[BlondieLeigh]

Never can be.

[stlavin95]

Definitely

[BlondieLeigh]

Not sure why they would think it's a good idea.

[stlavin95]

Me neither

[eternalfate]

Replying to Sam from the WM board since it was getting off topic for WM.

Originally Posted by stlavin95 (View Post) I would have rather her talking about Mark more anyways. Fair enough, and you love BL/JP too much to see mine. At least we agree on basically everything else OTH related

Actually I disagree with that. I love BL season 2-3 & 5. but I never denied LP love. I won't pretend that they never been in love.
I love JP the most and yes I always saw the love....

With LP, YES, I saw it in season 1 even more than BL... in season 2-3, I just didn't see Lucas being in love with Peyton at all...

But as I mentioned, we just see things different. For me, I can see things from ALL sides. Even ships I don't like. I can even see the Lindsay/Lucas love because of the time jump.

I can see all the relationships sides.

In my perfect world, it's JP and Brathan. lol

Although I didn't ship LP or BL in season 1, I saw the chemistry more with BL, HOWEVER, I saw the love more between LP, I don't think it was competition over who Lucas loved more....
Whoever thought Lucas loved Brook more than Peyton in season 1 was kidding themselves. lol

[BlondieLeigh]

Season 1 was obvious.

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by eternalfate (View Post) Replying to Sam from the WM board since it was getting off topic for WM. Actually I disagree with that. I love BL season 2-3 & 5. but I never denied LP love. I won't pretend that they never been in love. I love JP the most and yes I always saw the love.... With LP, YES, I saw it in season 1 even more than BL... in season 2-3, I just didn't see Lucas being in love with Peyton at all... But as I mentioned, we just see things different. For me, I can see things from ALL sides. Even ships I don't like. I can even see the Lindsay/Lucas love because of the time jump. I can see all the relationships sides. In my perfect world, it's JP and Brathan. lol Although I didn't ship LP or BL in season 1, I saw the chemistry more with BL, HOWEVER, I saw the love more between LP, I don't think it was competition over who Lucas loved more.... Whoever thought Lucas loved Brook more than Peyton in season 1 was kidding themselves. lol

I don't think that Lucas was in love with Peyton in S2/3, but at the same time I just don't really see how he was in love with Brooke with the way he was treating her throughout their relationship. That's why I saw their break up coming from a mile away, because despite of what Lucas said, his behaviour showed who was more important to him and that wasn't Brooke.

He may have loved and cared about Brooke, but what he claimed to feel about her and what he actually felt were pretty far apart, It's the exact same with Lucas/Lindsay too.

There was only really love between JP in season 2, since there was nothing romantic in season 1 and season 3 was pretty one sided for them considering Peyton ran to Jake because she didn't want to admit her feelings for Luke.

Luke barely cared for Brooke at all in S1, let alone loved her lol

[eternalfate]

Originally Posted by stlavin95 (View Post) I don't think that Lucas was in love with Peyton in S2/3, but at the same time I just don't really see how he was in love with Brooke with the way he was treating her throughout their relationship. That's why I saw their break up coming from a mile away, because despite of what Lucas said, his behaviour showed who was more important to him and that wasn't Brooke. He may have loved and cared about Brooke, but what he claimed to feel about her and what he actually felt were pretty far apart, It's the exact same with Lucas/Lindsay too. There was only really love between JP in season 2, since there was nothing romantic in season 1 and season 3 was pretty one sided for them considering Peyton ran to Jake because she didn't want to admit her feelings for Luke. Luke barely cared for Brooke at all in S1, let alone loved her lol

From what I watched, I think Lucas fell in love with Brooke in season 2 when he finally got to know her as a person whereas in season 1 it was all lust over being in love for Lucas because he was 100% devoted to being with Peyton but unfortunately after his relationship with Brooke, he sort of became a manwhore. In season 1 anyway. So, he wasn't suitable to be with anyone.

I think season 2-3 he was devoted to Brooke and around mid season 3 (ironically when Chad/Sophia started having their real life issues) things changed....

Jake/Peyton relationship was also cut short because of the actor not wanting to be upgraded to series regular but as a viewer it was the first time I saw Peyton as a very mature person and she was more likable with him than when she was with the Scott Brothers UNTIL season 4 for me. I loved that Jake was direct and didn't play any games and I guess Jake was sort of forced to grow up a lot quicker than many because he was a single parent and I think that's what Peyton fell in love with in Jake. She was physically attracted to him and than she loved the kind of father he was and I believed that he love fully never went away.

In season 1, I didn't see any love Lucas had for Brooke. He didn't care about sneaking around with Peyton but I loved that it was Peyton to not like what she was doing because she remmebered the friendship!
It was Lucas who didn't give a dam....

I couldn't take Lucas words for Peyton seriously in season 4 because it was the same recylced stuff he said to Brooke in season 3 about the woman he sees standing by his side in the end.
So, I didn't buy it because as you felt they should have built the love of Brucas better, I felt they should have built the Leyton love story better during season 4... Because it was looking like the love during season 3-4 was one sided when it came to Lucas/Peyton...

[BlondieLeigh]

I never saw Lucas as in love with Brooke. He certainly never acted like he was, and in early season 6 even implied he never was when talking to Jamie. He believed he did, but I never saw any evidence he actually did.

(ironically when Chad/Sophia started having their real life issues)

That's actually not true. Hilarie said at a convention once that Mark put BL back together after the RL split and it made things awkward. Probably because he was getting off on making Sophia uncomfortable, imo. Suggesting he split them because Sophia wanted it would suggest he gave a **** about what Sophia wanted, and considering how he treated people on this show, he clearly didn't.

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by eternalfate (View Post) From what I watched, I think Lucas fell in love with Brooke in season 2 when he finally got to know her as a person whereas in season 1 it was all lust over being in love for Lucas because he was 100% devoted to being with Peyton but unfortunately after his relationship with Brooke, he sort of became a manwhore. In season 1 anyway. So, he wasn't suitable to be with anyone. I think season 2-3 he was devoted to Brooke and around mid season 3 (ironically when Chad/Sophia started having their real life issues) things changed.... Jake/Peyton relationship was also cut short because of the actor not wanting to be upgraded to series regular but as a viewer it was the first time I saw Peyton as a very mature person and she was more likable with him than when she was with the Scott Brothers UNTIL season 4 for me. I loved that Jake was direct and didn't play any games and I guess Jake was sort of forced to grow up a lot quicker than many because he was a single parent and I think that's what Peyton fell in love with in Jake. She was physically attracted to him and than she loved the kind of father he was and I believed that he love fully never went away. In season 1, I didn't see any love Lucas had for Brooke. He didn't care about sneaking around with Peyton but I loved that it was Peyton to not like what she was doing because she remmebered the friendship! It was Lucas who didn't give a dam.... I couldn't take Lucas words for Peyton seriously in season 4 because it was the same recylced stuff he said to Brooke in season 3 about the woman he sees standing by his side in the end. So, I didn't buy it because as you felt they should have built the love of Brucas better, I felt they should have built the Leyton love story better during season 4... Because it was looking like the love during season 3-4 was one sided when it came to Lucas/Peyton...

In season 3, he still didn't really know that well as an person and vice versa, so I really don't see how he could have fallen in love in S2 with as an person. Maybe, if we actually get to see the development instead of the writers just rewriting season 1.

Lucas was only really devoted to Brooke when Peyton wasn't in his life and that's something that was changing since the start of S3. Chad/Sophia's issues started before mid season 3 lol and considering we are talking about the same guy who drove Hilarie because of the way he was treating her and wrote characters off the show because of them refusing his advances, it's extremely hard to buy that he cared about Sophia's feelings at all and the whole little arc with Chris shows that he didn't imo.

Hiding an fugitive and be willing to drop your whole life for an guy you dated for 2 months at most isn't the exactly the actions of an mature person lol. S2 Peyton wasn't that likeable either and her relationship with Jake was an big reason why. We didn't really get to see Peyton falling in love with Jake though, so you can't really see what led to that or not. Considering it was basically gone by the end of S3 from Peyton's side, it definitely went away. Peyton's heart just never wanted Jake as much as her head did.

That would have bothered me more if it wasn't so obvious that the way Lucas actually felt was different. If he truly felt that, he wouldn't have been hanging with Peyton after BL broke up and she wouldn't have had to push him into making an effort to getting Brooke back or otherwise he wouldn't have tried at all.

When you have Lucas been unable to deny that Peyton's not the one for him either, admitting that what they had was always going to be there and his inability to convince his own girlfriend that he didn't have feelings for his ex, LP isn't as one sided as your making it to be.
BL was more one sided because their whole relationship from Luke's end was him saying stuff he didn't truly mean and that's it.

[eternalfate]

^ Well that's how I SAW IT... just like you saw things different. I re-watched season 1-4 probably as much as you have and I just didn't see Lucas feelings of Peyton in season 2-3 at all, and even early season 4 he was fighting for Brooke.
So, for me it just felt like the writers went back to Lucas feelings for Peyton in season 1 and said she's the one he's meant to be with.

As I mentioned we BOTH see things different and clearly none of us are going to change each other's minds. I saw it one way and you saw it the other way.

I really started buying Lucas and Peyton love during season 5. Even if I didn't ship them, I finally started to buy the strong love they shared and of course season 6 showed them as a great pairing who I didn't dislike at all.

I believe BL was on sided in season 1, not season 2-3, I felt if anything it was Brooke's insecurities from what happened in season 1 as what pushed Lucas away.

But to each their own.

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by eternalfate (View Post) ^ Well that's how I SAW IT... just like you saw things different. I re-watched season 1-4 probably as much as you have and I just didn't see Lucas feelings of Peyton in season 2-3 at all, and even early season 4 he was fighting for Brooke. So, for me it just felt like the writers went back to Lucas feelings for Peyton in season 1 and said she's the one he's meant to be with. As I mentioned we BOTH see things different and clearly none of us are going to change each other's minds. I saw it one way and you saw it the other way. I really started buying Lucas and Peyton love during season 5. Even if I didn't ship them, I finally started to buy the strong love they shared and of course season 6 showed them as a great pairing who I didn't dislike at all. I believe BL was on sided in season 1, not season 2-3, I felt if anything it was Brooke's insecurities from what happened in season 1 as what pushed Lucas away. But to each their own.

He never fought that hard for Brooke in S4 and the fact that even Peyton was trying harder to get her back for him is an massive red flag imo. He was always all talk, no action when it came to Brooke though.

Brooke was also insecure about his behaviour in season 3, which was pretty justified since he didn't really care about her insecurities at all and was more concerned about his friendship with Peyton than their relationship. The only difference for me between S1 and 3 BL is that Lucas actually had feelings for her the second time around.

[eternalfate]

^ I felt he was action with Brooke a lot during early season 3.
Brooke was always going to be insecure after season 1, understandably so.

I felt he did care about his relationship with Brooke but wanted to keep his friendship with Peyton which I understood season 2- early 4.

But as I mention, to each their own.

[stlavin95]

Originally Posted by eternalfate (View Post) ^ I felt he was action with Brooke a lot during early season 3. Brooke was always going to be insecure after season 1, understandably so. I felt he did care about his relationship with Brooke but wanted to keep his friendship with Peyton which I understood season 2- early 4. But as I mention, to each their own.

I didn't

It was understandable, but she could have gotten an bit better if Lucas had actually shown her that things were different this time.

He was always putting Peyton first though, so it clearly went above him just wanting to maintain their friendship.

[BlondieLeigh]

I never saw him putting Brooke first, when they were together and when they weren't. There are countless moments showing that, but the most obvious may be just after they got back together and he decided to leave town with Peyton without even bothering to tell Brooke he was going. The only reason he even told her in the end is because Peyton told him to. Brooke was barely even an afterthought to him.

Yep, and she didn't improve because Lucas wasn't able to show her that. That's not her fault at all. His constantly putting Peyton first was always going to bother her and it was always clear that was never going to change.