[MistyMountainHop]

You can talk about anything here as long as it has to do with That 70s Show!

Previous thread here.

[MistyMountainHop]

Originally Posted by FuriosityShell (View Post) I didn't mean to call Donna a bitch. I just meant to say she had bitchy moments. In Baby Fever, while Eric was being chauvinistic in expecting her to take care of the kids, she DID expect the same thing from Eric, she just wasn't a "dillhole" about it.

I'm not sure if she expected the same thing from Eric, but she was trying to make a point. She was more saying, "Why can't you be the stay-at-home dad while I work? Why is the woman staying at home the default option?" It's an equality thing, especially considering the time of the show (1978). But I'm sure, when not trying to make a point, she'd want to divide up responsibilities just as equally.

Originally Posted by FuriosityShell (View Post) In Ice Shack, while they're playing the Newlywed Game and Eric mentions that she's insecure about her big feet, she gets mad at him for thinking that's she would change about herself when she literally said she was insecure about her big feet.

Yeah, that's not her best moment, but it's a human one. She's only seventeen. And for all the times Eric's behaved less than his "best self," I think Donna's earned having some less than stellar minutes.

Originally Posted by FuriosityShell (View Post) BTW, I've actually been reading your comics and catching up with them. They're really good but I have a long way to go. I'm on season 5 still. I loved your bonus season 4.5 in which you tell the story of Jackie and Steven started dating, or at least, fooling around.

Aw, thank you! I'm glad you're enjoying them.

[JamesOwnz]

Since on this, what do you think each character's worst moment was?

It was done in a humorous way but say for Jackie when she tried to get Hyde kicked out of the house.

Eric- was it running away from the Wedding? Pulling down Donna's pants? Lying about Donna's cat? (though that would be pretty tough conversation to have...)

Kelso- The numerous cheating even though it was shown he clearly cared about Jackie.. who knows.

Hyde- He is a real tough one, he's a good guy but has alot of "with friends like these..who needs enemeys" moments.

Red/Kitty.. if you want to lump them in together I guess the firing of Eric and the sabotaging of him getting the bank job.. always a part of me that wanted to see another Wrongful Termination suit against Red for that lol.

What do you think? What about the other characters?

[alyak0807]

Lisa, do you know that you didn't close the last thread?

[MistyMountainHop]

Interesting questions, JamesOwnz!

For me...

Worst moment for Donna: A tie between unapologetically letting Eric wait for her for hours in "Backstage Pass" and using him in "The Relapse" with no regard for his feelings. '

Worst moment for Eric: I believe it was entirely OOC for Eric not to show up to the wedding, so I don't count that. I'd say his worst moment is in "A New Hope" where, rather than defending Donna against David Milbank's devaluing of her worth, he validates them. He almost directly states that his interest in Donna all along has been purely physical, that who she is as a person is irrelevant to him, and he pretended to care about her mind and heart to get into her pants.

Yeah, I understand why the show didn't follow-up on that storyline. This is when Eric and Donna would've broken up.

Worst moment for Kelso: When he becomes a hypocritical, self-entitled narcissist. In "Everybody Loves Casey," he both justifies his cheating because "men cheat out of joy" and takes no responsibility for his cheating, instead blaming Jackie for his own behavior.

Then, continuing on this trajectory in S5, he sabotages Jackie's happiness because, according to him, she's not allowed to date other people ever -- regardless of them being broken up. But he's allowed to cheat on her all he wants while they're together. The end of S4 and all of S5 made Kelso entirely unlikable.

Worst moment for Jackie: Stalking Hyde in season 3. She's out of control at that point and succumbing to delusion. She doesn't respect Hyde's boundaries, flat-out ignores them. Whenever he tells her no, she hears yes. If their genders were reversed, the creep-factor would be obvious.

Worst moment for Hyde: Though I think this moment is OOC, not confronting Jackie immediately in "You Shook Me" and sleeping with the nurse as his way of breaking up with Jackie. It's closely followed by another OOC moment in S6, where he forgets he's the one who harmed Jackie first and worst and demands she acknowledge him as the more injured party (because of her antics in "Celebration Day"). The writers dropped the ball terribly at the beginning of S6, but that's a rant for another time.

Worst moment for Fez: Becoming a total perv. Hiding in Donna's closet and under her bed. Taking a picture up her skirt. Behavior of that nature.

---

ETA: No, Kayla, I didn't. Thanks for the heads-up!

[JamesOwnz]

Originally Posted by MistyMountainHop (View Post) Interesting questions, JamesOwnz! For me... Worst moment for Donna: A tie between unapologetically letting Eric wait for her for hours in "Backstage Pass" and using him in "The Relapse" with no regard for his feelings. ' Worst moment for Eric: I believe it was entirely OOC for Eric not to show up to the wedding, so I don't count that. I'd say his worst moment is in "A New Hope" where, rather than defending Donna against David Milbank's devaluing of her worth, he validates them. He almost directly states that his interest in Donna all along has been purely physical, that who she is as a person is irrelevant to him, and he pretended to care about her mind and heart to get into her pants. Yeah, I understand why the show didn't follow-up on that storyline. This is when Eric and Donna would've broken up. Worst moment for Kelso: When he becomes a hypocritical, self-entitled narcissist. In "Everybody Loves Casey," he both justifies his cheating because "men cheat out of joy" and takes no responsibility for his cheating, instead blaming Jackie for his own behavior. Then, continuing on this trajectory in S5, he sabotages Jackie's happiness because, according to him, she's not allowed to date other people ever -- regardless of them being broken up. But he's allowed to cheat on her all he wants while they're together. The end of S4 and all of S5 made Kelso entirely unlikable. Worst moment for Jackie: Stalking Hyde in season 3. She's out of control at that point and succumbing to delusion. She doesn't respect Hyde's boundaries, flat-out ignores them. Whenever he tells her no, she hears yes. If their genders were reversed, the creep-factor would be obvious. Worst moment for Hyde: Though I think this moment is OOC, not confronting Jackie immediately in "You Shook Me" and sleeping with the nurse as his way of breaking up with Jackie. It's closely followed by another OOC moment in S6, where he forgets he's the one who harmed Jackie first and worst and demands she acknowledge him as the more injured party (because of her antics in "Celebration Day"). The writers dropped the ball terribly at the beginning of S6, but that's a rant for another time. Worst moment for Fez: Becoming a total perv. Hiding in Donna's closet and under her bed. Taking a picture up her skirt. Behavior of that nature. --- ETA: No, Kayla, I didn't. Thanks for the heads-up!

Interesting response.

Must admit I forget alot of dialogue and that part in a new hope completely slipped my mind for Eric... I tend to take everything the character has done even if it seems to be rather out of character... so also another thing for Eric could be his spitefulness in season 5.

His parents clearly took it too far (I still contend it was their worst moment..how bout all of you?) but he just had to get that last shot in knowing it would hurt them about moving away.

Another one for Hyde which is a little minor was how about baking the "special" brownies? He was lucky to get taken in and for him to risk that was pretty dumb... kind of funny thinking that episode, why didn't the parents remember that little event?

[MistyMountainHop]

Originally Posted by JamesOwnz (View Post) Must admit I forget alot of dialogue and that part in a new hope completely slipped my mind for Eric... I tend to take everything the character has done even if it seems to be rather out of character...

I understand that. It's an approach another T7S acquaintance of mine has, too (we've had many a fascinating discussion from our differing POVs).

For me ... if the whole of T7S were a novel, it would be rejected by agents and publishers alike for its character inconsistencies. At the very least, an (editorial) agent would tell the author to fix it. That's how I view shows (I'm a novelist, so I can't help myself ), so when Eric behaves contrary to his long-established characterization -- without substantial grounding for that behavior -- then I can't consider it canon.

For instance, Jackie's insightful compassion in "Jackie Bags Hyde" isn't OOC because we'd seen her be this way with Donna quite a few times, and she also gets lost in a moment of ego during that scene with Hyde, in which he steers her back on course. That scene was both foreshadowed by earlier behavior and substantiated by Jackie's ego making a guest appearance.

Same thing with Donna's self-destructive behavior in S4. "Eric Gets Suspended" (season 2) establishes this as a coping mechanism for Donna. When she's not happy with how her parents / loved ones are treating her, she acts out, usually to her own detriment.

Originally Posted by JamesOwnz (View Post) His parents clearly took it too far (I still contend it was their worst moment..how bout all of you?) but he just had to get that last shot in knowing it would hurt them about moving away.

I'm not happy with how Red and Kitty approached Eric's engagement to Donna, but I could see them going down that path. I can see Kitty, in particular, approaching it differently, as well -- but she was a bit nuts in S5, so she wasn't her totally rational self. In the comics I make for T7S, I point out the irrationality of Red and Kitty's sabotage of Eric's future in order to protect his future. At least Red comes around in the end.

Eric was so sick of being controlled by the end of S5 that he needed a way to assert himself. Moving away was his method, and the way he informed his parents -- yeah, that fits Eric's character. We'd seen that attitude in him throughout the show (at various points) toward Laurie and Donna.

Originally Posted by JamesOwnz (View Post) Another one for Hyde which is a little minor was how about baking the "special" brownies? He was lucky to get taken in and for him to risk that was pretty dumb... kind of funny thinking that episode, why didn't the parents remember that little event?

I wouldn't say that was one of his worst moments. Maybe one of his dumbest. He was arrogant to think he'd get away with it without a hitch. But he was only seventeen, we gotta remember. And he'd grown up with barely any parental guidance, so common sense was not his middle name. He trusted in the Formans' naivety to protect him. What "norm" parent would suspect a brownie to be filled with pot?

[JamesOwnz]

Yeah true I guess dumb fits that idea more.

I just love the scene of Eric scolding him. lol

[MistyMountainHop]

Originally Posted by JamesOwnz (View Post) I just love the scene of Eric scolding him. lol

Me, too.

DONNA: Eric, I was just talking to Jackie, and--
ERIC: Donna, not now, okay? See, Hyde, I asked you not to make special brownies, but did you listen?
HYDE: Well--
ERIC: Exactly. You didn’t. You were just so smart. What were you thinking?
HYDE: I was--
ERIC: Yeah, that’s it. Right. That’s the problem: you weren’t thinking. Now my folks are fried, and I've got no car.
DONNA: Wait a minute -- brownies? Your mom and dad are--
ERIC: Donna, keep it zipped, okay? [To Hyde] Guess what, buddy. There’s a lesson in all of this. You know what that lesson is?
HYDE: The lesson is--
ERIC: Hyde, why don’t I just tell you what the lesson is? You dance with Mary Jane, you get your toes stepped on. That’s right. Consequences, my friend. Yeah. Consequences. Now my car's gone, and Red's high as a kite.

[JamesOwnz]

Just watching radio daze.

Anyone have any idea what Fez is doing at the start when Eric and Kelso are playing air instruments?

Wish this place were a little more lively.

[MistyMountainHop]

Fez is being Fez. That's his way of grooving to the music.

This board has a few regulars who keep it alive. Other people pop in for a few weeks or months at a time. But the conversation remains quality, friendly, and fun, which -- for me -- is the most important thing. The T7S board has around since at least 2003. A lot of boards have closed in that time, yet this one stays standing.

[alyak0807]

Fez is an oddball.

And I've seen days when this board has been really active. I just think we all get really busy sometimes. Everyone works unfortunately. Along with some of the other responsibilities and surprises life throws at you. But I think everyone tries their best to post as often as they can. And when we do we have a lot of fun!

Also, I missed the ten year anniversary?

[FuriosityShell]

I really love how friendly this board is because a lot of Internet message boards have a lot of fighting and arguing. I just love how peaceful this one is.

[msstock87]

Originally Posted by alyak0807 (View Post) Fez is an oddball. And I've seen days when this board has been really active. I just think we all get really busy sometimes. Everyone works unfortunately. Along with some of the other responsibilities and surprises life throws at you. But I think everyone tries their best to post as often as they can. And when we do we have a lot of fun! Also, I missed the ten year anniversary?

Agreed, we may not be the most busy board on fanforum but we have regulars, and everyone here is so friendly. This was the first board I visited on Fanforum and remains one of my favorites. I always try to pop in everyday at least for a few posts.

[MistyMountainHop]

Aw, to everyone!

Originally Posted by FuriosityShell (View Post) I really love how friendly this board is because a lot of Internet message boards have a lot of fighting and arguing. I just love how peaceful this one is.

I'm really glad, FuriosityShell!