Veronica Mars - Case File 1-14: "Mars vs. Mars" Episode Discussion - Page 2

TvJunkie · 02-16-2005, 09:29 AM

Boy the finger for Lily Kane's murder is really pointing at Duncan.

My question was he diagnosed before or after the murder?

Maybe he was found over the body and Ma or Pa Kane or both thought he killed Lily and paid off the Dr. to give the diagnosis and give him the pills so that he would forget.

Duncan could have seen the murder and to make him forget they have him on the medication so that he can't remember.

Because from the flashbacks Duncan seemed okay he didn't start to space out until the night Lily was murdered.

Plus who would have access to Abel Koontz medical records to know that he was amiable to taking the rap for a murder? I don't remember if Abel worked for Kane or not. Where did Abel's hush money go after all he can't take it with him.

As for the main plot I figured out how it was going to play out. The only surprise was that the girl who did the accusing was not the girl who was actually had sex with the teacher.

Liked Veronica/Logan interaction he seemed pretty subdued. Plus the editing seems weird where Veronica tells Logan about the Mom's credit card being used then in the next scene you have her in class. I would have thought the next scene would have been V/L following up on the credit card use.

I think the harder they push Duncan as the killer the less I am leaning toward him though they could surprise me and have him be the actual killer.

sugarplum · 02-16-2005, 11:35 AM

Last night’s episode was so good, as everyone else has already said. It had all the right elements - humor (the safe and the rim job joke), and drama (Logan desperately trying to cling to the belief that his mother is alive then finding out she wasn’t and then finding out she might be again; the whole teacher scandal).

I figured that Keith would be right and the guy would be a sleaze bag. Mr. Rooks just had an answer for every questionable happening. He totally played Veronica and got her to help him without ever really asking her to. He is mucho manipulative. Glad he got caught!

I loved Veronica’s interaction with all of the boys. Weevil, Wallace, Logan, AND Duncan. Which, makes me such a VM shipping whore. Although, I still don’t ship her with Wallace, but they are flirty friends for sure. However, out of all of the guys on the show, I think I really like her chemistry with Logan more so than anyone else. I’m totally and fully a LoVer now.

As everyone else has said, I think they’re totally setting Duncan up here. They are really pointing a finger in his direction. His having epilepsy does explain one thing though. It explains why he broke up with Veronica in the first place when he so obviously still had feelings for her and why Lilly said that she should forget about Duncan and move on. Lilly must have been told about his condition, which caused her sudden change of tune. He probably didn't want Veronica to see him like that or to bear the brunt of one of his episodes. So to avoid it, he broke up with her. To "spare" her. Or he thought that once she found out about it, she would break up with him. Guys can be stupid like that when they underestimate a girl's love.

I think it could be plausible, actually. We’re all expecting that it wasn’t him because they’re painting him so hard, but they could be trying to trick us in that respect. I think it’s totally plausible that he had an episode and killed his sister, where after Celeste and Jake covered for him. His being the killer doesn’t mean that he has to go to prison. It could be something that Veronica and Keith cannot prove and might not want to prove in the end. So Duncan must walk around with the knowledge that he killed his little sister. Thus putting a wider rift between him and Veronica AND between him and Logan. Which would set up a Logan/Veronica relationship quite nicely.

There I go, already thinking up ways for Logan and Veronica to plausibly be together.

I feel bad for Logan. He is trying so desperately to believe that his mom is alive and then he finds out that she isn’t only to find out that she actually might be. However, I have a feeling that she actually is dead and if she is, the credit card activity could only mean one of two things: either it was stolen out of her purse sometime after she jumped and before the police came OR she was murdered and the killer took her credit cards.

I think she was murdered.

Someone on pg 1 of this thread said that they had a problem seeing the cast members as teenagers. Well, I have to disagree on that. I see them as 16-17 year olds. Especially in this day and age when teenagers are looking/dressing more grown up by the day. The VM kids are very teen-like in my opinion. I also disagree with the comment that was made about how it seems as though Veronica should be on CSI. To look at it logically, Keith Mars was a fantastic cop. He was sheriff, he had loads of tools and resources at his disposal. He still has those contacts and resources now. It is unrealistic that he would have the tools that he has to track people down, like wire taps and transmitters to stick underneath cars, but whatever. It’s TV. Veronica was shunned, basically, and had no friends. She spent a lot of time with her father. She was bound to pick things up.

Of course, some of the things that she gets away with doing are fairly unrealistic, but as I said, it’s TV. If she wasn’t a super sleuth and couldn’t track someone down at the drop of a hat if she wanted to, it probably wouldn’t be as interesting as it is.

nun with a gun · 02-16-2005, 01:50 PM

this has to be in mah top 3 fave episodes of VM
it was so funny, the 'crime' was not as obvious as in some episodes
and the jokes just kept on comin
Veronica and Weevil intoraction at the end was sweet and funny, i just loved it.
and the ink on Veronicas face was pricless, i wonder how many takes it took to shoot that

*Elle* · 02-16-2005, 02:26 PM

This episode was really good.

My question is when Veronica was in the girls bathroom listening to those girls talk about her and Duncan (forgot the girls names) but the one said that Duncan was brought into the Hospital screaming Veronica's name.

I'm wondering if this happened before or after Lilly's death. And is this the reason he broke up with her.

I liked all the Logan/Veronica interaction. I heart them so much, even if they never become a couple I like seeing them as friends. I also liked Weevil last night, how he helped Logan out.

Quote:

Plus who would have access to Abel Koontz medical records to know that he was amiable to taking the rap for a murder? I don't remember if Abel worked for Kane or not. Where did Abel's hush money go after all he can't take it with him.

My theory is Duncan killed Lilly. Jake covered it up by hiring Abel Koontz to take the wrap knowing that Abel was dying. Jake Kane probably made a deal to take care of his family for the rest of their natural lives. Koontz was
dying anyway so it's not like it really mattered.

***Lizzie*** · 02-16-2005, 04:06 PM

I just have to officially restate that I LOVED this ep.

I think there's more to Duncan and Koontz having the same doctor than a coincidence. I'm just wondering what it is.

Also, I really don't think that Duncan killed Lilly since they're really painting it that way. I'm thinking that Jake or Celeste THOUGHT Duncan killed Lilly, thus the coverup, when in reality it was someone else entirely.

Another point, the flashback scene, I want to know whether it was pre or pst Lilly's death. It's obvious post breakup, but I want more specifics!

Since it could just be he wanted Veronica there when he reportedly shouted her name in a fit, or maybe he knew something about her being in danger ie. the stalker photos.

fleurdelune · 02-16-2005, 05:14 PM

I also thought that this episode was great. I really enjoyed the mystery of the week and I absolutely loved the scenes between Veronica and Logan. They just made my day! I wasn't expecting anything special and I was very happy in the end. I'm glad Veronica decided to help Logan. They both seem to be acting a little nicer towards each other which can only bring them closer, I hope.

sugarplum · 02-16-2005, 07:52 PM

I'm guessing that the flash back of the bathroom with the gossiping girls was post-breakup, pre-Lilly's death. Basing this on the way that high school gossip works, if Lilly had been dead at that point, Veronica and Duncan's breakup would have been old news. They would have been making up stories about Lilly rather than talking about how they were surprised that they had lasted that long and spreading rumors of Duncan being crazy.

Veronica and Duncan had probably JUST broken up either that day or the day before.

***Lizzie*** · 02-16-2005, 08:07 PM

I think in that flashback we were starting to see the Veronica we know now break through from the old naive Veronica. It took strength to actually go out and not hide in the stall until they were gone. That is just a flash of the strength we now see in Veronica.

thuggie8 · 02-17-2005, 12:25 AM

This week's episode was awesome ... for all the reasons stated already of course. I love how the show can deal with multiple storylines and do it right. So many shows screw it up but Veronica Mars not only DOESN'T suck, but it advances it even more and makes you join the madness. I love it!

Weevil, Logan, and Veronica all had kick ass scenes and the whole 'rim job' and 'deep throat' exchange has definitely become a classic in my book.

Oh yea, that one scene with the ink attack ...

and Keith had only a couple of scenes, but he was awesome!

I just wanted to give Logan a big hug. Man, Jason was on last night. And honestly, I can ship anyone with Veronica, but after last night's ep, I'm begining to join the LoVe boat. Although I'm a big Leo fan ...

And it seems like I'm the only one who digs the fella ...

Next week's episode looks really interesting.I'm excited to see Alyson

and speaking of Alyson, it looks like she will be back for another stint in the season as well. Pop over to NeptuneSite for more info.

FAIT_Accompli · 02-17-2005, 01:45 AM

-insert evil laugh here-

I see we're starting to get more Logan/Veronica fans coming out of the woodwork now.

It certainly does seem to be pointing to Duncan now though, in regards to Lily's murder, doesn't it?

Personally, I'm still far from convinced. I immediatly caught onto the "violent outbursts" sympton that Veronica read, which made it seem like an obvious scapegoat to me. But, who knows. Having the brother kill his own sister would be hard to pull off, especially without a stable motive. Could the Veronica Mars team of writers pull it off? I'm confident that they'd find a way. I'm just not convinced at the moment that they'd do it.

The one question I'm now left with is ... what's Abel's motive for taking the murder wrap? If he's dying, why would he spend his last few (I'm guessing months) in prison? Whoever's responsible for his confession can't be paying him with money, because what good is money if you're dead? I think there's more to Abel than we know. Maybe he knows something about Veronica or someone else in town. I don't know ... the more I see of Abel, the more I'm convinced he could be the key to connecting all the mysteries we're currently contending with.

Cruel Irony · 02-17-2005, 05:34 AM

All this evidence that points to Duncan leads me to believe he's not the killer...

I wonder if Weidman or someone is going to get into contact with Abel somehow... and if they find out Veronica knows, she could very well be in actual danger.

YellowRose · 02-18-2005, 12:58 PM

My new favorite episode.

I really liked how Logan always looked around whenever he was near Veronica... as if he doesn't want anyone to see him.

My only hope is that Lynn really is alive because I think that would be an awesome chance for Logan and Veronica to continue to interact... maybe the mystery could fall into season 2.

TrinIty · 02-19-2005, 02:37 PM

Is it possible for Lilly and Veronica to be half sisters? I mean they mentioned once that Lilly's mom doesn't care about her that much and that Duncans dad and Veronica's Mom were sweethearts at one point in time.They are the same age aren't they? What if they had some secret affair?

UnsilentMajorty · 02-19-2005, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrinIty

Is it possible for Lilly and Veronica to be half sisters? I mean they mentioned once that Lilly's mom doesn't care about her that much and that Duncans dad and Veronica's Mom were sweethearts at one point in time.They are the same age aren't they? What if they had some secret affair?

This is definitely pluasible and is in fact being hinted at by the writers with the whole Abel Koontz line of "Look in the mirror, Veronica Mars. Do you think you're the product of a Schloppy sheriff, or the king and queen of the prom?"

Veronica also thinks that she and Duncan may also be half-siblings since she threw up (literally) at the very thought once Abel Koontz after he said what he said to her (above).

So, it IS possible.

The question is... Is it true or not? And or to what degree if it is true? Hmm...

Cruel Irony · 02-19-2005, 07:04 PM

After thinking that the theory that Veronica and Lilly were half-sisters was cool, I realized it's not possible.

If Lilly was Lianne's daughter, everyone would know, because Celeste wouldn't have been pregnant and Lianne would.