Butterflies18

Exactly!

thentheresbadwabbit

what did you guys think about andy in this episode? she wanted to be there for damon

Ezsmerelda

I loved andy, she was so nice! and it was so sad when she was crying after damon bit her you know, i usually love damon no matter what, but i gotta say, the things he was doing/saying in this ep kinda bothered me

tragedy

ITA w/you! I think Damon has shown his capacity to care a great deal about others he's shown that he cares for Alaric, Stefan, Liz & especially Elena. During the moment you mentioned Damon had Elena's necklace & she was completely vulnerable to compulsion. He could've compelled her to do whatever he wanted but he didn't. So not only did he back off b/c of Stefan but he didn't take advantage of her. If he was only about himself he could've taken advantage of the situation but he didn't, that was pure selflessness right there.

Schumiac

Elijah mentions how he had the means to save the doppelganger but unfortunately Katherine decided to take matters into her hands and we know that resulted in her becoming a vampire and all her loved ones killed. I wonder if that is a parallel for Katherine/Elena, Elijah/Damon as this episode Elena decided to not trust Damon to handle things but rather took things into her own hands, and made a deal with Elijah (the devil?) and maybe that will turn out to be "unfortunate" too.

I like Elijah A LOT as a character but I don't think he is trustworthy and I think Elena is taking a huge risk (and not just for herself but everyone) by trusting him and Damon had every right to be angry about that and want to stop that. She undid everything Damon has been trying to do to save her and left them all at Elijah's mercy - took away the house they were safe in, took away their surprise "weapon" by revealing Bonnie is alive and well. Damon is not powerful enough to fight Elijah. Especially not when Elena is totally supporting Elijah and Stefan will do whatever Elena tells him to. He is all alone right now and without options. So, he didn't give the apology and he makes his stand on this be known (he doesn't agree) but he also knows he is powerless to do anything about it now. It is out of his hand (until some opportunity rises I guess).

What exactly did Elena have to "trust" Elijah? Because he is a noble man and a man of his word? We are talking about the same Elijah who:
1) after making Rose and Trevor spend hundred of years trying to make amends to him, tricked them into believing he was going to spare them only to off Trevor's head on a technicality
2) killed Vampedia just because (could easily compell he guy to forget about the doppelganger and never mention it etc.) -and got a kick out of it by using compulsion to make him off himself but Elena would not know about that bit
3) was initially trying to trick her when they were making a deal, after pretty much force-arming her into making a deal with him by threatening her family
4) was dead-set on sacrificing her

I like Elijah as a character. But I don't see how he didn't go on a killing rampage to acquire Elena before necessarily is "proof" he will do things Elena's way and is completely trustworthy and has no hidden agendas himself. What, because he told her a "story" this episode he is all of a sudden the best ally ever? I think in her willingness to find any other means to kill Klaus Elena chose to completely believe in Elijah and as such gave him the upper hand over them all.

If we look into his words this episode:
1) He said a witch can kill Klaus when he is at his weakest. He NEVER said anything about the witch surviving himself. The "witch can kill Klaus" bit they always knew. It was what they were operating on.
2) He said he knew of a way to save the doubleganger. We didn't hear him "promise" to save the doppelganger or explain how ("turning" the doppelganger may also be considered saving her). We know he never got to "test" whether his means to save worked and we don't know what it requires. I'm sure there is a catch with it.
3) He only promised no harm should come Salvatores by "his hands". Word choice always matters for Elijah. That is not protecting he'll keep them all safe. That is him saying harm won't come from his hands. It leaves the door open for him to have someone else harm them (be it someone working for him or Klaus) or he can take things even so far as to say his "hands" are not doing the harming as in he is not using his hands.
4) There are no promises made for general protection. So, once he is done killing Klaus (IF it is indeed what he plans) it still leaves him free to hunt them all down in revenge.
5) Elena gave away the one weapon they had against an Original - the dagger. Given Bonnie will be using her powers to take Klaus down, she'll be de-powered afterwards. So once Klaus is gone, there is no one who is more powerful than Elijah and they have no means to harm him as their one weapon is not in his possession.

And I'm not satisfied with Elijah's story. Why did he turn on his brother exactly? From what we can see, he was going to let Katherine be sacrificed in the end but Katherine ran away, thus screwing things up between him and Klaus, who blamed Elijah for it. He promises Klaus he'll get her back and we know he was in the search party. Who is to say he is not actually trying to get back on Klaus' good side by delivering on his promise where he brings Klaus back both Katherine and the doppelganger as he promised once? Katherine sure was trying to get back on Klaus' good side by doing the same (letting him have his sacrifice) and Elijah has the whole "brother" thing going on.

When Elijah is outside the Salvatore house, his first instinct was to attack Elena (but was stopped due to the invitation thing). Through out the episode he makes pointed references about how they (and she) betrayed him, like when he mentions they killed him twice, that he still feels a bit dead, that he won't make the same mistake he did with Katherine... So I really don't think a day out in the park and Lockwood mansion with the youngest Petrova descendant all of a sudden made him "Team save Elena and her loves oness". I really think he is up to something and I agree that the "apology" was a test to see if all of them would be blindly following his orders and trusting him but of course Damon will not. Which, I don't think he is surprised about. It does make me worry for Damon a bit, though...

At the start of the episode, when Andie and Damon are kissing Damon asks her how her shoulder is as he wants to feed from her. She tells him it is messy and asks him to go for a blood bag that day and he does as she says. It is so eerie but was yet another point that showed Damon's treatment of Andie is not as bad as his treatment of Caroline and he showed more care toward her. I think what makes his relationship to it so disturbing is the "caring" bit. I think when he was just being a "mean vampire" as he was with Caroline, it was easy to write it off as something vampires do and a villainous act. But with Andie, although he doesn't see her as a real relationship, there is something of a confidante/friendship/caring thing going on there that is hard to describe and that little bit makes the relationship come off as more intimate and thus more disturbing even though his "treatment" overall has improved.
I think the reason why Andie "loves" Damon may also have to do with that. Except for the biting and compulsion they have a relationship as far as she is concerned, in which Damon is very open with her, pours his heart out to her, shares his secrets, goes to lunches and social events with her etc. Compulsion means she doesn't mind the vampire parts so when left to her own devices, she doesn't think bad of Damon because of those bits. She judges him only one the other "relationship" part... And that is why when he told her to go, she rather went upstairs to surprise him and tell him she loves him and is there for him etc.

Where was Jenna after finding out about vampires and she was in Salvatore house? She was sleeping in the house, when Damon and Stefan were fighting and Damon was biting Andie? Man, is she a heavy sleeper...

ring of fire

I loved this episode. It was really good and it provided some good answers.

Klaus story is a million times better than I expected and I can't wait to see more of him. Now we got the answer on why he wants to get the curse broken and why he's the most powerful. Also I love the fact that he seems to be very cold and selfish. I don't mind having someone like that. But I'm sure he wasn't like that always. Probably finding out his father wasn't his real father and that he was a weird hybrid monster helped it to make him that way.

Stefan & Damon's fight was better than I expected. I thought it was going to be contrived and stupid but it made sense. It had build up and all the tension between them finally explode. It was going to happen soon or later.
Elijah looked so hurt when he saw them. It's obvious that he sees in them some of what happened between him and Klaus.

Elijah awful wig distracted me in half of the time in the flashbacks

I'm so glad Damon didn't kill Andie. I didn't want him to take ten steps back AGAIN. Also I like Andie, she's nice and she seemed to really care about him.

TYLER IS BACK NEXT WEEK!!! I can't wait!!!!!

Brucas <3

Stefan is the one who brought up 'being in love with Elena' and how it's good because at least he's helping him keep her safe. He said exactly that. Stefan is the one who egged him on this entire episode, Stefan does not own Elena and it's fine if he backs her up but he shouldn't try to control Damon' actions especially if his intentions are good. Everything Damon has done so far, even if Elena didn't like it, has helped keep her safe and alive, Stefan should be thankful. IMO, Stefan is insecure about Damon's feelings for Elena, that is why he kept pushing his buttons this episode. Stefan says he'll always protect Elena, but Damon is the one who is actually doing it.

THIS THIS THIS

Brucas <3

especially the bolded

semmanclana

Stefan has been more than easy on Damon. He let's his brother get away with crap because he loves him. He can't kill him because he cares about Damon. Damon is the one that hardly shows his love for Stefan. Damon started that argument by bringing up the fact that Stefan should be grateful for Andie because she's keeping him from going after his gf! Damon was such a child in this episode cause he wasn't getting his way. Stefan isn't insecure, he knows Elena is in love with him only.

Stefan isn't looking to just protect Elena, but protect EVERYONE else she loves. Damon is just looking out for Elena which means letting Bonnie die which Stefan doesn't want cause she's not only his friend but knows it'll kill Elena.

Schumiac

Actually, Stefan started the argument when he took a dig at Damon about Andie. Damon warned him to leave him alone but he wouldn't cut it and did his usual "lecturing" thing. That is when the argument escalated. To me it showed one of the fundamental problems between Damon and Stefan. Stefan is always so busy to criticize Damon and tell him how he is screwing up that he misses the chance to realize what his brother is really going through and try to reach out to him and even help him somehow. Damon telling Andie is "his distraction" was a hint at the inner struggle he is in. A struggle Stefan has been mostly oblivious and therefore unhelpful with. Instead of turning his back to leave Damon be as he mutters some more "lecturing" sentences like "she is a person, you are victimizing her" after than "distraction" comment if Stefan would rather try to stay and have a conversation with his brother without feeling the need to scold him and put him down, things may work out better. It may not work that well the first time but in time it should work and these boys need "conversations" with one another. Not bickering, not lectures but conversations. Stefan giving Damon lectures each time and just leaving the room when he is done with his scolding is not going to achieve anything. Definitely won't be bringing them any closer anytime soon...

I get it that the writers want some animosity between the brothers but I don't see why it has to be ALL there is between them and we can't have them having normal conversations (as in more than 2 sentences! Them muttering 2 sentences each about whether or not if Katherine is dead is NOT satisfactory to me!) or even heart-to-heart ones like the one Damon gave Stefan when he was suicidal.

You can't kill me!

Damon was childish and utterely ridiculous in this episode!! I love that Stefan finally snarked back at him... Damon had it coming and I personally can't wait for more of Stefan standing up to his ass of a brother.

ღMitra

Exactly Well put.

moonlightstar

Tia i love you SO MUCH WORD

sunchick116

there comes a time when there is no excuse for your behavior anymore. Damon's not 22 anymore. identity crisis and insecurity is not a reason to treat people the way he does. fear should not be confused for respect, but Damon does. he thinks because people smile and nod at him, they respect him, when they really don't, they just don't have a death wish. He's like a child you pacify to avoid a tantrum. when damon stops acting like a child, stefan and everyone else will stop treating him like one.

Schumiac

Just because Stefan made a childish claim during a bickering fight with his brother that Elena respects him and not Damon doesn't mean people do not respect Damon. Stefan was doing what brothers do, know the other's weak spot and attack it. Elena does respect Damon. There is a reason those two "clash" over opinions, they usually EXCHANGE opinions and argue over them, trying to convince each other. Like peers do. And there is a reason Damon is usually the go-to guy whenever they get in trouble or threatened. Just last episode Bonnie was seeking out HIS opinion, trusting HIM to make the right call and save the day. And Bonnie who can take on Klaus at the moment, certainly is not "afraid" of Damon. She wasn't asking him for his opinion out of fear, it was out of respect. Grudging, maybe, as she doesn't "like" him, but the respect is there. She knows he is intelligent and cunning and their best bet to save the day that day.

Damon's "struggle" is the one he has between his vampiric urges and humanity and handling it all. Stefan antagonizing and putting distance between them doesn't help as Stefan is the most likely to understand what he is feelings going through. Damon doesn't need Stefan to boost his ego as I don't think he seeks his little brother's approval or anything. But "support" is always good. Having someone to talk to, who can help him through what he is going through right now who has been there, done that.

And I didn't find Damon childish this episode, he was furious. He was angry because they have only one shot at taking Klaus down, and that requires Bonnie being safe and sound and them taking him by surprise. What did Elena do? She went behind Stefan and Damon's backs and revived Elijah (the guy who was trying to see her sacrificed and they have no reason to really trust who is as much a threat as Klaus), disappeared with him for the day and Stefan did nothing, like this was the most normal, coolest thing ever and was trying to stop him from doing anything too. And in the end of the day, he found out that Elena "invited" Elijah into their own house, the one place that was supposed to be "safe" from Elijah, Klaus and the like without even bothering to ASK them about it (she just enabled Elijah to kill them whenever he feels like it) and just tried to order him around telling him from now on they'd be doing things Elijah's way because she trusts him (for no good reason) and she has told Elijah everything so the whole "Bonnie is safe and sound and the secret weapon" bit is out of the door too. And to top it all they expected him to apologize to the man, because how dare Damon try and protect Elena and take out the man who was trying to sacrifice her. How offensive and rude of him. Sure, Elijah needs an apology.... Damon is not a child who can be ordered around, who needs to get other's approval constantly and he will not do something he doesn't believe in. He is not going to bow down to Elena's "orders" especially when her decisions are so questionable and he is not going to kiss Elijah's ass just because he is more powerful and Elena demands it be kissed. "Doing what you are told" doesn't mean your are being mature and acting adult.

Elena actually happens to know when you "talk" with Damon like an adult, that is when he listens to someone more. That is why she is always more successful in reaching out to him as she can be quite mature when she wants. It IS all about how you approach someone. Approach Damon like the adult he is, and he listens to you. Try to order him around, or run around all scared and freaking out with your decisions not making sense as you "demand" people obey you without really providing them a good enough reason and, no, he won't bow down and he will not listen to you, or enable you. He may love you more than anyone else, but that doesn't mean he'll just turn a blind eye when you are doing something wrong, or being irrational and will just go along with it because he is so afraid to stand up to you and anger you. That doesn't make him childish. People liking "obedient" people is not people having respect for them. Obedient people don't get into arguments with others, given what they do is "follow". You have clashes between leaders. Which is why Elena/Elijah and Damon are odds as decision makers. And why it doesn't sit well with Damon what she has done and he won't accept it.


As for Damon and Stefan. Both can do the childish bickering and Stefan does his best to get a rise out of Damon which is not mature, either. There is a reason he does it ONLY when Elena is not around, he knows that would never go down well with her as it makes him look bad. The difference is Damon is always who he is, he doesn't have to put on a "proper" face for some people knowing some of his actions may not be A-OK with them. That, also, doesn't make him childish.

Btw, I find it interesting that last episode Stefan was making an issue out of being included in the decision making process of Damon and Bonnie's "last minute emergency plan on the go" which they really didn't have time or opportunity to "share" with anyone before they put it into motion. But this episode he is completely cool with Elena leaving him completely out of the loop and going off to make a deal with Elijah on her own and coming back to force it on them (as inviting Elijah in was pretty much taking their right to an opinion on the matter from them)?