JustMe2000

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1. No passing judgement or mocking the fans of characters or ships. Do not shame another poster for liking something you do not.
2. Please use constructive criticism. Try to focus on the episode itself. We encourage you to use our anti-threads if you need to express your overall dislike of a character or couple, especially since other boards at do not allow them. Take advantage of them here.
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4. Promos that air on television as well as online articles by reputable sources are not considered spoilers are are open for speculation. For more detailed information on spoilers read this thread.


But I know that I'll get through this
'Cause I know that I am strong
I don't need you anymore

Astroman129

Ooh. Notice how the assault episode was called "unbelievable" and this one is "believe"? Hmmph. I see what you did there.

Also, let me cry a bit.

kaleidocat

Ooh cool idea to include the Previously on Degrassi image JustMe.

And Astroman beat me to sharing that image of Zoe. I almost jumped up and down with excitement when I saw it - Ana is the queen of angst. I love and hate it when she is upset. Those eyes!



I can't wait to see the other promo pics from this episode.


Kitty Hall today in Seattle! (this post needed some cats to show support for ZoZo)

Astroman129

This episode took my heart, clenched it and... spilled it all over the floor. I'll post my full opinion later, but just one thing...

Could this be... fanservice? I mean, S8 of Degrassi is unanimously considered one of the worst seasons, so... maybe they threw us a bone here. Must I remind everyone from Tristan's eclare line from one of the first episodes of the season? Hmmph.

kaleidocat

Just a few random thoughts about what stuck out to me during tonight's episode:

I loved Zoe's dream sequence! She feels so taken advantage of by the boys who assaulted her and also by the media. I'm curious who she will be when this is all over with. It is going to get worse before it gets better. Hang in there Zoe. Was anyone else reminded of Gary Busey when they saw Luke grinning? That was horrifying!

I really enjoyed how the dialogue from previous scenes connected with the next ones with emphasis on words like "no" to serve impact.

If you ever need advice, don't go to Tristan.

Drew and Becky! I still have a strong hunch that Drew could help turn this case around for Zoe. But I was giggling a little bit at how the teacher takes their phones, hands them a compass, and then they get lost after dark and no one cares. Oh Degrassi!

I don't want to admit how annoyed and involved I am in this Zig/Maya/Miles triangle. You are going to break our hearts either way TPTB.

This episode was great at showing how desperate and confused Becky and Zoe are. I'm worried for them both. TeenNick promo teased with Zoe with a handful of pills next episode.

Astroman129

[PROMO SPOILER ALERT]

okay so I checked the official spoilers thread, and it seems that I'm allowed to mention this. Forgive me if I'm not.

In the Teennick promo (yes it was aired/broadcast on TV), Zoe is seen with a handful of pills saying she wants to wither away, and she throws a camera on the ground and shatters it. My guess is that she loses the trial and tries to commit suicide, but Maya/Miles/Frankie/Keisha/Tristan finds her and makes sure she's safe, when Maya explains to her what happened to Cam or something. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if that happens considering how they seem to be working with continuity (Jennifer from Drew's recent plot, and now Vince from this plot, who hasn't been seen since S11 after he shot Adam or whatever).

[PROMO SPOILER ALERT]

Maple Crunch

I think there are spoiler tags to wrap around your post astroman. I don't watch promos or read spoilers to avoid knowing what's going to happen, pls don't make it more difficult.

I'm not going to type out a huge paragraph of what i felt during this episode because i would have to feel something. This episode took almost all of what i enjoyed from Unbelievable and threw it away and instead chose to focus on pandering to the tumblr audience and going out of their way to make the situation seem as hopeless as possible for Zoe instead of just telling a good story.

- Maya and Miles existing has no place in this story

- is that the same vince as in season 11? if so, why wasn't he the figure representing the gang the whole time? An established bastard villain who is manipulative and violent. Seems like a strange choice to just have him show up out of nowhere.

- I don't know if i'm alone here, but in terms of the main plot of Unbelievable, Zoe was the least interesting part to me. I was infinitely more interested in what Becky was up to and how Becky would handle it because she was actually doing things. She was making things happen, Zoe had things happen to her, and there is a difference when it comes to emotion in a story. Becky is the emotional centerpiece, but she was absent almost the entire episode.

- Ana Golja and Sara Waisglass are two great actresses, but the way both were written were mud.

- I'm not a law student, i don't know how a courtroom really works and i don't know anything about the system, but the lawyer in this episode was absolutely ridiculous. She was combative, lead witnesses, is manipulative, and in general just a slimy person, and I get that she's supposed to be like that, but it's basically a cartoon at this point. I get that prosecution going after abuse victims is meant to seem like all hope is lost, because the prosecution is always a woman and the victim is also always a woman, but even in the past, when the lawyers would get too aggressive, the lawyer on the victim's side would always object because it's absurd.

- Tristan is cringeworthy in literally every scene he was in. I was disgusted by all of his contributions.

- Why is Drew suggesting that Becky take her brother's side to keep him around, and then using Adam to convince her further? You'd also think that mentioning Adam with Becky might be saved for something more significant and be more emotional, but no. It was a passing reference and it will never come up again.

- Every action Zoe took in this episode was stupid, and i get that she's supposed to feel hopeless by the end, but nothing about it felt organic. Even when Manny would act in a story and all seemed lost, it all felt like it was a reaction to a rational action. Degrassi basically wrote things to happen just to make everything seem hopeless, not because it is something that anyone would actually do. Whatever.

this episode was piss, and i hate being the guy to dislike it, because i know i'm alone.

Daisytiffz

I agree that I felt it was really off putting to have drew tell Becky she needs to take her brothers side. Drew usually has better advice than that. Didn't like that scene at all.

Nekoshoujo

^ I don't think that's quite what Drew was saying.

I wish this had been a special hour long episode because that ending was whoa! I really liked most of this episode even though it was hard to watch. When Tristan was encouraging Zoe to talk to the press I almost shook my laptop. NOOOOO! But honestly I completely understood her need to tell her story. Anyone in that situation would want to and when your fifteen you don't have the impulse control not to.

The final two scenes were great.

The Becky/Drew scene had a lot of what I was looking for all season. I think Degrassi tends to get a lot out of unusual pairings in unusual circumstances. In this case I think Drew gave Becky a very different perspective on her situation than she's been getting and that was great because he addressed the emotion that everyone seems to be talking around. I hope that we see more of this conversation when we pick back up with part two. Plus it was a great time to mention Adam and the loss Drew is dealing with without milking anything for dramatic effect.

The Zoe dream scene was better than most Degrassi dream scenes. These kinds of scenes can feel cliche but since Zoe was feeling so out of control it worked. And Ana sold it, the last line from the reporter being the only dialog from that scene and then ending on it packed a punch. I think that's first time in like three season I've actually felt my stomach tense up watching this show.


Other stuff:

- Is Zig's plot turning into Degrassi meets the Wire? Vince is back! He's bad but I'm not sure he's Marlo Stanfield caliber.

- Handing someone that kind of package in broad daylight in front of a school you know is big on security? Canada needs to step up its game.

- Maya loves Miles? The fact she talked to Zig means this love triangle is far from over (as if we didn't know anyway) which makes me sad. I wish Zig would listen to himself. Maya's great and all but there are other fish in the sea.

- Looking back at season 11 would you have thought we'd ever see Clare begging to be Immy's woodland hiking partner?

- awww, Imogen called Becky her bestie. I love those two.

- Sarah is doing a good job with this Becky storyline. She's not going over the top with it but you can just tell Becky is all twisty on the inside. She hasn't been the same since this happened. Even in her happy moments there's a kind of defeat written into her face. The second she's not busy with something there's no way to avoid it. It's not the kind of storyline I thought they'd give her going into the season. But I think it was a great choice. Plus it's something a little different than the more predictable Adam-changed-my-view-on-the-LGBT-community-and-now-I'm-besties-with-a-bisexual-girl storyline. I think this makes for a much more interesting inner battle of conscience verses family.

- The media stuff was really hard to watch, but I do think it was basically all pretty true to life. Once those videos got thrown out it became a he-said/she-said case and those are never pretty.


- Vince: The Reckoning O_____O

JustMe2000

This episode had me asking some questions......

The little bit with the unfortunately named Vince had me wondering what exactly this program's plan to help Zig and Tiny get out of this gang? I mean, is there a way that they're going to help them deal with the obvious threats that would come in that situation? Working at a posh restaurant isn't going to help with that. And, how is Tiny dealing with all this stuff? What was the point of bringing him into the program if you're just going to forget about him? Also, they had that brief bit at the very beginning and then didn't do anything until well into the second main segment. Why did they even bother with having this plot in this episode if they were going to give it such a little amount of time?

Perino's a History teacher, so what in the world was that project he was leading? Is that supposed to be Degrassi's version of the Boy Scouts? And as mentioned, it was 10:00 at night and no one was even looking for Drew and Becky. Priceless.

Miles seems to be using this shirts and placards idea to get back on the good side of Maya. Shouldn't he be feeling a little more...conflicted about his own role in what happened to Zoe? He threw the party where it happened and left her drunk and passed out in the pool house. I'm not the biggest fan of his character, but I chalk this up to bad writing more than anything. As a character, he deserved better.

I gotta say I hated the way the Prosecutor just basically sat there like a bump on a log while the defense attorney ripped Zoe to shreds. And since I've watched more than a few Law & Order (and even some SVU) episodes over the years, I had trouble buying what I was seeing. Gotta love that they actually had Zoe practice her statement at the Dot of all places.

Then there's that reporter, who interviewed a minor about sexual assault, without her mother or lawyer present. Seeing that really pissed me off. Oh, and Zoe, as mentioned, don't listen to Tristan in these situations.

There were some really good things about this episode, though:

-The aforementioned editing of having one bit of dialogue lead into another gave a nice, if hectic flow to the episode.
-Clare being so zealous about Luke was, I thought, a great bit of continuity, given her own recent history with Asher, as well as her sister's rape many years ago.
-I thought Drew telling Becky that he wouldn't judge her for supporting her brother made sense and they did a good job of explaining why he would feel that way. He's also had a little history in being a social piranha, so I think that might have played a part in his advice. Either way, I did enjoy their scene.
-The scene with Zoe and Frankie confronting each other outside the courtroom was outstanding, and showed that with Sara and Ana, this show is in good hands as they head into the future.
-The dream sequence at the end was fabulous. One of the best things Stefan has directed on this show. That was a great gut punch to end the episode with.

I do think overall this episode worked, although I agree it probably would play better if we saw both parts. All three characters featured tonight were completely lost and confused about what seems on the surface, to be impossible situations. Again, a Degrassi episode with a shared theme between the plots.

MegaJ

F you Tristian, Degrassi season 8 was good. So sick of everyone hating on it, it was a rebuilding year and the old cast HAD TO GO. Ugh. Anyway.

This episode didn't work in some parts, but I thought it was overall good. Ugh at everything at the trial. I was feeling elated after Unbelievable/Sad But True, but it looks like the show is crashing this whole storyline back down to Earth. I realize it's realistic, but I do want them to show that sometimes these rapists DO get caught as not to completely deter people reporting these crimes. Anyway.

A-Plot. While I'm not feeling Ana's hair, she did some of her best acting here. Like I said, some of the logistics didn't really here in terms of the law stuff. The prosecutor meeting up with Zoe and her mom at the freaking Dot, the reporter interviewing Zoe with her mom present (though looking at Ms. Rivas, that's easier to believe), etc. The overall plot made up for it, with Zoe facing the insurmountable odds just to prove two boys took advantage of her and the mini-commentary on how awful the media is when it comes to covering rape/sexual assault.

B-Plot. Poor Becky. Now that I think about it, she and Drew do make a lot of sense together but I hope they won't put them together too soon. The Adam mention was really needed here and Drew was also good here - that he understood just what Becky was going through and just how much Drew misses Adam (I suppose in retrospect, a lot of what Drew did this season can be chalked up to him not quite processing Adam's death). I also liked Clare here for the part in the classroom, given her experiences with Asher and also Darcy being date-raped.

C-D Plot. Well, I'm glad Maya is done leading Zig on though I'm betting we're going to get an unrequited love switcheroo soon. I thought we needed more of Miles agonizing over his testimony but I did like how they tied it to his feelings over Maya and his little secret. As for Zig's plot, I can only say holy crap to seeing Vince again. I guess shooting someone doesn't get you much time in prison in Canada. It's stuff like this that makes me like the show more, just like a couple of episodes ago, we saw Asher's protege interviewing the Hollingsworth. Next we'll probably see Soccerstud in the parking lot waiting for Riley, or Shelia the Caf Lady trying to get her job back or LoveQueen16 trying to mack on Hunter.

Oh and I know it was thrown out, but why is no one talking to Grace about her obtaining the video and why isn't she offering to testify? Ugh this show.

Nekoshoujo

I'm kinda hoping this was just setting up a bigger plot in the next episode. I didn't mind that too much since we just have a nice block of Zig and had left the Zoe/Becky stuff on the backburner for awhile.

Yeah. I think that they've had the same problem with Miles all season. They set up all these great emotional storylines for him: daddy issues, inadvertently letting a friend get assaulted, the whole Tristan thing, and they ignore their own set up to focus on the most boring aspects of his character. It's just really sad at this point because I think Eric could make Miles a lot more interesting than he is now.

I can't even with any of this!

I feel like they missed a big opportunity to talk about how social media has changed rape and assault cases involving minors which is has because these cases are still supposed to be held in closed court - but there's the press sitting in the front row at Zoe's trial so I guess realism isn't a factor here. Some recent cases have touched on this by having identities of victims and the accussed leaked because of facebook and instagram and that kind of thing. But instead they kinda played up the reputation angle -which I think was a good thing because that's what women who report assaults always face- but kinda made everything seem really unprofessional.


I really liked this too. Especially because we never saw any follow up with Clare and either of those things. But we knew exactly why she was so passionate about this.

I really hope that they continue these two as a core friendship for the future. I think this was another scene that could have just as easily not worked - and seemed melodramatic or something - had Ana and Sara not been so good with the emotional material.


But we wins back some points for the SVU mention.
So I'm not the only one that noticed this?
Me too! I feel like I felt the opposite way the first few times around with this plot but the lack of follow through with people like Asher and KC's coach has left the scoreboard completely uneven. When was last time we saw any of these sickos actually pay for their crimes? And with Luke to showcase this it would have had an even bigger effect. Plus what exactly are they going to do if Luke gets away with it and comes back to school. The writers must know he's never going to win over the fans now... well maybe they don't the Degrassi audience is very forgiving. I just think it'll be weird. But mostly it makes me angry that the message seems to be don't bother trying to get justice because you won't win. You might win. You should at least try.
When they mention that the video got thrown out of court because it was found without a warrant... Okay on face value, kinda WTF on a second look. I feel like Zoe's defense must not be trying at all because they could have made a good case for eventual discovery. The video was on Luke's phone. Luke being a suspect would have made the police get a warrent for his phone at some point. Video found.

But whatever, in made up soap opera court the rules of reality don't play here.

lasha4god

Some general thoughts ...

Miles and Maya was a little misplaced in this episode.

The logistics of the court case, how both the prosecution and defense were showcased - it didn't work for me. It was overstated caricatures and circumstances to push forward the narrative. And how did the judge not reprimand both her and the media for breaking the gag order!?!

That said I valued how Zoe’s POV played out. And the dream was gut-wrenching.

I’m assuming Vince will intersect with Drew – if not then this is a wasted use of a returning character. Vince is working on fear tactics to keep Zig in line. I feel though if Zig would just be honest with his program mentors this could be handled in some way.

The biggest surprise for me, and pleasantly so, was having Drew’s POV. I’m going to lean towards the notion that Drew wasn’t specifically saying she should take his side or that what her brother did wasn’t assault. It was more a matter of hearing him out, listening to him. She had at least that option and Drew wouldn’t have wanted her to take that for granted considering.

Now if this is used as a spring board to Drew and Becky as some sort of romantic pairing or hook-up I’ll be disappointed.

Inesal

It would not just be disappointing. It would be imbecilic. It already seems the show's writers got hoodwinked into dumping the Imogen and Becky route. Now to jump on the Drew is irresistible to all women bandwagon again. They might as well spit on Adam's memory to have his own brother getting it on with Becky.

Maple Crunch

Ding. Exactly.