ravengirl008

Watching season three now and just finished The Chistmakah Barmitzfakah. I still don't see Marissa being in love with Johnny. I see Marissa being who she is wanting to be too over helpful. I think if anything she liked that she could talk to him because Ryan had issues with talking about stuff. I don't see her being in love with Johnny though just liking what she was not getting from Ryan.

~tammy~

I agree. I don't think she was in love with Johnny. Johnny was someone who lent her support when she needed it most and when Ryan or anybody else seem incapable of doing that. He was her first friend in a new school where everyone else was mostly hostile and he was there to listen about Trey and share his own experience. After all of that, Marissa felt close to him but I don't think she ever fell in love with him. Like you said, Marissa in general is always ready to help others. Majority of fandom appears to see this in the worst light but that is not necessarily true by any means. Oliver and Johnny are both quite frustrating storylines to play out but Marissa also shows a great deal of kindness to Ryan, Theresa and Lindsay, frequently at the expense of her own feelings. You can debate with Johnny, that in the process she neglects Ryan and that's not an unfair comment, but fundamentally there isn't any ulterior intent in her friendship with Johnny for her apart from her just helping out a friend who has helped her out a great deal.

baggirl

My problem with that is while Marissa couldn't talk to Ryan and Ryan isn't exactly to blame for it because trey was his brother, Marissa should not ever ever be talking to another guy about it. Least of all Johnny who doesn't know trey and the whole shooting trey incident. If she can't talk to Ryan, she should talk to summer who at least knew the whole history and was actually THERE when Marissa shot trey. If you can't even talk to your bf then there is obviously something wrong here.

~tammy~

I think it's okay for her to talk to Johnny. We aren't told exactly how much she shares, but I don't imagine Marissa would be blabbing the entire history between her, Ryan and Trey. If it's her experience, her emotions, she's free to share that with Johnny imo. I know Summer is there for her but Summer, not for a lack of effort, probably doesn't quite relate sufficiently to be able to help. She can empathise with Marissa but the fact that Johnny had been through something similar probably made a difference. As for being unable to talk to Ryan about it, I don't blame her for it (nor Ryan) given the complexity of the situation. There's so many conflicted feelings there and I imagine she is able to talk to Johnny more easily precisely because he is so seperate from the whole event, he is totally impartial. And it's not that she doesn't want to talk to Ryan, she does. It's clear when she calls him. I do think both are culpable of letting go of the issue too quickly and if they were to end up together, that's a conversation they would need to have.

~Search4Truth~

Keep up the good discussion guys! It's nice when this thread is active.

baggirl

But that's the thing with Marissa.. She is often saying she can talk about stuff to oiliver, Johnny etc. I'm not saying she can't have male friends but she has the tendency to get too close until they misinterpret her friendship as it is happened with Oliver, trey and Johnny. And how does it make Ryan feel, her boyfriend when she was couldn't stop talking about Johnny or oiliver in front of him. Even Ryan called her out on it. It's not that she can't talk to Johnny, but clearly she should know what and when to stop and talk to your boyfriend instead. How would she feel if Ryan started confiding everything with another random girl and can't stop talking about the girl in front of her.

Frankly if I had a friend like her I would have slapped her awake

~tammy~

For me there are some episodes where I really actively feel Marissa needs to disregard Johnny, but on the whole, I don't hold very much of it against her. I can see your point, but ultimately for me, it is harmless from Marissa. The intent is definitely without harm. It's just in her nature to be that kind of person who is constantly trying to help others. Especially with Trey, I don't think she has any fault at all. She was basically helping him because he was Ryan's brother and when she tells Trey no, he has to accept that and his actions there on are his responsibility.

I think with Johnny, part of her prolonged persistence with the friendship is the fact that she probably feels indebted because of his earlier support. And in a sense, if the support he offers helps her get through an incredibly tough time in her life, I can't condemn it entirely. I think the biggest problem was the execution of the entire thing. Johnny was a boring character, the SL played out in a pretty dull manner and so you actively wanted Marissa to ditch him. It made it hard to see a justification for the friendship and the show didn't help by setting it up as a very either or type situation. Like to be Johnny's friend she has to be a bad girlfriend to Ryan and in order to be a good girlfriend she has to stop being friends with these guys. And I don't think it has to be that defined, it can be balanced.

~Search4Truth~

I can agree with this. Especially after Johnny asked her to give him space and stay away from him for a while. She acted like she was hurt by it and then wouldn't stop talking to Ryan about Johnny even when she and Ryan were supposed to be going on a date. Then she wouldn't stay away from Johnny when he asked her to. I think that this is something she hopefully would have worked on had she and Ryan dated again in the future. It is hurtful to the person you are dating to talk to or about another guy as much as she did, and I think she would have figured that out and stopped doing it if they dated in college.

ravengirl008

Alright so Marissa and Ryan clearly had their differences and I can relate to her. She is the type of person who wears her heart on her sleeve and she just needs to talk about what she is feeling that is how she gets through things. She does not mean to upset Ryan by talking about other guys but she needs someone to listen. It seems to me that Summer always has her own stuff going on and it can be hard to talk to her too. I use to get so upset with Marissa and how she would handle things with guys but I have done so much growing since the last time I watched this so this time around I see it from a different perspective and I built the same way as Marissa I completely understand. It's not that she spills her life to complete strangers but that she just needs someone to listen whomever that may be or she will go into self destruct mode and I do the same thing but I am working on that,lol

It makes it really hard for her when she just wants to talk to the one she loves. I get Ryan too though. He just does not know how to talk to her because he is not built that way, he can't really talk about what he is feeling. However he wants to be their for her and he really cares for her he just does not know how to be there for her, he wants to he just can't. This can make it really hard because no matter how much you may love someone when you are someone like Marissa who needs that communication it can make you feel like you are not really cared about trust me I know. I think with some more time though and some more room to grow that Marissa would have learned different ways to deal with what she was feeling and Ryan would have opened up more.

Which leads me to this I just finished up Ryan's eighteenth birthday party episode. I have to say that I am pretty annoyed with him for hanging around Sadie while he was still with Marissa and I get that they were heading for a break up but the fact that he couldn't have at least waited for that before hanging out with Sadie all the time erks me. I mean he is allowed to have friends that are girls but he clearly saw her as more than that. The fact that Sadie didn't try to stop him when he is someone else's boyfriend. However while Marissa self destructs when they break up Ryan always runs to the first available girl he can find to try and hide how he is feeling so these girls would never be anything but rebounds.


Watching them break up was sad and seeing Marissa cry afterwards was heartbreaking because she clearly was still in love with Ryan and always would be. Ryan clearly was still in love with her at the end when they both started to call each other. In my opinion no matter what they did, who they moved on too, they were always going to come back to each other. They just needed to do some more growing. There is a reason why every time it didn't work out with whomever they were seeing they always came back to each other because they knew that is where they belonged. They were home.

P.S. watching Ryan find that CD Marissa made for his birthday and seeing her write Happy Birthday Ryan made me bawl. lol

~Search4Truth~

This reminds me of an RM video I made a couple of years ago.

~tammy~

Basically agree with everything. Well said!

ravengirl008

Thanks Tammy! Sorry for the extremly long post but as I mentioned I am like Marissa and I have to express how I feel.

ManhattanBabe do you have a link to your video?

~Search4Truth~

Sure! Here it is:


And you can call me Theresa.

ravengirl008

Hi Theresa, nice to meet you, you can call me Raven. I loved your video, such a sweet song. Perfect for them really.


I am almost through with season 3 seeing Ryan jump to Marissa's defense when Volchek said he could have her on her back again was another telling sign of his love for her.

~tammy~

Yes, try as he might, Ryan clearly struggled with not caring about Marissa/Volchok.