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Old 01-30-2015, 12:25 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by justathought (View Post)
They are certainly presenting it as no hope fatal type II or severe with type III with countless surgeries in store.

We had all thought that if it was type III, the gene therapy/stem cell treatments that have been tried and have shown to practically allow these children to go fracture free and growth rates to be good.

We will see.

But given the quality of the writing and acting last night I am game for anything.
Whatever happens is beyond my control, I would just prefer to see the baby lives as I feel there is a more "beautiful" story to be told there. Baseline of the story is a doctor of faith who is conflicted between the science and the religious decision to carry the child to term or terminate. I do believe there is a secondary layer to this and that would be discovering new and advanced medical treatments for OI. While all of this goes on, there is still the relationship between April and Jackson. April pushing Jackson away, refusing to believe the baby has type 2, putting all her energy into her work and Jackson's frustrations with wanting to help her in his own way and wanting to make decisions as a team. We will see them finding out what it means to be Avery's as well as growing up in a way that is beautiful. While many of these issues can be done whether the baby lives or dies, I feel like the importance of OI awareness cannot be raised if the baby dies, therefore there is more an interesting story if the baby lives. If the baby dies in episode 11, we get 12-14 of April being absent, upon her return, I have no doubts that we would continue to see a ravaged April shutting out Jackson and lashing out at others, it's not a compelling story I'd like to see and that doesn't seem beautiful to me either.
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Old 01-30-2015, 12:29 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Michele22 (View Post)
Whatever happens is beyond my control, I would just prefer to see the baby lives as I feel there is a more "beautiful" story to be told there. Baseline of the story is a doctor of faith who is conflicted between the science and the religious decision to carry the child to term or terminate. I do believe there is a secondary layer to this and that would be discovering new and advanced medical treatments for OI. While all of this goes on, there is still the relationship between April and Jackson. April pushing Jackson away, refusing to believe the baby has type 2, putting all her energy into her work and Jackson's frustrations with wanting to help her in his own way and wanting to make decisions as a team. We will see them finding out what it means to be Avery's as well as growing up in a way that is beautiful. While many of these issues can be done whether the baby lives or dies, I feel like the importance of OI awareness cannot be raised if the baby dies, therefore there is more an interesting story if the baby lives. If the baby dies in episode 11, we get 12-14 of April being absent, upon her return, I have no doubts that we would continue to see a ravaged April shutting out Jackson and lashing out at others, it's not a compelling story I'd like to see and that doesn't seem beautiful to me either.
I would actually be interested in that story. To see April overcome this with Jackson's support. I mean judging by last night's episode, I don't think it's fair to prejudge the storyline because that was some compelling stuff IMO.
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Old 01-30-2015, 12:35 PM
  #63
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It seems like neither April or Jackson knows about the possible stem cell treatment. I think Dr. Herman can say to them next week it's type III, but still the possibilities of surviving are minimal. The Mama Avery in episode 10 can bring the stem cell treatment option with her and that will bring Baley on the scene too.
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Old 01-30-2015, 12:36 PM
  #64
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I would actually be interested in that story. To see April overcome this with Jackson's support. I mean judging by last night's episode, I don't think it's fair to prejudge the storyline because that was some compelling stuff IMO.
I agree, it was a compelling episode last night. April's reaction was natural. She found out her baby has a potentially fatal illness, she spent that whole night researching it and pulling case studies none of which had a positive outcome (for type 2). Jackson seemed more hopeful that there is possibility that their baby doesn't have this form and wants them to hold on to that hope until they find out more. April responds by not wanting to talk to him and putting her energy into caring for people that she can treat and fix. This is what I had thought was going to happen. But for that to carry on into episode 15 and beyond into the latter half of the season, will become tiresome and boring to me. There is a lot more compelling material to work with if the baby lives. They go through whether or not to terminate, they decide to wait, Arizona finds some stem cell therapy, they try it, there is worry whether the treatment works or not, they may have to try something else, may 2-3 treatments. Herman tried 2-3 different trials and now Amelia's plan. So it may take many tries for Baby A as well. Once the baby is born, there will be conflicts on how to raise it, stemming from the episode where they disagree on how to care for the deaf child. If the baby dies in 11, I just don't see the potential.
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Old 01-30-2015, 12:39 PM
  #65
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I think it's important to remember they say fractures are usually present in the second trimester with type 2 but not always. A lot of fractures take place in the 3rd trimester as the baby grows. So we can't bank anything on them not finding fractures. Plus Greys does what it wants so all of our fan research is moot anyway.
That's the thing. I think even within the types there are even more severe deformities.
The most fatal form of type II presents with enumerable fractures early in the second trimester. These babies usually self abort. But there are type II that present with fractures into the third trimester.

It looks like this is not necessarily about the different nuances about OI types but more about its a fatal inutero diagnosis and how April is handling the termination/induced labor and why God allows these things to happen.

Meredith's patient had an explanation as to why she drove off the bridge.

With April's situation, there really is just no answer spiritually just a medical answer that the genes mutated.
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Old 01-30-2015, 12:40 PM
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Problem is, even if they say it's type iii and mama avery suggests an alternative treatment, when are they going to show that, if april is missing 2 or 3 episodes? Surely showing her going through the treatment would crucial part of this arc. but we know that we might not see that much of her after 11, and that she's back at work already in episode 15. so i am just unsure about how that's all going to work out.
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Old 01-30-2015, 12:50 PM
  #67
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That's the thing. I think even within the types there are even more severe deformities.
The most fatal form of type II presents with enumerable fractures early in the second trimester. These babies usually self abort. But there are type II that present with fractures into the third trimester.

It looks like this is not necessarily about the different nuances about OI types but more about its a fatal inutero diagnosis and how April is handling the termination/induced labor and why God allows these things to happen.

Meredith's patient had an explanation as to why she drove off the bridge.

With April's situation, there really is just no answer spiritually just a medical answer that the genes mutated.
I agree, April was conflicted because she couldn't understand why things go wrong even if you do everything right. Meredith found the answer to what caused the patient's episode, yet April doesn't have an answer to why this is happening to her and her baby. Her question is why would God give someone a family and then allow bad things to happen? I am not sure how that fits in with 11x07 when she said that "We don't get to know all the answers". It also goes with the 9x19 patient when April asks why God would put 2 people together, allow them to fall in love and the rip them apart. That was in reference to the woman who died after childbirth. I suppose now she will want all the answers she can get in terms of diagnosis.
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Old 01-30-2015, 12:55 PM
  #68
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Grey's Medical on twitter said back in November (after episode 8) that they will talk about types and possible treatments depends on the type. Even Sarah when someone asked her if the baby will die or live (I think it was at the beginning of the season) she asked "you have to wait and see" and added a wink to her answer. I know I more likely reading to much into this, but I don't see Sarah adding a wink if the baby dies.
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Old 01-30-2015, 01:00 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by Michele22 (View Post)
I agree, April was conflicted because she couldn't understand why things go wrong even if you do everything right. Meredith found the answer to what caused the patient's episode, yet April doesn't have an answer to why this is happening to her and her baby. Her question is why would God give someone a family and then allow bad things to happen? I am not sure how that fits in with 11x07 when she said that "We don't get to know all the answers". It also goes with the 9x19 patient when April asks why God would put 2 people together, allow them to fall in love and the rip them apart. That was in reference to the woman who died after childbirth. I suppose now she will want all the answers she can get in terms of diagnosis.
The PR for 11x11 says that Jackson and April, after several conversations with Herman must make a difficult decision.

I don't know what is difficult if there is a treatment offered because it is not Type II.

It might be Herman explaining everything the baby will go through should she continue to carry to term.

How she will bond with Amy is also a little off. It was to late for Amy to abort, but she found comfort that her child's life had meaning though donated organs.

Where's that for April. She will have terminated/induced/preterm labor still with no answers and not the comfort Amy had though her baby died.

It would have to be them both losing babies to deformity.
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Old 01-30-2015, 01:02 PM
  #70
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Grey's Medical on twitter said back in November (after episode 8) that they will talk about types and possible treatments depends on the type. Even Sarah when someone asked her if the baby will die or live (I think it was at the beginning of the season) she asked "you have to wait and see" and added a wink to her answer. I know I more likely reading to much into this, but I don't see Sarah adding a wink if the baby dies.
I remember when someone asked her a long time ago if she chooses Matthew or Jackson (before the season 10 premiere I believe) she gave a similar answer like "Just keep watching heehee" and when asked who she thought was better for April, she ALWAYS referred to both as being good guys who each had something different of offer her (I never did see what Matthew had to offer but that's a different argument lol) So, i feed off those types of things because in the end she did choose Jackson and it was pretty much what we all wanted. I haven't read too many people who actually WANT the baby to die rather than THINK the baby will die. I do think fans want to see the baby live, SD knows the japril fans well, so i don't think she would do anything to provoke fans rather just try and tease.
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Old 01-30-2015, 01:03 PM
  #71
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Grey's Medical on twitter said back in November (after episode 8) that they will talk about types and possible treatments depends on the type. Even Sarah when someone asked her if the baby will die or live (I think it was at the beginning of the season) she asked "you have to wait and see" and added a wink to her answer. I know I more likely reading to much into this, but I don't see Sarah adding a wink if the baby dies.
I know... the hype is a little weird in my opinion if they are going to have the baby die/abort/induce whatever.

Even posting the consent form/birth certificate on instagram, if that is what it is.

I don't think they are appreciating how many of the fans really wanted a living baby to coo over.
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Old 01-30-2015, 01:07 PM
  #72
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Originally Posted by justathought (View Post)
The PR for 11x11 says that Jackson and April, after several conversations with Herman must make a difficult decision.

I don't know what is difficult if there is a treatment offered because it is not Type II.

It might be Herman explaining everything the baby will go through should she continue to carry to term.

How she will bond with Amy is also a little off. It was to late for Amy to abort, but she found comfort that her child's life had meaning though donated organs.

Where's that for April. She will have terminated/induced/preterm labor still with no answers and not the comfort Amy had though her baby died.

It would have to be them both losing babies to deformity.
I agree with you Tracy. If the baby is type 3 and there is a potential treatment, I don't see how that would be a difficult decision to make. Yes, do the treatment.

I see it more as like you said.. Herman going into detail what will happen to the baby in utero and once he is born, and then them having to decide what to do. I definitely don't see Jackson forcing her to induce or abort. I think April will come to that decision on her own after hearing the horrors of what her baby will face if she doesn't. It goes with what Shonda said about a woman who knows the religious side and the medical side and having that struggle. Hearing medically what will happen to him, but being pro-life like she is, will I'm sure cause her a lot of turmoil. But I think a L&D termination is way more likely than a D&E, because as I mentioned earlier there would be no baby for a pastor to bless with a D&E, and they would not need a birth certificate or death certificate. However, if April actually gives birth to her baby, they would need both. I think Amy comes into play because she knows what it's like to lose a baby before it even has a chance to live. A baby that she carried for 9 months. Granted, April has only carried hers for 6 months, but it's a whole different scenario than if she miscarried at 8 weeks or something and only Amy can relate to that.

Also think Mama K and Mama A might actually meet in 11. It'd make sense for Mama K to be there for that as well.

I do agree that the hype has been somewhat morbid if this baby dies in episode 11. I understand being psyched about an emotionally raw storyline and screen time, but Instragramming the baby's birth certificate when the baby dies is kinda not cool.
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Old 01-30-2015, 01:14 PM
  #73
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I know... the hype is a little weird in my opinion if they are going to have the baby die/abort/induce whatever.

Even posting the consent form/birth certificate on instagram, if that is what it is.

I don't think they are appreciating how many of the fans really wanted a living baby to coo over.
I'm thinking it's results from the test not an abortion consent or birth cert. That scene is reminding me of the pastor scene with Matthew and April. In the side there was some type of "test results" given but then it turned out to be something else (marriage compatibility or something). I don't remember the exact details. So, what might be an obvious birth certificate is most definitely something else I think. I don't think Jesse would post something so obvious especially with his sense of humor.
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Old 01-30-2015, 01:15 PM
  #74
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the PR is not always so accurate. They can't be or then all the plot will be out before people can even watch the episode. Also, the words used have to be the correct one to make the plot interesting and make people want to watch it to discover what's happening. And difficult is not always a synonyms of bad. For me, the fact that they used that term and not others like horrible, devastating or similar to those means something. As a journalist, I remember how in the college my professors always said to me that the most difficult thing is to know how to use the words to create the impact that you want and to achieve your goals, especially in corporate communication. And knowing that is a official PR and not some sides, they are very careful in the use of their words. I know that is my hope and my positive self talking, but still. I don't gonna lie, the thought of him dying is in my mind, but I'm fighting against that thought, at least, until I know 100% that's it.
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Old 01-30-2015, 01:20 PM
  #75
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I agree with you Tracy. If the baby is type 3 and there is a potential treatment, I don't see how that would be a difficult decision to make. Yes, do the treatment.

I see it more as like you said.. Herman going into detail what will happen to the baby in utero and once he is born, and then them having to decide what to do. I definitely don't see Jackson forcing her to induce or abort. I think April will come to that decision on her own after hearing the horrors of what her baby will face if she doesn't. It goes with what Shonda said about a woman who knows the religious side and the medical side and having that struggle. Hearing medically what will happen to him, but being pro-life like she is, will I'm sure cause her a lot of turmoil. But I think a L&D termination is way more likely than a D&E, because as I mentioned earlier there would be no baby for a pastor to bless with a D&E, and they would not need a birth certificate or death certificate. However, if April actually gives birth to her baby, they would need both. I think Amy comes into play because she knows what it's like to lose a baby before it even has a chance to live. A baby that she carried for 9 months. Granted, April has only carried hers for 6 months, but it's a whole different scenario than if she miscarried at 8 weeks or something and only Amy can relate to that.

Also think Mama K and Mama A might actually meet in 11. It'd make sense for Mama K to be there for that as well.

I do agree that the hype has been somewhat morbid if this baby dies in episode 11. I understand being psyched about an emotionally raw storyline and screen time, but Instragramming the baby's birth certificate when the baby dies is kinda not cool.
Aprils absence from 12-14 could be explain if they were doing a treatment too, but the sides in 15 don't speak to that.

It was a morbid build up to the fans, and I really do see the reason for the fandom's anger.

11x11 All I Could Do Is Cry...yup, if we watch April go through labor and delivery to allow natural death...horrifying.

Still waiting for the "beautiful" & "pretty perfect the way it plays out". Sad...but I would not use the word beautiful, more accepting what you cannot fix.
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