Veronica Mars - LoVe (Logan/Veroncia) #94 - He's there for her even when she doesn't love him enough. - Page 4

starlaa79 · 11-22-2006, 12:09 AM

The "LoVe ÷ Piz =" thing is a poll that aire is doing. You can vote for if you think Veronica should be with Logan, Piz, or by herself. So go Vote for LoVe and show them that we want our Epic Relationship to last. AERIE/CW/VERONICA MARS POLL

rowanlove · 11-22-2006, 01:45 AM

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Originally Posted by MusicofNight07 (View Post)

I think Veronica does love Logan, but it's just hard for her to open up. I mean really she rarely ever says it to Keith who is the man she trusts most in her life.

I am annoyed with V though. I get the "yeah" thing. But ignoring his call annoyed me.

I agree, but my take is that she ignored his call because she feels guilty about not dropping the investigation, even though Logan is desperately worried about her and so she's avoiding his call. While I love that she finally admitted out loud that she loves him and Logan said that he loves her, it doesn't solve the fact that she's refusing to change even though he's not asking her anything that she wouldn't ask of him. Veronica dumped him because he was courting danger with the PCHers the summer before last and now that she's courting danger with the rapist, it's 'this is who I am, I'm not going to change'?

Yeah, that wouldn't have been acceptable to Veronica, so I'm not sure how she thinks it's okay if she risks her life, but it's not okay for him to risk his life.

cherrios · 11-22-2006, 02:04 AM

Wow I just did the poll and here were the results...

LoVe: 76%
Piz: 1%
Single Veronica: 5%

Poor Piz, more people would rather see Veronica be single than with him. But then again the public has spoken.

rowanlove · 11-22-2006, 02:31 AM

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Originally Posted by cherrios (View Post)

Wow I just did the poll and here were the results...

LoVe: 76%
Piz: 1%
Single Veronica: 5%

Poor Piz, more people would rather see Veronica be single than with him. But then again the public has spoken.

I show 'LoVe' being at 79%, Piz at 17% and Veronica single being at 5%...the Love/Piz numbers change somewhat frequently but it's between 78-82% for LoVe and 15-18% for Piz and a steady 5% for Veronica being single...I'm sure they'll work on the whole 'adding up to 100%' thing later but I think that's because the 'Veronica single' tally isn't changing as new votes are added.

**the echo fades** · 11-22-2006, 02:36 AM

Argh, Veronica is just.. ugh. She needs a good slap, seriously.

But I don't think she was lying at all when she said "yeah" when he asked if she loved him. Just the way that she looked straight at him when she said it. If she was lying, she would have looked at the floor and mumbled it or something lol, or brushed the question off.

I'm hoping that they're saving Veronica actually saying "I love you" for a better time though. I wouldn't have wanted her to say it for the first time right then, in the middle of an arguement, and than have her ignore him afterwards. Hopefully he'll dump her, she'll realise what an idiot she's been and how much she loves him, and she'll tell him while trying to get him back

Logan was just spot on this week though, I loved how he said everything the entire fandom have been wanting to say to Veronica this season

his line about how he didn't care if it was wrong, or if she was pissed off, he just wanted her to be safe. Guh

And how she expects him to change but won't change herself. Thankyou, Logan! This does give me hope that Veronica's behaviour is like this for a reason and it will change though. Because the writers are actually acknowledging it through Logan, they don't think she's being the perfect princess they sometimes like to make her out to be.
I thought Keith was a bit off shouting at Logan though. And when he said "does he have reson to be worried?" umm hello, she was DRUGGED. I was surprised he wasn't more worried about her. Logan's "maybe you should start" cracked me up, hee. It's true, Keith isn't hard enough on her.

And I just wanted to hug him at the end

he's so emo and I love him. And Veronica.. just. No. I have no words. She has a boyfriend who loves her and is so worried about her safety that he doesn't even care that going to lengths to protect her will make her mad at him. As long as she's ok then he doesn't care about himself

and all she can do is get angry at him and ignore his calls. Are we supposed to sympathise with her?! I think not.

SpySyd · 11-22-2006, 03:36 AM

God, that last shot of Logan just KILLED me. I'm dead.

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But I don't think she was lying at all when she said "yeah" when he asked if she loved him. Just the way that she looked straight at him when she said it. If she was lying, she would have looked at the floor and mumbled it or something lol, or brushed the question off.

I agree. I think she was telling the truth but she also knew that things weren't okay, not for her anyway, which is why, imo, she had that face when he was hugging her.

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I thought Keith was a bit off shouting at Logan though. And when he said "does he have reson to be worried?" umm hello, she was DRUGGED. I was surprised he wasn't more worried about her. Logan's "maybe you should start" cracked me up, hee. It's true, Keith isn't hard enough on her.

Yeah, that was weird that he wasn't more worried. But he doesn't know about the hair, thus the direct link to the rapes and more than that, he doesn't know she was raped before.... so I'm torn on the issue. He definitely isn't hard enough on her, that's for sure.

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Are we supposed to sympathise with her?! I think not.

No, I think we're supposed to see she's really messed up. If we never gets her beating herself up over her own issues with people (ie Logan) at one point or another, then I'll be pissed. I just really feel like Logan was right. She THINKS she's right but she isn't. She'll need to find that out eventually.

Don't get me wrong, I think Logan deserves a girl who loves him just as easily as he does, but they're IT together, whether Veronica wants it or not. There will never be a guy that'll touch her like Logan does.

Btw, don't know if this was mentionned already but there's a poll about V's men HERE. Go vote for our couple!

**the echo fades** · 11-22-2006, 04:12 AM

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Originally Posted by SpySyd (View Post)

Yeah, that was weird that he wasn't more worried. But he doesn't know about the hair, thus the direct link to the rapes and more than that, he doesn't know she was raped before.... so I'm torn on the issue. He definitely isn't hard enough on her, that's for sure.

But he knows she was dosed with GHB, which I'm sure he knows is what was used to drug and rape the girls at Hearst. And surely she must have explained the siuation? I mean it's not like she was at a party where she accidently picked up a drink that was meant for someone else, if she told him she was in the cafeteria then it's quite obvious that the drugs were specifically meant for her - and whether she was shaved or not doesn't change the fact that someone deliberately drugged her. Meh, I don't know. It's just that Keith is usually the most concerned dad on the planet but there was just.. nothing.

And another point on the ILY.. honestly, Veronica isn't the kind of person to lie about that. If she really didn't feel it, she wouldn't say it.
She couldn't say it when Duncan left. Not even a "me too". If there was one time in the world that you should say ILY if you mean it, it's when your boyfriend is running away to Australia and you're never going to see him again

but she didn't. So if she really didn't love Logan, she wouldn't have said she did.

Veronica just really needs to deal with her issues. Her saying she will really doesn't mean much.. I mean, she told Logan she was going to work on her trust issues and she didn't. Her voiceover from the end of the last ep seemed to be forgotten this week.
She may be messed up but so is Logan and she shows absolutely no compassion for him when she's trampling all over him. He's lost every person he's ever loved and she doesn't seem to care that she's making him feel like it's going to happen again.

Gah, it's all so frustrating

MissShannon · 11-22-2006, 05:09 AM

I am really frustrated with Veronica.

Logan clearly loves her, and he has demonstrated it to her both in word and by his actions with increasing frequency. They both have trust issues and the like, but it seems that Logan is doing a much better job of resolving them than Veronica lately.

Logan did have reason to be concerned about her safety. I agree about the body guard thing, I would have been scared half to death too. But Logan was clearly desperate to protect her and knew of no other way. Why did he have to resort to this? because Veronica was pushing him away. Obviously they have to fight a bit over this as Logan would be likely to overreact, but would it have been so hard for Veronica to concede just a little bit and call him more often to let him know where she is and that she's alright? Letting him know that she'll have a friend with her? It's not as if his fears are totally unwarrented, I mean he did rescue her at the end of last episode.

Speaking of which, the last episode ended with Veronica saying that we should put our trust in people who love us even when we don't love them enough. It seems like Veronica didn't learn anything from the experience and is acting as if Logan needs to earn her trust again.

neko_chan · 11-22-2006, 05:38 AM

Just watched the episode and to be fair, I was sympathizing a bit with Veronica during the first argument in her apartment. Logan had his heart in the right place and he was worried sick so I get that he probably wasn't thinking clearly past keeping Veronica safe but the way he ordered her to stay away from the rape case, demanded it of her? I can't blame Veronica for getting pissed because I wouldn't have stood for my boyfriend telling me what to do either. Logan should have put a little more thought into his approach.

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Originally Posted by Whordy (View Post)

But he knows she was dosed with GHB, which I'm sure he knows is what was used to drug and rape the girls at Hearst. And surely she must have explained the siuation? I mean it's not like she was at a party where she accidently picked up a drink that was meant for someone else, if she told him she was in the cafeteria then it's quite obvious that the drugs were specifically meant for her - and whether she was shaved or not doesn't change the fact that someone deliberately drugged her. Meh, I don't know. It's just that Keith is usually the most concerned dad on the planet but there was just.. nothing.

I agree. The way Keith acted in this episode kinda irked me. Unlike Logan, he did not show any signs of terror or concern or worry that his daughter was drugged in her school cafeteria and then found lying alone and helpless in a parking garage by her boyfriend who just happens to have impeccable timing. I know Veronica is keeping him out of the loop of her shaved head and rapist hunt but come on, are we expected to believe that Keith is stupid? Or that he doesn't know his daughter at all? She's going to a college where there are serial rapes going on, does Keith really think Veronica isn't looking into it...even just a smidge? Even if he doesn't know about Parker or any of Veronica's ties to rape, he has to know that he didn't raise a daughter who would keep her eyes closed to this kind of a crime. Especially not the daughter he's been living with for the past 2+ years. I know a lot of people have been disappointed with Keith this season and now I'm really feeling it too.

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And another point on the ILY.. honestly, Veronica isn't the kind of person to lie about that. If she really didn't feel it, she wouldn't say it.
She couldn't say it when Duncan left. Not even a "me too". If there was one time in the world that you should say ILY if you mean it, it's when your boyfriend is running away to Australia and you're never going to see him again

but she didn't. So if she really didn't love Logan, she wouldn't have said she did.

Again, I agree completely. Veronica wouldn't say it just to placate him and end the argument. And it's at this moment when her eyes really tear up.

After reading the comments here and at the LoVe Shack, I thought that this would be yet another episode where I can't stand Veronica but, surprisingly, I didn't really have a problem with her. I liked how after last week, she was just trying to be her normal self with everyone: her dad, Wallace, Dick, etc. But in her moments alone you can see that she is terrified and on edge. And the only time this part of her came out, other than when she's alone, was with Logan. It's only with him that she's allowed herself to be vulnerable, and angry (even if the anger was directed at him) because only he knows what really happened.

I, personally, don't think she was lying when she said things were okay between them. I think she really did want for things to be okay. I just don't think she could handle being around him at the moment, which was why she ignored the phone call. Only Logan knows what happened, only Logan is as scared for her as she is. Veronica can't pretend that everything is fine and dandy when she's with Logan like she can with everyone else and I don't think she feels like she can solve the case if she's carrying the burden of fear around with her everywhere she goes. She has to be able to compartmentalize it so that she can look at things rationally, and Logan, being as worried for her as he is, makes it hard for her to do that.

That being said, I do see Logan's side in all this and I completely felt for him at the end. I can see at the end how he probably thinks she's been lying to him about everything. Lying about being busy, lying about things being okay, and most of all lying about how she loved him. From his standpoint, Veronica doesn't want to put the effort into their relationship, she doesn't trust him, she probably doesn't even love him. At least not like he loves her. Oh boy were there wires crossed this episode.

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Obviously they have to fight a bit over this as Logan would be likely to overreact, but would it have been so hard for Veronica to concede just a little bit and call him more often to let him know where she is and that she's alright? Letting him know that she'll have a friend with her?

I really think they could have and should have worked out a compromise like this. I think that Veronica leaving voicemail messages and maybe the occasional text message for Logan would have done wonders to ease his mind about her safety and he wouldn't have gone to the extreme of hiring a bodyguard for her. Of course, coming up with a compromise would have required talking, which Veronica was avoiding at the beginning of the episode.

And by the way, I agree about that too. I don't know how the writers can have her have a VO realization last week that she didn't love Logan enough and then start the beginning of this episode with her avoiding his calls. Emotional continuity doesn't really make sense there.

**the echo fades** · 11-22-2006, 06:43 AM

Ok well you've officially made me sympathise a bit more with Veronica

I do think Logan was a bit pushy in the first scene, just telling her what to do. But she had been ignoring his calls and messages, so he probably wasn't in the best of moods

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Originally Posted by neko_chan

I, personally, don't think she was lying when she said things were okay between them. I think she really did want for things to be okay. I just don't think she could handle being around him at the moment, which was why she ignored the phone call. Only Logan knows what happened, only Logan is as scared for her as she is. Veronica can't pretend that everything is fine and dandy when she's with Logan like she can with everyone else and I don't think she feels like she can solve the case if she's carrying the burden of fear around with her everywhere she goes. She has to be able to compartmentalize it so that she can look at things rationally, and Logan, being as worried for her as he is, makes it hard for her to do that.

That's very true. I can definately see Veronica not wanting to face Logan, because facing him would mean she'd have to actually deal with everything. They really should just sit down and talk. About all of it. Both tell each other where they're coming from without fighting about it. Buuut I guess that doesn't make good TV

I really hope Veronica is just bottling everything up so it'll all come out soon.

The final scene.. I think it was more the fact that he saw her take her phone out, look at the display, and actively decided to hang up on him. She wasn't busy, she wasn't with anyone, she could have talked to him if she wanted to, but she didn't. And having to see that.. poor lil Logan

I definately agree that she should have taken at least one of his calls, knowing how worried he was. Last time she was avoiding his calls she ended up getting attacked, so it really wouldn't hurt her to let him know she was ok. Even if it was a brief "hi, I can't talk right now" at least it would put his mind at rest.

The bodygaurd thing amuses me really, I did cringe when he told her Logan had hired him

but it probably didn't seem OTT at all to Logan like it would to us and Veronica. His mum and dad probably had bodyguards, he might have had to have one himself at some point. So it probably didn't seem like such a big deal to him.

PhillyFan24 · 11-22-2006, 06:59 AM

Wow, Neko, you said it all! Great post. I agree with you on all your points.

The only thing I want to add is that I think Veronica ignoring Logan's call may have been a way to show us that she's beating herself up over the argument, or more specifically about how Logan feels. I think Logan hit a nerve when he told her that it's okay for her to expect him to change, but not vice versa. Not many people tell Veronica when she's wrong and I think maybe she's she's realizing how much Logan has adapted to her and how little she's has to him. I'm hoping this is true for two reasons. First, she's finally growing up and if she didn't love Logan (whick I believe she does), she wouldn't even bother thinking about it. And secondly, because last weeks voiceover would have a purpose.

Bonnie

neko_chan · 11-22-2006, 07:06 AM

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Originally Posted by Whordy (View Post)

but it probably didn't seem OTT at all to Logan like it would to us and Veronica. His mum and dad probably had bodyguards, he might have had to have one himself at some point. So it probably didn't seem like such a big deal to him.

You're right, I forgot about Logan's celebrity kid status for a minute there. That guy might even be someone Logan has known for years for all we know. I can see a young pre-adolescent Logan getting buddy buddy with his bodyguard.

Although, if Logan did have a bodyguard on a regular or semi-regular basis sometime in his life, I'd find that ironic and really sad because what Logan the biggest threat to Logan's physical and emotional well being was right in his very own home, not outside it.

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They really should just sit down and talk. About all of it. Both tell each other where they're coming from without fighting about it. Buuut I guess that doesn't make good TV

That would make AWESOME TV to me.

There wasn't enough Logan in this episode. He didn't have any scenes on his own, just with Veronica....and Keith if you count the first scene. lol.

LB21 · 11-22-2006, 07:06 AM

After reading some of your comments I feel a tiny bit better about the ep. I agree with those of you who understand Veronica’s anger in their first scene. I too would be mad if my husband approached me that way. Plus, Veronica did stick up for him when Keith got pissed. So while she was mad, she obviously knew where Logan was coming from. I’ve got to give her credit there.

I am however pissed that our first confession of love from Veronica almost sounded angry. Her eyes welled up with tears, but her voice sounded almost angry. I don’t get that. I agree that she wouldn’t have said it if she didn’t mean it, but I just wish that, that was not how we first heard that she was in love with Logan. In this scene I did love how Logan called Veronica out on some of the things that we’ve all been saying. He’s always good for that. He knows her so well that I think it shocks her sometimes. I get that he was wrong to hire the bodyguard, but his heart was definitely in the right place. I just feel so damn bad for him because you can tell he’s scared poopless (my PC way of saying it…LOL) for her. However that hug at the end told me that Veronica really didn’t get it.

The last scene where Logan called Veronica literally broke my heart. Part of me almost wishes that JD wasn’t so good of an actor because maybe that scene would hurt so damn much…LOL. The look on his face and in his eyes, just tore me apart. Why can’t Veronica realize what she’s doing/risking? I’m scared as hell for next week. Part of me wants to read spoilers just so I can be prepared. Ugh.

Lisa

PhillyFan24 · 11-22-2006, 07:17 AM

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Originally Posted by LB21 (View Post)

The last scene where Logan called Veronica literally broke my heart. Part of me almost wishes that JD wasn’t so good of an actor because maybe that scene would hurt so damn much…LOL. The look on his face and in his eyes, just tore me apart. Why can’t Veronica realize what she’s doing/risking? I’m scared as hell for next week. Part of me wants to read spoilers just so I can be prepared. Ugh.

Lisa

It broke my heart too. I thought about it for the next hour and finally tried to rationalize that she's feeling guiltly about the way she's been treating him and needed some time to think about it.

I've been trying to stay spoiler free since the October premiere, but after last night's episode it's getting harder. I wouldn't let myself near the computer last night and am trying to show some will power today.

Bonnie

HotPink · 11-22-2006, 07:38 AM

I agreed with Logan 110% this episode! He hit the nail on the head when he told her's she's not always right, but that's kind of her biggest problem to me. She's self-righeous and never accepts a solution if it isn't her own! It's like she's permanently stuck on a high horse. And the whole "I love you" little fight was had at a good time. I wish she had said more than just "Yeah" like maybe "I do love you", but I'll take what I can get with her. And I agree, she needs to get over her own issues before she get over her relationship issues.