Bethany Joy - Episode Discussion 7.05: Joy/Haley in "Your Cheatin’ Heart." - Page 4

Ms. · 10-12-2009, 08:45 PM

My thing about Quinn is that she's so self centered. It feels like she's the one making her own problems, even when they deal with other people. Like, David will try and understand, but she won't explain it. Then she acts all intense because of the way things are going. It's like, if you'd talk to someone, maybe you wouldn't have any problems. She just seems like she's making herself weak and only thinking about herself in the situation she created and I can't sympathize with her or pity her. Does that make sense? I don't think I've even explained it right, but there's something about her that's just so annoying. It's a perfectly human way to be and all, but it's just not that great when you are a new character. I feel like Quinn is supposed to be a certain character that is lovable and fun, but what's overpowering that character right now is her less positive characteristics and that's why she's almost coming off a little fake. I think she's created her own problems and won't really let anyone help or sort through them, but she'll still complain or freely talk about them. It's not working for me. I like Alex because she's supposed to be a bitch that's hated, but Quinn is just a bitch in La La Land. IDK if what I'm trying to say is really being said LOL, hens the huge paragraph.

I did like her a few times in tonight's episode though, I will admit. I'm glad Jamie asked the questions he did. It gave a little insight. She's looking older now too which is a good thing. I'm stiiiiiiill loving the idea of Quinn, but she needs a serious revival.

JULIAN was adorable tonight.

NALEY was good. I like that we got communication and that there were a few "Aww" moments to add to the Wonderful List of Naleyness.

I think David's cute.

Millie and Alex are still on good terms with me LOL.

I don't mind Mouth a whole lot. I did sometimes use his parts as a chance to walk around/get/do something in my house though.

Aaaaaand, of course, Joy. Heee. I love her. She is so owning. There was one point where she said something totally bitchy that I was reminded of Marni! She was fierce, adorable, etc. It was a really sad episode for her tonight.

Something else might come to mind later.

LHScott · 10-12-2009, 08:56 PM

^ I really liked the way you described the problem with Quinn right now and you made total sense.

Peyton Scott · 10-12-2009, 09:02 PM

OMG Julie I`m laughing so much at your post

Dude you`re funny!

I get what you`re trying to say about Quinn. I think it was really immature when she made David think that she slept with Clay. Um really Quinn, you`re 12 now?

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Millie and Alex are still on good terms with me LOL.

I couldn`t stop laughing when Alex ate the lime while Millie took the shot

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I don't mind Mouth a whole lot. I did sometimes use his parts as a chance to walk around/get/do something in my house though.

I just thought he was being a little irrational with the whole Millie being a model business.

Anatreehill · 10-12-2009, 09:12 PM

I really liked this episode. I was expecting more drama in the arrest scene but I really liked both NH reactions. Nathan being protective but knowing he had to be there for Jamie. I'm glad we finally got a scene where NH actually talked and shared their thoughts. Loved when she surprised Nathan at the conference, showing she was there for him.

I liked the HQ scene, especially the little pinky thing, but the " a lot of drama at Nathan and Haley's" line was just unbelievable!!! Your sister totally needs you right now and you cant be there for her. It's just really selfish.

I'm looking forward to the episodes to come. Cant wait to see what the number on Nathan's bill means and 'cuz I think that the talk with Renee only served to make Haley go into tutor mode, and to try get to the bottom of everything.

LHScott · 10-12-2009, 09:23 PM

Well I'm glad Haley had so many scenes and with different characters, that's really great. Can't wait to watch the eppy.

Scheming Star · 10-12-2009, 10:12 PM

Today episode was just wow. Haley being arrested and being sent to jail with full of women who talked about their cheating husbands, boyfriends, etc. I surely don't blame that girl for having doubts about Nathan's word. I mean with Renee's phone number to "prove it" and those women from jail, yeah that girl must be having doubts. She wouldn't be human without any concerns, you know.

I love that Jamie finally got to say something about Haley because most of time he has always talked about his dad, but now he's all about his mom so that's so good.

I honestly don't care if Quinn has slept with Clay or not, but what she did was beyond disrespectful to David, beyond, if you ask me. I can't look at that girl and feel otherwise. Yes she's Haley's sister, but her attitude stinks. Does she keep crying like that every time she brings David up in the conversation? And to let David thinking that she has slept with him was so wrong, so wrong on so many levels. How far would she go on her length to end her marriage like that?! It's kinda immature if you ask me. How can David walk away with brokenheart and lives with pain like that?! Just tell him that it's over, at least. But she had to pull a stunt like that it's so ridiculous.

As for David bonding with Nathan and Jamie were pretty cool so that's how I got to like him and respect him even more than Quinn. And poor guy has fought as heck to save his marriage, even Nathan encouraged him to but yeah, Quinn is being immature than Haley which is why Nathan is lucky to have a wife like her, unlike David.

Clay and Quinn at the end of scene kinda pissed me off because first of all, Clay's job is to be loyal to Nathan no matter what, yet he chose to lie to his face and did it for Quinn. I mean was it supposed to be his job to be loyal and completely honest with Nathan no matter what, right?! Apparently he would rather choose Quinn to lie like that so what kind of guy he is? Really? And to have Quinn complain about NH's drama? How could she?! I mean it's her freaking sister for god's sakes and yet she would rather to have peaceful than dealing with them, being there for Haley in time of needs? No, she's thinking of herself. She is really selfish because how could she do this to her own sister, not only her, but to make Clay lie to Nathan like that? She made him do that and did it to herself. Urgh. What a fail!

**joypiter** · 10-12-2009, 11:47 PM

I will dip into this Quinn thing even if we should probably concentrate on Haley.

I have to disagree with most people here who say that she is in the wrong. I understood her more in this episode when she was saying that once you stop with the little things, the big things stop to and what is there after that to hold a marriage together? We don't know where David has been before this. Maybe he is fighting for it now but how do we know that Quinn didn't fight for it before? Maybe she did and maybe he didn't care and now it's too late. I really don't think it's fair to just lay it on her. Do I love David? Yes I really like the guy but truth is, we don't really know what he has done and not done. I think we need to see more of their past together before judging either one of them. Either way, maybe I just really like Quinn and Haley so I try to balance the positives and negatives.

With that being said, I really loved the Haley and Quinn scene in this episode and I really felt like Quinn was older this time. IMO, the chemistry has grown and I loved the little pinky swear and hug. It was adorable and I also loved seeing Quinn and Jamie interact as well.

Moving on to Haley, I can definitely see why she would start doubting Nathan in this. I think any person would if they constantly hear the same thing and then it starts feeling like the truth. People play mindgames all the time and being surrounded by it....well it's not easy to not start doubting. So I don't blame her for it at all. Can I also see why Nathan would be upset that Haley is doubting him? Yes but he should see her side of it too and this is where I think that communication is lacking again. I wish they wouldn't have cut the whole "what happened that night" talk, which I assume they did in 703. I think it was a mistake and it wouldn't be the first time the writers disregard any communication between Nathan and Haley. I can also see why Jamie would be scared that his parents won't "love each other anymore".

I loved the scene with Haley, Nathan and Clay in jail and them surrounding her. She looked so small between them. Awws I just loved it for some reason. The press conference scene reminded me of season 4 when Haley stood by Nathan after the point shaving and when she took his hand at the end of that episode. And regarding Renee, she seems to be a good manipulator but I still think she is lying The number doesn't prove anything but again, I can definitely see why Haley would be doubting at this point.

**killed the lights** · 10-12-2009, 11:59 PM

So I FINALLY got to watch the episode! I actually really liked it, more than I thought I would. Everything I wanted to get out of this episode, I did. We FINALLY got NH talking about what happened, even if it was just for a little bit. We finally got Quinn asking HALEY how things were. I really enjoyed this one, dare I say it 5/5? WOOT!

I really liked the NH tonight. We got talking, fighting, and affection all in the same ep. I loved when Nathan was saying "You're not taking my wife!" When the police came to get her. Protective Nathan FTW! I loved how NH walked out of the police station holding hands too <3 Those little things we were talking about we haven't seen much of this season (the side hugs, the holding hands) we got that this episode. Loved it. And the NH kiss at the press conference, aww. I knew Haley would go support him, there was no doubt in my mind. Always by each others side these two.

And Haley's insecurities, I TOTALLY get them. Like if you had someone chewing your ear off about how their husband cheats and every man is a liar and cheater, you'd question things too, no matter how solid your relationship is. And Haley said she still believed him, which she does, she just wants to know where Renee got this idea from. MOST PEOPLE (who are smart anyway) wouldn't pull this shiz out of thin air, and after Haley's chat with Renee and the jail birds, she was really wondering where this all came from. And I get why Nathan would get and too, Haley is the one person that has been with him throughout it all and believed him, and she's the most important person who NEEDS to believe him. And when he thinks she's starting to doubt him, he's get mad understandably. I loved Nathan's scene with David later on when he said he doesn't blame Haley for feeling that way, because it shows it was just a heat of the moment issue, which happens to everyone.

And can I get a WOOT WOOT for an HQ scene that FINALLY showed Quinn asking about Haley's problems and making me believe she was the older sister? Score! I loved when she came in and was like "uh oh, Haley at the piano." Like I can totes see Haley going to the piano when she had a bad day back in their house years ago. I loved Haley asking Quinn for advice, because we finally saw Quinn show her older sister side. Her more experience in life and with men. And her saying that NH are a different couple than DQ, TRUE. I also liked that we found out a little more why she doesn't love David anymore. I still don't think it's reason enough for divorce, but we did get more insight into what she was thinking, and that's awesome. How Quinn said she misses the little things and how that led to the big things not occurring either. And then the pinky swear and the "We're James girls" quote, HEE! I just got a hell of a lot more love for these two.

Some other rando things I enjoyed, Nathan on team DQ, HOLLER! Even though I feel like it's not his place, i liked that he tried to tell Clay to stay away from Quinn. Nathan knows that DQ need to work things out before ANYTHING happens between QC, and I agree. I thought the Haley/Jamie scene at the end was adorable, when he asked her to stay. He was worried about his mom, aww. I love Jamie's screentime this season, limited but useful. PERF. I also thought it was hilar when news guy said "best hit to come out of rockstar Haley James Scott in 5 years." Ouchhh, LOL. SO untrue. Feel This?! Come onnnn.

And about the Quinn leaving to go to Clay's, umm I kind of get it. Like I don't think she left because she didn't want to help her sister, or 'deal' with her sister's problems, but I think she did want to give NH time alone to talk about it. When Quinn came, she didn't KNOW that this Renee thing was going to happen, so she was really there for the whole thing. And yeah I'm sure she was gone some of the time, but I think the MAIN reason she did it was to give NH time together, just them and Jamie to deal with all of this. The talk with Haley on the piano made her realize that. I think her mention of Haley and Nathan's 'drama' to Clay was just a way to sum it up and not get into the details. And it's not like Quinn isn't going to be there for Haley. Just because she doesn't live there doesn't mean she abandoned her. They are still sisters, who live in Tree Hill, who will still probably see each other everyday.

So yes, overall I really liked it! P.S - Joy looked HELLA gorgeous throughout this WHOLE episode. Her hair, her blue/white dress, her black dress, everything. This woman is a spitfire.

ETA:

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Maybe he is fighting for it now but how do we know that Quinn didn't fight for it before?

EXACTLY. I loved that the show kind of brought that up, because I never really thought about that before, that David may be saying "I love you" now, but when was the last time he said it before then? I do like David, and I think that Quinn should try and work things out with him, but I keep forgetting that's we;re only seeing David POST Quinn leaving, and not what he was like before.

**joypiter** · 10-13-2009, 12:12 AM

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Some other rando things I enjoyed, Nathan on team DQ, HOLLER! Even though I feel like it's not his place, i liked that he tried to tell Clay to stay away from Quinn. Nathan knows that DQ need to work things out before ANYTHING happens between QC, and I agree.

Agreed. I love this so much because to me it just shows how much Nathan has grown since we first saw him and how he really values marriage or two people not moving onto anything before everything else is resolved.

UnsettleMyHeart · 10-13-2009, 06:08 AM

I really enjoyed this week's Haley scenes.
I totally felt with her when she was having all these doubts, but it was good to see NH talking about their problems. The scene I enjoyed the most was the Haley/Jamie scene. He was worried about his mom and didn't talk only about his dad. I smiled when she told Jamie that her relationship with Nathan is something really special. It was cute

It was a sad, but good episode in my opinion.

WildcatNaleyFan · 10-13-2009, 10:56 AM

Five for five!

I found it funny that after I watched the episode I had to remind myself what day it is and what is happening this week in my life. I'm so engrossed in this show! I haven't been this way in years!

I absolutely adored the HQ scene. I even rewinded the ending

. I disagree about Quinn making the conversation about her and David. Because it was Haley who brought up DQ. And that's completely plausible. If your sister's marriage is on the edge of ending, and your marriage is being tested then it makes all the sense in the world to have insecurities. Especially if it's your older sister. Even if she doesn't realize it, I'm sure Haley looks up to Quinn in some ways . But the ending of that scene was kickass! "We're James girls" and then the pinky promise thing

. As a sister, Quinn is forgiven in my book for her lack of interest in Haley's problems up until now.
I wasn't annoyed with the "there's a lot of drama in Nathan and Haley's house" until I came here. But IDK... I know that Quinn is supposed to be there for Haley. But Quinn doesn't know that Renee put all those "seeds of doubt" in Haley's mind and she doesn't know about the conversation in jail.

What DID annoy me about something that Quinn did/didn't do that pertained to Haley... was her reaction to her baby sister being in jail. I sure as hell know that if my sister's husband ever said "your sister's in jail. Watch over our son" I wouldn't just be like "

" and then walk to the door with my sister's kid at hand. First I'd make sure to get some information "WHAT THE HELL IS SHE DOING IN JAIL!" would be more of my reaction.
And yes, I agree that it was immature of her to let David believe she slept with Clay. That was really low. I was waiting for her to add "... but I didn't sleep with him" after David's question of "Did you stay the night at his house?".

MOVING ON.

Haley. Haley. Haley. Haley! hehe...

. I love this woman to no end. I loved the begining scene where they were watching that clip together (

for the 'hit' line... I so didn't connect 'hit' with 'music hit' while listening to it... I just remembered her slapping the girl in season three. I thought that's what the person meant) . And then once Haley said "the tooth brush police" I was like "

NO! DON'T SAY POLICE!!!!!". And then the police came to the door

. I loved that we got a reaction out of Nathan though.

The bitch coming to visit Haley... (*sigh*). I got to hand it to her though, she's a good manipulator... that line with "You're just trying to protect your family. Just like I am". I mean, that 0.000000000001% that Nathan cheated might make that line that much more important (that percentage that might be in Haley's mind, I mean)... because if this is all true, Haley is bitching at this girl for doing the same thing she is. Obviously it's not true, but I'm just saying what might be going through Haley's mind. Dont know if this made any sense.

Just have to say, that when that hooker said about guys going for the "innocent mother" look... girl, you've got no idea how un-innocent Hales could look. A firecracker indeed!

I love that right after the "we're James girls" scene, we got "is this the support group for James girls' husbands"

. And then "I want a double of what he's having" "Double water it is"

. I really liked the David/Nathan scene. And I love that Nathan DID bring up season two. And that he said that even though he let her go, he never came up hope. Which is amazing... even though I'm sure a lot of NH fans didn't like that he said that he "let her go"... I didn't mind because if you look at how much of a mess he was without Haley in season two, you can see that letting her go was the hardest thing he ever had to do in his life. Going from acting up in school, drinking, etc etc... to being completely distant from everyone.

Poor Jamie for hearing the conversation between Haley and Nathan. I loved the conversation and that there was angst. And poor Nathan with his exit-line. (*sigh*). It's just such a sad situation!

Speaking of Jamie, that Jamie/David scene was cute! I

that Jamie was excited to see him and that David was like "I came to say hello to you!"

. The Scotts have a great dynamic with David! Can't we keep him? Please?

The Jamie/Quinn scene by the piano was nice. I love that he wanted to go see his momma!

. And then the Haley scene where the police car was in the trash

. Such a seven year-old thing to do! I loved that. Haley is such a good mom! And I love that Jamie had insecurities about his parents and Haley put all of those to rest. It's true, what Nathan and Haley have is beyond special

. That's why they hold my heart the way they do.

I felt really bad that Nathan wanted to go through the press conference alone! Poor guy. And then when she showed up and they held hands

.

I, too, love that Nathan is not on the Quinn/Clay ship. But I felt bad for Clay that Nate was jumping to conclusions. And, yes, it's not really Nathan's place to intervene but I think Clay should have told him that and not just sneak behind his back like that.

Poor Hales for finding the number. I was kind of surprised that was in the coda because they showed it in the promo. I wonder how Haley's going to approach it. Is she going to question Nathan at all? Not like "WHY DID YOU CALL HER?" but "How do you think she got your number?" type of thing... or is she just going to delve into this alone without talking to him first?

Not Haley-related... I don't care about Millie/Mouth (

), I don't really care for Millie/Alex... Alex/Julian are okay. I don't mind them but whatever. I was worried that Mia/Chase were going to have too many scenes

. I don't care for them BUT I did love that Chase was training to be a pilot. At first I was like "WTF? A pilot where did that come fro---- OH MY GOD! That season four episode!"

. I see the writers don't forget everything

MIRANDA!!!

I love her. But I was confused as to how she didn't hear about Haley's arrest. Wasn't it very public?

I can't wait for a second promo or anything about the next episode!

.

ETA: I forgot to mention how much I loved the scene where Nathan was shielding Haley from the press. It was great!

**Poupa** · 10-13-2009, 11:28 AM

I enjoyed Nathan/Haley's scenes a lot. It was great getting some scenes of them, talking, dealing with things together, even hugging and kissing. I missed that, and was glad to finally see it on screen.

I understand both Haley doubting or having a "what if" moment, it is expected and when you got people manipulating you and you're in a tough position like that. I also understand Nathan getting upset, or just disappionted, yet later he was totally understandable, because Haley is his biggest supporter and fan, and he didn't want to see her ever doubting him.

Haley/Quinn scene was so cute. I love seeing Quinn supporting her little sister, and talking to her in scenes like that.

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I understood her more in this episode when she was saying that once you stop with the little things, the big things stop to and what is there after that to hold a marriage together? We don't know where David has been before this. Maybe he is fighting for it now but how do we know that Quinn didn't fight for it before? Maybe she did and maybe he didn't care and now it's too late. I really don't think it's fair to just lay it on her. Do I love David? Yes I really like the guy but truth is, we don't really know what he has done and not done. I think we need to see more of their past together before judging either one of them. Either way, maybe I just really like Quinn and Haley so I try to balance the positives and negatives.

I agree, Caro. I don't hate Quinn, nor dislike her, even after last episode. I didn't like how she acted though, but this episode with her line about the little things that changed which results in big things changing too gives me the impression that maybe there is more than what we are seeing. Maybe stuff happened before that we don't know about that resulted in her totally disregarding giving any second chances.
I still feel bad for David though, despite the fact that I do like Clay/Quinn interaction.

ky16 · 10-13-2009, 05:54 PM

I really enjoyed a lot of last night's episode. I'm so glad that they finally showed us some quality scenes with NH. I liked that they showed Haley having some doubts and though Nathan was upset he later said that he understood at this point. I also really just adore the way they've been writing Jamie this season. He's there and he's involved but he's not the main player and he's not taking the storyline away from his parents. I loved his scene with Haley at the end so much and I really hope they continue to write him this way.

I also really really loved the scene between HQ. It was by far my favourite scene between the two of them so far. It was the little things about that scene that I really just adored and I agree Quinn really did seem like the older sister there. I loved Quinn leaning into Haley and whispering that her and Nathan would be okay and then at the end with the pinky swear. My only real complaint about Quinn this episode was that final line at Clay's house. I'm not going to lie on my first viewing that did not come off well to me but I think it was just a really poor choice of words from the writers. I did like Quinn's reasoning more this week about why her and David aren't working. I really feel like they may have hastily gotten married and then once the honeymoon period wore off the cracks started to show.

I also really want David to stick around, though. There was something so endearing about watching "the husbands of James girls" scene. It so nice to see them really exploring Haley's family this season because I've always felt it had so much untapped storyline potential.

Haley is really rocking this season and I'm loving that we're continuing to see so many different sides of her personality and so many different relationships that she has throughout the cast.

LHScott · 10-14-2009, 02:20 AM

NH: LOVE. LOVE. What Haley said to Jamie about their love?

Haley/Jamie:

One of the best scenes of the night. LOVE. Jamie asking for his mum and wanting her to stay with him longer? So adorable.

HQ: They had a great scene by the piano. The pinkie swear and the "We're James girls" was made of WIN.

David/Nathan: I really liked them. I really like David. LOL.

Nathan/Haley/Clay jail/press conference scenes: Once upon a time, Lucas would be on the other side. But you know what? I love Clay and I love his dynamic with NHJ, so I'am happy. Haley being protected by them both, her husband and friend. I also like that as they were leaving the jail you can see Nate hold her hand and Clay put his hand for a moment round her back. It still makes me wish it was Lucas, but Clay's great.

Nathan: He was in protective and angry mode, hot! LOL

Haley: Owns every episode. As always thank you Mark for giving her more to do. I loved that she had screen time and focus again in this ep. It's been Haley's year so far, hands down. I’m enjoying it because we all know it’s not going to last LOL. Haley feels like a main character this year, I'm afraid it won't last so I'm savouring every moment LOL.

I forgot to comment that the Haley/Quinn scene by the piano was amazing because we got to hear about Haley’s feelings. We never got that in past seasons and if we did certainly not during S5/S6. Such a contrast between S5 and S7. I don't think Haley ever shared her feelings about Nanny Carrie in S5. Seeing how this storyline is being treated in regards to Haley, makes me so happy they didn't make it like NC again. Good on Haley for expressing her fears to Quinn and aksing questions to Nathan. She's showing growth that one LOL. Love it!