[karamel]

Veronica Mars on Hulu

Veronica Mars: Panic spreads through Neptune when a bomb goes off during spring break. Veronica and Keith are hired by the wealthy family of one victim injured in the bombing to find out who is responsible.

Cast
Kristen Bell
Enrico Colantoni
Jason Dohring
Percy Daggs III
Francis Capra





Reviews

TV Review: ‘Veronica Mars’ Season 4

Veronica Mars Review: Hulu’s Revival Turns The Teen P.I. Into A Hard-Boiled Veteran

‘Veronica Mars’ Review: A Teen Heroine Grows Up

Veronica Mars Returns to Neptune, Seedy and Seductive As Ever

Veronica Mars Review: Our Girl Is All Grown Up in Hulu's Satisfying Revival

The Return of Veronica Mars: 5 Reasons the Hulu Revival Won't Disappoint

Veronica Mars Review: Our Girl Is All Grown Up in Hulu's Satisfying Revival]

[inalandslide]

WHEW BABY. MY EMOTIONS. that's all i can muster now until i stop rolling my eyes at the "i'm quitting this show" outrage

[karamel]

i love the season

obviously logan's death is hard to take but i think being kinda spoiled on that help lessen the impact a bit.... it is hard to imagine the show without him though

[inalandslide]

i did too and i had this feeling after the few vague comments I saw about being heartbroken or ruining the show that either keith or logan would die, or veronica and Logan would break up again after she left him at the courthouse, or vice versus. IT STILL HURT and I'm sad as hell because i can't imagine the show without him either, but i also understand the decision/idea behind it

Underneath being angry that they offed him, I think people are mad about the way it's being justified, and apparently angry with rob and kb over that. i've read twitter threads on that side of it, because you know, it's good to get all the perspectives, and I understand where they're coming from, i don't really agree. Is it a little bit on the side of not a good look that he kind of said something about veronica being more interesting outside of a relationship? or sort of alluding to her only being interesting in tragedy? yes, but other than that, i don't really feel like they betrayed fans with this twist, even if it seems that way because he's a fan favorite. maybe it's just the fact it's still fresh that the uproar is so intense.

ANYWAY, excuse my rambles, back to talking about the actual season!

[karamel]

i havent read any post-airing/spoiler interview.. so idk how it's being 'justified' or tbh if it needs to be rob is telling the story he wants told, fans don't have to like it, but he doesnt really owe anyone anything... not even to lt fans

of course many interesting stories can be told with veronica, whether shes in a relationship or not. but really this fandom, as far as sm goes, has always focused a lot more on the LoVe side of the show than anything else.. so not surprised by the reactions at all

[Mason30]

yeah guys, im fully with you.
its heartbreaking, it really is... but i really dont think its a slap in the face or anything like that. I was always a Veronica first LoVe second kinda girl though, so i guess im not married to it, like a lot of these more irate fans seem to be. its simply that i have always seen this show as existing beyond the scope of this relationship.

In opposition to Rob's reasoning though i feel i do have to say... i wouldnt find veronica living a happy home life boring. i dont think she NEEDS that mess and angst to drive her. I feel like she could get disillusioned and 'hurt' by any number of things / the general mess that is life and that would still push her into action and get her going. and would make for compelling, gritty TV. however... i do like that we do have so many directions and opportunities open to us now, Veronica can go anywhere... help anyone. i saw Rob was suggesting an 'agatha christie' style murder mystery in a snowed in hotel kinda vibe, and i am ABSOLUTELY down for anything like that. for me, the death here is the better open than a break up again, there are only so many times you can get on and off that see-saw without it loosing any kinda of story telling integrity.

so, in short. I dont feel like Rob and KB have broken anything, apart from some hearts... and i hope that people will relook this in a few months time with fresh eyes and an open heart and see if for what they were trying to do... the doors to storytelling they opened. this show is Veronica Mars afterall. and im still here for it... wherever they want to take us. with bells on.

ps. all that aside, i thought this season was filled with the trademark snark and wit and grit that i have come to love from this show. it did not disappoint. and while i would have liked to see more wallace and of course have mac back, i enjoyed the new characters, arcs and world building. it was a pretty great season of TV.

https://www.npr.org/2019/07/22/74407...een-a-survivor
https://www.usmagazine.com/entertain...e-twist-video/
https://www.eonline.com/ap/news/1058...out-a-struggle

[karamel]

Originally Posted by Mason30 (View Post) In opposition to Rob's reasoning though i feel i do have to say... i wouldnt find veronica living a happy home life boring. i dont think she NEEDS that mess and angst to drive her. I feel like she could get disillusioned and 'hurt' by any number of things / the general mess that is life and that would still push her into action and get her going. and would make for compelling, gritty TV. however... i do like that we do have so many directions and opportunities open to us now, Veronica can go anywhere... help anyone. i saw Rob was suggesting an 'agatha christie' style murder mystery in a snowed in hotel kinda vibe, and i am ABSOLUTELY down for anything like that. for me, the death here is the better open than a break up again, there are only so many times you can get on and off that see-saw without it loosing any kinda of story telling integrity.

seeing so many 'female characters can be happy and in a relationship and still be successful!'.. which is very true yet at the core of how veronica the character operates has always been (since s1 so this is nothing new) that loss, grief, anger, etc fuels her and her need to fight. yes any number of things can serve this purpose but this is kinda the ultimate.. losing one of the two most important person in her life just as things were finally really going well. if i had known a major character was going to die this season, my bets definitely would have been on keith or logan.. with keith having the edge just bc i didn't think rob would have the balls (or would be stupid enough to underestimate the love for logan i guess..) but for where rob wants to take the show, logan being the one to die makes sense to me. if keith dies (i truly don't know if V can come back from that) and veronica slips even further into darkness, there would just be even more back and forth with logan. he loves her and can't seem to leave her no matter how things go even if shes being self-destructive and self-sabotaging with their relationship

so, in short. I dont feel like Rob and KB have broken anything, apart from some hearts... and i hope that people will relook this in a few months time with fresh eyes and an open heart and see if for what they were trying to do... the doors to storytelling they opened. this show is Veronica Mars afterall. and im still here for it... wherever they want to take us. with bells on.

yes people seem to forget the show is Veronica Mars.. i have seen a few people say that from what rob said, it seems like he just wants a veronica spin-off of the show and they're not there for that... ummm what would a 'veronica spin-off' of VERONICA MARS be called??? it should be following her story/journey! wherever that may take her.. literally every character can have their demise and the show can still go on.. will that show be the same one everyone fell in love with? no, it won't but it can still be great... with the movie and books and this season on hulu, we've basically had 7 seasons of the show already.. if it's to continue even longer i do think things have to be change up to keep it going

ps. all that aside, i thought this season was filled with the trademark snark and wit and grit that i have come to love from this show. it did not disappoint. and while i would have liked to see more wallace and of course have mac back, i enjoyed the new characters, arcs and world building. it was a pretty great season of TV.

this season has been my favorite after s1. it's been a while since i rewatched s2 and 3 but i feel like i have thoroughly enjoy this season more.. and while i love the different relationships on the show, i do actually really enjoy the mysteries on VM especially the season long ones and always find myself immersed in what went down and how

[inalandslide]

Originally Posted by Mason30 (View Post) yeah guys, im fully with you. its heartbreaking, it really is... but i really dont think its a slap in the face or anything like that. I was always a Veronica first LoVe second kinda girl though, so i guess im not married to it, like a lot of these more irate fans seem to be. its simply that i have always seen this show as existing beyond the scope of this relationship.

that's how i feel too. i love logan and i love LoVe, but when it comes down to it, i know i watch/ed the series and read the books for veronica more than anything else. and i hate to say it, but as much as i can understand being upset with the decision, it does sound a little like a sense of entitlement some fans have because we helped them get the movie made, and feel like they're owed something because of that, but that's not exactly how it works. i mean, yeah, the movie and season 4 wouldn't exist without the support, but i feel like the fact it was more rob and co. pitching it to streaming platforms than only because fans want a revival means that's where the "give us what we want" might end. he wasn't wrong, it was a huge risk, especially because i know the writers and the fans have always had a weird sort of pushback relationship. maybe that's where it stems from.

Originally Posted by Mason30 (View Post) In opposition to Rob's reasoning though i feel i do have to say... i wouldnt find veronica living a happy home life boring. i dont think she NEEDS that mess and angst to drive her. I feel like she could get disillusioned and 'hurt' by any number of things / the general mess that is life and that would still push her into action and get her going. and would make for compelling, gritty TV. however... i do like that we do have so many directions and opportunities open to us now, Veronica can go anywhere... help anyone. i saw Rob was suggesting an 'agatha christie' style murder mystery in a snowed in hotel kinda vibe, and i am ABSOLUTELY down for anything like that. for me, the death here is the better open than a break up again, there are only so many times you can get on and off that see-saw without it loosing any kinda of story telling integrity.

Originally Posted by karamel (View Post) seeing so many 'female characters can be happy and in a relationship and still be successful!'.. which is very true yet at the core of how veronica the character operates has always been (since s1 so this is nothing new) that loss, grief, anger, etc fuels her and her need to fight. yes any number of things can serve this purpose but this is kinda the ultimate.. losing one of the two most important person in her life just as things were finally really going well. if i had known a major character was going to die this season, my bets definitely would have been on keith or logan.. with keith having the edge just bc i didn't think rob would have the balls (or would be stupid enough to underestimate the love for logan i guess..) but for where rob wants to take the show, logan being the one to die makes sense to me. if keith dies (i truly don't know if V can come back from that) and veronica slips even further into darkness, there would just be even more back and forth with logan. he loves her and can't seem to leave her no matter how things go even if shes being self-destructive and self-sabotaging with their relationship

i can see that too. i know i wouldn't have found her happy life boring either, and would've been here for domestic LoVe, but i totally get where they're going with it too, and i guess that's sort of why i just accept it. REALLY, this is where i agree with both points, because while there are other ways to continue jading her with maybe a little less of a narrowed vision on how that's done, i do think it makes a lot more sense for veronica to have the ULTIMATE loss, and there's the whole thing of logan knowing she might belong with him, but she doesn't belong in neptune and he was willing to let her go because of that, which feels like a very depressing full circle. i'm also on board with sending her out into the world and allowing a fresh take, even if it means bringing her back to neptune from time to time.

AND YES, even by s3, as much as i adore the angst, it starts to become a little stale when the two of them break up and get back together again, and because logan is more well adjusted in his 30s than veronica, it would ultimately have to be veronica leaving or pushing him away again, which i feel like might highlight her not so great characteristics too often and leave her open to fans turning on her because they're so hardcore about logan. annnyway, i like to tell myself that given the choice between killing off logan and keith, logan is the lesser of two evils here, and i can't even begin to imagine the strength of that kind of backlash because if you ask me, it's not logan and veronica who are the heart of the show, it's keith and veronica and always has been. it would've been interesting to see how he coped with his failing health or retired life, but eh, i'm glad at least one of her two favorite guys is safe and healthy.

i don't necessarily feel like it backtracked either veronica's nor logan's character development, first of all, because you can't really retcon development if that character is dead... plus, do we reeeeally believe, even in her moment of clarity, veronica wasn't still the same person as she was at the start of the season? of course, i believe she really wanted to marry logan and be with him in whatever capacity that meant, but girlfriend has been backsliding here and there since 2004 and still has a long way to go even after pushing through her fear of commitment.

Originally Posted by Mason30 (View Post) ps. all that aside, i thought this season was filled with the trademark snark and wit and grit that i have come to love from this show. it did not disappoint. and while i would have liked to see more wallace and of course have mac back, i enjoyed the new characters, arcs and world building. it was a pretty great season of TV.

more wallace, always. that is probably my biggest complaint, which is why s3 is probably my least favorite too. it's when he becomes less involved in veronica's cases and we lost a little of their dynamic and that's how it felt in the movie and s4. his cameo in the sex dream was GOLD, though, and i rewound it just to see his "really? here?" side eye again... also... that dream. WHEW! my, my deputy leo

Originally Posted by karamel (View Post) this season has been my favorite after s1. it's been a while since i rewatched s2 and 3 but i feel like i have thoroughly enjoy this season more.. and while i love the different relationships on the show, i do actually really enjoy the mysteries on VM especially the season long ones and always find myself immersed in what went down and how

same. i was almost done with my re-watch when they announced the new season arrived early, and it'd also been a while since i had, but i found myself SO invested in solving the main cases again, and anticipating those episodes even though i already knew the whodunnit

[karamel]

https://variety.com/2019/tv/columns/...rs-1203274143/

https://www.tvguide.com/news/veronic...n-dead-trauma/

https://www.usatoday.com/story/enter...ll/1755295001/

https://www.rollingstone.com/tv/tv-r...review-859790/

[karamel]

i will say that if rob didn't feel like he could continue to sustain the story by keeping it in neptune or beyond her marriage, then maybe he should've just left well enough alone.. the show has already been given so many chances.. more than any other. he could've left the fans with the happy ending they wanted.. if this is the last season with the wedding as the end, most fans would be more than happy with that if even it meant no more VM. but he blew that up.. not really worth it if this is just going to get him one more season

[inalandslide]

you're probably right, but i believe he did it with the intention/hope of being able to do more seasons, just not knowing if it was a sure thing until after it aired. according to an interview, he said the reason he gave logan that arc of the reformed bad boy and gave LoVe a happier ending in the movie was because he thought it was the last we'd ever see of the show. In all honesty, if this was a one off thing and he still killed logan off, then that's when I'd be unhappy with the way things ended. I MEAN, i'm not happy he's gone but I feel more objective about it, i guess or know I'll get over it

I really do understand that people are pissed off at RT but it's really upsetting and annoying that fans are dragging KB too. I know she's an EP for the season and she was present for the pitches to Hulu, but she's also being blamed for the ending like she was responsible for writing it or coming up with the twist in the first place. I've seen some of them say they've "lost respect" for her like she did something criminal, and try to spin all of her interviews like she didn't give a crap about jason or wasn't sad about his fate. it's so bizarre.

[karamel]

yea.. of course she could've said something to rob about not doing it (and who's to say she didn't?) but at the end of the day, like i said rob is the creator and writer of it from the beginning, i believe she wholeheartedly trust him and his vision for the show no matter where he takes it

[Mason30]

i have so many thoughts you guys, i agree with just about every point brought up, but let me just say this...

this is the thing that gets my back up in their defense. because, yes... the show is for us, we're the ones that tune in. but we are NOT the creators, and the actors and the producers. Its not our vision. its Robs, and he is fully entitled to do with it, as he sees fit. especially now, in this incarnation of the show...

we got our fan service movie. that thing was all by and for us... but this Hulu chapter, that was Rob and KB heading out there and taking these meetings... and rob conceptualized the way forward, and i trust that he knows what he is doing (quite frankly he hasnt let me down yet... even now. i think he's done an admirable job shepherding this show forward and finding a way for it to evolve).

In my opinion, you can be gutted, you can be pissed, and you can even say 'hey - my fav isnt here anymore, im out' thats our prerogative as viewers... but Rob and KB's debt to us has been paid in full since the movie, and we are just being bratty and entitled if we are going to stamp our feet all over the place and actually be loud and obnoxious on social platforms calling the CREATORS of the show out (the show and characters that literally wouldnt exist, that we wouldnt be able to love, without them having invented them in the first place). so yeah, everyone that is creating a **** storm and feeling all self important and enraged by the 'audacity' of a creator to take control of his vision and do what he wants to and feels is the right thing to do... they need to take a step back and a time out. we, are owed nothing. and they 100 percent need to stop dragging KB. they (the 'fans' are the ones being disrespectful and ungrateful its pissing me off). What actress and actor is so in love with a character that they will happily play them until they are 100? most would much prefer to close a chapter and move on, not KB. she appreciates the value of VM and is humble and generous enough to actively pursue playing her further.

me personally, im filled with gratitude. maybe i didnt get the ending that i wanted here... but i still got a damn fine season of TV, i got the character that pretty much saved my life at one point (at least in some form) back and she was as sassy and spirited and special as ever, and i now get to look forward to a possibility of more.

win win ****ing win.

interesting discussion here:
https://uproxx.com/tv/veronica-mars-season-4-death/3/

ps. and totally agree. Keith and Veronica are the beating heart of this show. that is what the character (and the show) wouldnt be able to survive without. The Logan dynamic and the character will be greatly missed. there is a hole in my heart... just like in Veronicas. but we (and the show) will survive it.

i'll get down off my soap box now.

[karamel]

^ they both make pretty good points

but yea... moving on.. what did you guys think of the new credits?
i missed the dandy warhols one...

[Mason30]

visually they were pretty amazing (True Detective-esque)
i missed the track, but by about episode 4 the new version had grown on me and i was on board.

here, rob seems pretty optimistic about the future

“My hope is that we get to make more,” he told Deadline at TCA Friday. “I think we will. It’s all been very positive with Hulu. I know they are happy with the critical response to the show, they are happy internally creatively with the show.”

and im definitely on board for something like this

Thomas has said in recent interviews that he would like for Veronica Mars to evolve into a detective series with a possible Agatha Christie-style mystery eyed for Season 5. “They would all be eight-episode mysteries,” Thomas said about his vision for future seasons. “For Season 5 the ideas I have been noodling with have all been kind of Agatha Christie in that Murder In the Manor House sort of idea.