with dead!Stefan Also, I like Stelena’s talk about her and her positivism, it’s the part I like about Caroline


Enzo: I don’t get why he committed suicide if he wants so much to live It was pointless Still hope he’ll survive somehow


Elena: standing ovation for have spit in Markos’ face, you go warrior princess!! I hate to see her torture, dried, and spitting water, it’s painful to see her like this, she never can catch her breathe As I wrote before, I liked her speech with Stefan about Caroline, it was cute and honest about her friend, also she made me laugh when she tried to hitch a ride and to use the sling, cutie baby girl


Damon: omg, I love when he’s all torture!mode and sassy and snarky, the note left to Markos made me laugh so much His plan wasn’t the best, IMA, he should have thought Markos was smarter and not so easy to be defeated!! Oh well, he tried... His lost expression when he felt the shoot that had killed him again and had to leave his house made me feel for him, he looked defeated and lost


Stefan: Probably it’s because I don’t read spoilers anymore, and even if there were rumors, I was still shocked by his death I’m sure he’ll be back, probably already in the next episode, but still, it was painful to see, he protected Caroline with his own life Liked his speech about vampires being toxic anyway, showed a mature attitude, they need to stop to care about morals so much


Defan: bickering and basically saying “ILY” to each other on the phone… I reached Nirvana! Now I’m waiting to see Damon devastated for his baby bro’s death, it’s going to hurt so much


Stelena: I enjoyed their scenes, they were both funny (the sling one and Stefan practically rolling his eyes when she hitched a ride ) and sweet (their talk on the road) But stop torture and hurt them, stay away from them!!


Steroline: Stefan saying good things about her character was so sweet And the final scene… OMG, it was emotional, he kept his promise to keep her safe until the very end! And Caroline’s terrified screams still makes me wanna cry, she was so shocked and in pain, holding him in the end


Delena: awkward moment when everyone in MF wants them back so we can all stop with the drama! Love their last scene, the parallelism with the previous episode and especially Elena taking charge of the situation, kissing him And those idiot, happy smiles….

Touldengal

Didn't a traveler kill Matt? It's not witch magic, it's "pure" magic so it should have stuck IMO.

LabuanPearl88

You mean the one in Liz's body? Yeah, you're right, didn't think about that, or I considered it only as magic, without distinguish the two kind of magic

Well, then IDK, I guss it's a plothole after all as always and my ideas don't work, frankly it's not a big deal to me, got used to those and I don't care so much

naturellebella

Matt has been dying so much this season that I can't remember if that was his first time. I think the first person to kill Matt was Silas - he snapped his neck in True Lies when he found out that Gregor was inside of him. I think the latest one was when Sheriff Forbes\Traveller stabbed him in the neck. Both times he came back because of the ring. Since we saw Damon, Elena and Stefan re-enact their first death, I think the death that would be used on Matt is the snapped neck. I mean, if the reason he is alive is because of the ring which was spelled by witches, he should be about to die as well.

Also in Season 3, he drowned himself to see Vicki on the other side. I don't think that one counts though because he didn't come back because of the ring. He came back because Bonnie gave him CPR.

HappySquared

Oh dear. That episode made me reminisce their first deaths. Good catch re: plotholes.

I am not surprise that they'd kill a major character, in this point it is Stefan. The whole idea of bringing back someone from the otherside is the entire season's plot anyway so it's kinda predictable that Stefan will surely come back.

Love the DE scenes and Stefan's comment on how they can't live with each other. Knock some sense on Damon's mind.

DollyJfan4life

The first person to kill Matt was Damon.

HappySquared

Kem it was in Come Undone when Matt was first killed and got resurrected by "magic." Damon snapped Matt's neck to bring Elena's humanity back. He was wearing the ring then that's why he came back.

HappySquared

naturellebella

Oh yeah! I forgot about that one. See there's too many, leave Matty Blue Blue alone well then it's still a snap of the neck and still saved by the ring spelled by a witch so why isn't he also dying again like DES? Same like Jeremy - snapped neck, brought back by a ring. If they want to say it's only supernatural beings this happens to well Jeremy is a hunter.

LabuanPearl88

They said Markos' spell is about un-doing all the "contaminated" magic the witches made, as such as the rings, the vampirism, ect etc... Undoing the rings magic should make dead the person who wore it at the moment of the death. But since the cause of the death was magic itself, the person should also be alive, like it never happened. With Matt it should work this way, but as it was pointed out, Matt was also killed by a traveller (the one in Liz's body), which is "pure" magic, so it shouldn't be undone: so Matt should be dead or, at least, he should have experimented the reason of that death, as Elena, Stefan, Damon and Tyler did Either we consider the traveller's stuff magic too, so it has to be undone, or it's a plothole in the end

About Jeremy, probably it was because he wasn't in MF and the spell didn't reach him as it didn't reach Caroline Because, annulling every kind of supernatural death or supernatural destiny he got, he still died by Liz's hand in 2x22 and was brought back by magic

I don't know what to say, right now it doesn't even matter anymore because the spell is broken, so they're all safe right now

FooFoo

I did not view Matt & Jeremy as plotholes because once they were brought back from the dead, they were on their own...witch magic is not keeping them alive. It was a moment. Unlike the vampires, whose lives continually rely on a spell and magic.